[mbaxter]

I was looking at RPTV's yesterday and saw what I first thought was a very bulky microdisplay RPTV (because there was no screen glare). I quickly realized it was a Hitachi 57" CRT that had the protective screen removed. I have to say I was impressed!


I had written off RPTV's as a viable option because I can't stand the glare of CRT sets and I'm even more allergic to the SSE that plagues all of the digital microdisplay models.


So between glare and SSE I figured all RPTV's were dead to me.


But with the protective screen removed, I realized that a CRT RPTV can give you an image that's free of both glare AND SSE. Fantastic! My only gripe is sharpness. I ran the "Magic Convergence" or whatever it's called on the Hitachi RPTV's and while it did sharpen the image a bit, overall it was still a lot more blurry that what I'm used to with digital displays. Fantastic contrast, though! And I couldn't complain about the $950 price, either.


While I don't expect any CRT technology to look like a fixed-pixel display, is it at least possible to get a CRT-RPTV to look like, say, my 19" CRT computer monitor? That's plenty sharp enough for me. Or is blurriness just an unavoidable fact of life for these TV's?


Any advice appreciated.

 

[Joe_M]

Properly calibrated, a RPTV should be just as good as any other display. To me, digital displays look artificial.

 

[Wytchone]

Wait a minute. You where able to purchase your unit with the screen removed?

 

[jones07]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wytchone Wait a minute. You where able to purchase your unit with the screen removed?

Tell us more


I was told by a Hitachi csr that the protective screen could not be removed on the F710A's

 

[ClutchBrake]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jones07 Tell us more I was told by a Hitachi csr that the protective screen could not be removed on the F710A's

They can be removed. Just not easily!

 

[mbaxter]

No I didn't buy the TV, I just looked at it in the store. For whatever reasons CC had one of their displays models with the protective screen removed.


I really loved the result but the image was quite blurry, like all CRT RPTV's I've seen. Is this blurriness easy to fix? I'd buy this set in a heartbeat if it were possible to get a sharp image. I'm not expecting fixed-pixel sharpness of course, just a sharpness comparable to a CRT computer monitor.


Is that a pipe dream?

 

[Wytchone]

Oh im sure it can be fixed there are others who have done this after market. I was just amazed that a B&M store would sell a unit sans screen.


It's not a pipe dream but someone with more info on a calibration would have to speak up on a using without a screen.


I know how sharp the PQ is with the screen which is why I love my set

 

[thebigdaddye]

F59 models have the protective screen removed / don't come with one. the picture once set up properly will look nice and sharp. the setting they have it on at the store are way off as i have the 51f59 and it looks great. of course sd dosen't look as nice or good as digital or hd,but i think it is much better then any lcd,lco's dlp in standard def. in my opinion and the digital and hd channels are awesome. you just have to get the settings correct. hope that helps

 

[dont24]

I just had my Hitachi 57F510 ISF'd yesterday and it looks awesome. One of the thing he did was remove the glare screen and it made a huge difference. I don't get any more glare!

 

[Bigguss]

CC had a 57" Hitachi CRT-RPTV for $950? That sounds low. Was at my local CC a couple hours ago, and they wanted $1499 for the Hitachi 57F59 (which I actually thought seemed kind of reasonable.) Was the one you saw a floor model?

 

[Paul33993]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigguss CC had a 57" Hitachi CRT-RPTV for $950? That sounds low. Was at my local CC a couple hours ago, and they wanted $1499 for the Hitachi 57F59 (which I actually thought seemed kind of reasonable.) Was the one you saw a floor model?

It had to be. Also would explain why the screen was removed. And maybe why the picture was still fuzzy after calibration. Someone who had the knowledge of how to remove the screen, surely knew how to calibrate the picture properly. Reason for its return? Pretty good.

 

[mbaxter]

Indeed the set I looked at on Wednesday was a floor model, open-box special. But when I went back to CC today, I saw they also had a brand-new 57F59 on display (priced at $1499), and to my surprise, it too was missing the protective screen. It turns out that both the 51F59 or 57F59 are sold without the protective screen attached!


I'm really, seriously ready to jump into a CRT-RPTV but only one hurdle remains: sharpness. Even the brand-new 57F59 that I looked at was blurry compared to all the other displays. Magic auto-convergence didn't help.


I want to get a CRT-RPTV but this one aspect is holding me back. I don't care about size, I don't need extreme brightness, I don't give a damn about 1080p or any of that nonsense. Heck, I'm not even worried about burn in. But I can't live with a blurry image.


I don't need or want ISF calibration. I'm happy with doing my own adjustments to brigthness, contrast, and colors. I assume the blurriness inherent to all RP-CRT's is due to focus? Well can I focus the thing myself, without paying someone $400 to do it every year?

 

[ogbuehi]

There is a way to do it yourself in the service menu. You just have to find somebody who knows how to do it, and it willing to explain it to you. Otherwise you might as well plan on getting it ISF'ed.

 

[DavidHir]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbaxter Indeed the set I looked at on Wednesday was a floor model, open-box special. But when I went back to CC today, I saw they also had a brand-new 57F59 on display (priced at $1499), and to my surprise, it too was missing the protective screen. It turns out that both the 51F59 or 57F59 are sold without the protective screen attached! I'm really, seriously ready to jump into a CRT-RPTV but only one hurdle remains: sharpness. Even the brand-new 57F59 that I looked at was blurry compared to all the other displays. Magic auto-convergence didn't help. I want to get a CRT-RPTV but this one aspect is holding me back. I don't care about size, I don't need extreme brightness, I don't give a damn about 1080p or any of that nonsense. Heck, I'm not even worried about burn in. But I can't live with a blurry image. I don't need or want ISF calibration. I'm happy with doing my own adjustments to brigthness, contrast, and colors. I assume the blurriness inherent to all RP-CRT's is due to focus? Well can I focus the thing myself, without paying someone $400 to do it every year?

ALL brand new CRT RPTV need focus work. Manual and Electro Focus is definitely key to what you want. This is something you can do yourself with some research. It's not hard to do. However, it will alter your grayscale as the "throw" of color changes. Doing a manual convergence is also just as important. These two things greatly affect picture sharpness and visibl detail.


You don't need to spend $400 every year on a professional calibration. Most reputable calibrators may charge that price the first time, then every year or two perform a tune-up for half of the amount (or less).


I will say there is no way you can get the set looking as good as it potentially can without a professional who knows your set.

 

[mbaxter]

ogbuehi, DavidHir - could you guys give me more specific information? I really want to get into this game but I'm leery of ISF calibration, not because of the cost, but because I don't trust that I can find a good calibrator in Oklahoma City. I really want to do this myself. If all I have to do is manually focus the guns, that sounds do-able.


But can you guys give me some more hints? Point me in the right direction perhaps? How would I find out how to get into the service menu and also how to manually adjust the focus? This information isn't readily available.


thanks

 

[John Mason]

Quote:

ALL brand new CRT RPTV need focus work. Manual and Electro Focus is definitely key to what you want. This is something you can do yourself with some research. It's not hard to do. However, it will alter your grayscale as the "throw" of color changes.

Gray scale shouldn't be altered unless someone adjusts the wrong controls. User convergence adjustments for the red, green, blue beams doesn't influence gray scale but just ensures the beams converge at the same point. Recently tweaked the matchbox-size focus/screen controls inside my 64" Philips RPTV. The 3 screen (grid) pots would influence gray scale, but the labeled focus pots do not. Also performed an optical tweaking of the three lenses after loosening a wingnut--and cleaned all the optics, except the front screen. Overall, after a ~6-year cleaning/adjustment delay!, noticed just a slight improvement in picture contrast. The service CDROM I bought initially with my set provides some procedures for tweaking. -- John

 

[mbaxter]

I sure hope this manual focus is a really dramatic difference; I'm still so skeptical! Every RP-CRT I've seen was so blurry. This is one hell of a leap of faith for me.


By the way, does anyone know how to get into the Hitachi 51F59 service menu?

 

[azmark]

What is the demo they are showing? Most CRT based RP should be 95%+ converged out of the box. I've never got mine professionaly tuned up and am happy enough with it. I was amazed how good it looked after CC shiped it and set it up. Is it as sharp as a DLP or LCD? No, but it is a very good picture. Would not consider it fuzzy or blurry at all.

 

[schticker]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wytchone Oh im sure it can be fixed there are others who have done this after market. I was just amazed that a B&M store would sell a unit sans screen.

CC and BB always come up with these anomolous products. Could be another case of CC selling a slightly different model that did't come with a shield, who knows...

 

[mehulkapadia]

The Hitachi 51F59 has 3 different types of convergence through the regular menu - 1. Magic focus Auto Convergence, 2. 9 point convergence (manual) and 3. 117 point convergence (manual).

Does anyone know if the manual methods give as good or similar results to getting it professionally ISF calibrated?

I really want to get this great deal from CC, but dont want to end up spending 400 bucks on calibration later!

Thanks.