AVS Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
504 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Has anyone compared a good CRT, such as a Sony G70q, to a newer DLP such as the Nec LT150?


I currently own a g70 and would like to know if it would be detrimental to switch to a DLP, or if the picture might be better. Any input would be appreciated.


Thanks,

Cary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
733 Posts
Cary,


I haven't seen the G70, (I have seen some other Sony CRTs) but somehow I think what you're seeing is about as good as it gets! Why in the world would you want something else?


Yes, DLPs are getting better and offer convenience that CRTs don't, but it's pretty tough for any other projector system to match the contrast and shadow delination of a good CRT.


The price of the LT150 has dropped through the floor, I presume in anticipation of the new LT150z. Why don't you keep your G70 and try a LT150 and see for yourself (buy from a vendor who will let you return it if you don't like it). If you sell the G70 your lose will probably be more that what the LT150 costs!


The LT150 is the perfect projector for the rest of us to own while we wait for the perfect one.


Better check out your sensitivity to "rainbow" before you buy any DLP projector.


Cheers,


Grant
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
504 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I was venturing down other avenues due to space constraints. The g70 has 8" guns and produces a great picture, just with any CRT it is huge, and looks like a motorhome air-conditioner hanging from my livingroom ceiling. I do not have controlled light, I have to wait for the sun to go down!! But if the picture still surpasses the digital units, I will stick with the g70.


Thanks for your replys.


Cary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,836 Posts
Quote:
Yes, DLPs are getting better and offer convenience that CRTs don't, but it's pretty tough for any other projector system to match the contrast and shadow delination of a good CRT.
A CRT will beat a DLP for contrast at low spacial frequencies but what about higher frequencies?

I suspect that DLP maintains its contrast all the way up to the limit of its resolution but a CRT loses contrast as the spacial frequencies rise.


Frank
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,564 Posts
If a high end crt has a video bandwidth of, say, 150mhz, why would it lose contrast at hdtv frequencies?


------------------

Alex
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,836 Posts
The beam current of a CRT can not be switched on and off in zero time, obviously. A phosphor can not go from max output to zero output in zero time either.

This causes a gradual rise and fall on transients that reduces the effective contrast. As the spacial frequency (resolution) goes up, this transient response becomes a larger and large factor.


Frank
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
735 Posts
I think frank has a good point, but my guess would be that its effect will be more subtle. The eye's perception might view the lesser contrast of CRTs at high frequencies as "good enough" whereas the lower frequency contrast difference would be very noticeable.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
504 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
The only problem that I have with the CRT is the size and light output. I have to turn the contrast and brightness down to achieve good blacks and shadowing, but this results in daylight scenes looking dim.


My room has fairly uncontrolled light conditions with white walls, but it gets rather dark at night, as there are no streetlights. Would painting the walls darker or covering them with dark curtains help much?


Has anyone encountered a similar problem, if so what was your fix??


Thanks again,


Cary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
If you have that much light spillage into your room, even a good DLP probably won't give you enough light to make viewing satisfying.

Stick with your CRT!

I take it you can't place heavy curtains over your windows for some reason (wife, for example...).


Happy viewing,

Robert


------------------

Robert Clark

See our home theater (with very poor quality pics!)
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/Album...874&a=12744078
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
453 Posts
If you've enjoyed the picture quality of CRTs, I don't think anything less than a DILA is going to give you the same satisfaction. Dean McManis and Mark Rejhon (both knowledgeable people with respect to CRTs) had pretty good CRT setups when they changed, and they went for DILA. Having done the same, I think they are on to something.


Al
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
388 Posts
Quote:
Originally posted by Robert Clark:
If you have that much light spillage into your room, even a good DLP probably won't give you enough light to make viewing satisfying.

Stick with your CRT!
What??!! IMO, that's exactly bass-ackwards.


Having high ambient light levels coming in from windows in your room is precisely the sort of thing that could make DLP (or LCD or DILA) preferable to your CRT, even though the CRT would look better in total darkness.


If you can't remove all or nearly all ambient light, then you're never going to be able to take full advantage of your CRT. In that case, why not switch to a digital projector that will still give a much-closer-to-optimal picture in your ambient light levels (even though the digital optimal is lower than your CRT optimal).


I don't think anyone can tell you what's going to look better in your room. But I can tell you that as your ambient light levels go up, the image quality advantage of a CRT over a digital projector shrinks and at some point the advantage goes over to a digital projector. It will all vary, of course, according to the lumens output and overall quality of the DLP/DILA/LCD that you're talking about. But there's some level of ambient light at which you would definitely start to prefer the digital picture, because the extra brightness of digital will keep it from being washed out as much by the ambient light. You should demo a projector in your room to compare and find out if the ambient light you have is anywhere near that point. (Or get some velvet curtains over the windows to block all the ambient light to take full advantage of your CRT, but that could prove to be a cumbersome option.) -- Herb
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
504 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
To all:


Would changing the color of the room, from white to a coffee color help?


I have a modern house with all light and neutral colors, so dark curtains would look out of place.


Thanks,


Cary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
453 Posts
You're going to have to decide whether black levels are very important to you or not. Without controlled lighting, the best your blacks will appear is the color of your screen with all the lights off. This is with your CRTs; it will be worse with any digital projector. What the digital projector will give you is brighter whites, so your eyes will give you the impression that you are looking at black when it is really gray (ie, contrast ratio effect). If you don't want to introduce yet another variable to contend with (color reflections), painting the room a shade of gray would be better than coffee, but that might clash with your interior decoration or significant other.


Al
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,014 Posts
If you cannot (or do not) want to eliminate most all ambient

light then I absolutely agree with everything Herb (hsitz)

says. That's a prerequisite to using a CRT projector.

A digital imaging projector (DILA or DLP) is a better choice

if you want to have ambient light in your viewing room. And

it's a better choice if you want to use a very large screen. And, additionally, it's a better choice if you want a compact sized projector that is plug and play convenient to use.


However, I have not yet seen a digital projector (DLP or DILA) which equals the sheer overall image quality of my CRT projectors. Believe me when I say that I wish we could have all these qualities in one solution. Maybe that will be available to us someday.


Bob


------------------

~ The Sultan of Cheap ~
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
Quote:
Originally posted by hsitz:
What??!! IMO, that's exactly bass-ackwards.


Having high ambient light levels coming in from windows in your room is precisely the sort of thing that could make DLP (or LCD or DILA) preferable to your CRT, even though the CRT would look better in total darkness.


If you can't remove all or nearly all ambient light, then you're never going to be able to take full advantage of your CRT. In that case, why not switch to a digital projector that will still give a much-closer-to-optimal picture in your ambient light levels (even though the digital optimal is lower than your CRT optimal).


I don't think anyone can tell you what's going to look better in your room. But I can tell you that as your ambient light levels go up, the image quality advantage of a CRT over a digital projector shrinks and at some point the advantage goes over to a digital projector. It will all vary, of course, according to the lumens output and overall quality of the DLP/DILA/LCD that you're talking about. But there's some level of ambient light at which you would definitely start to prefer the digital picture, because the extra brightness of digital will keep it from being washed out as much by the ambient light. You should demo a projector in your room to compare and find out if the ambient light you have is anywhere near that point. (Or get some velvet curtains over the windows to block all the ambient light to take full advantage of your CRT, but that could prove to be a cumbersome option.) -- Herb
My point is, if he is going to watch his projector, in the daytime, with open windows and no curtains, then it is not going to behoove him to throw away his CRT for a DLP/LCD.

No projector is going to look good under those conditions, and it is way past the point of "tradeoffs" between black level brightness and quality.


Robert


------------------

Robert Clark

See our home theater (with very poor quality pics!)
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/Album...874&a=12744078
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,652 Posts
In terms of painting the walls a darker color-that helps alot. My walls were off white and now they are "chimney sweep" and the improvement was very significant. The light no longer bounces back onto the screen washing it out and perceptually your eyes have a dark frame of reference around the screen which appears to give it more contrast and pop as well. Even when I was using the Mits X390 with 2200 lumens-I always turn the lights off.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,014 Posts
I don't challenge anything Frank or anyone else says about

the technical nature of these things (frankly because I have no knowledge when it comes to that).


But I have now owned four DLP projectors (Infocus LP340, Davis DL450 clone, NEC LT100 and an old nView model which doesn't count) as well as a great many CRT projectors. I've

viewed all types of sources extensively with all of these. Speaking strictly from a viewing perspective I have not found anything lacking with the CRT image (including contrast at higher resolutions).


Bob



------------------

~ The Sultan of Cheap ~
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,014 Posts
Actually I wholeheatedly agree with you too, Robert (and

Lenny as well). Trying to do front projection when there is ambient light is just a big mistake. Yes, it's easier to see the image with more lumens of light output. But with ambient room light reflecting off the screen, that image is not really worth watching (not to me anyway).


For me there are two axioms for home theater...


1. Front projection requires room light set to full off


AND


2. More color is not always better color.


Bob



------------------

~ The Sultan of Cheap ~




[This message has been edited by RobertWood (edited 07-17-2001).]
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top