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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here are several progressive scan Custom Timing and Resolution strings for the ATi Radeon card, created with Powerstrip 3.30 build 366 and Catalyst 3.1 WinXP ATi drivers, Radeon 9500pro card and displayed on a Mitsubishi W55819 1080i 16x9 HDTV. All are 1080i/ 540p based timings. Scan rate is exactly 33.75KHz, refresh rate is 59.94Hz and vertical line total is 563 for all resolutions. Please note I currently use an ATi HDTV adapter. If you use the ATi HDTV adapter read the notes further in this guide. These timings also worked with a VGA breakout cable connected to the RGBHV inputs of my Mits, and a Key Digital VTCA-2 Transcoder connected to the YPbPr inputs.
BE AWARE THAT NO TWO MODELS OF HDTV WORK EXACTLY ALIKE. FOR EXAMPLE, MY MITS LIKES TO SEE A SCAN RATE OF 33.75KHZ, WHEREAS SOME MODELS, LIKE HITACHI, PREFERS A SCAN RATE CLOSER TO 33.5KHZ. IF YOU HAVE ISSUES WITH ONE SCAN RATE, TRY THE OTHER.

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Copy the entire Powerstrip timing parameters listed below, one resolution at a time. Then, in PS 3--display profiles--advanced timings--custom resolutions--user defined, click the paste button, which will add the copied values, and then click add. Powerstrip will tell you if the display driver has accepted the new resolution. You may be promted to reboot first. If so, you will restart at your previous resolution, so you will have to manually switch to the new resolution. Enter the advanced timings screen and adjust as needed. Common first time tweaks include positioning and adjusting for horizontal over/underscan. Remember, to use your new custom T & R, make sure you set Powerstrip 3 (options---preferences) to start up with Windows AND apply settings at start up. Use at your own risk.
For more info on how to use Powerstrip, see the update at the end of this post.

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PowerStrip timing parameters: Desktop 4x3

640x480p=640,152,48,176,480,28,1,54,34290,272


Generic timing details for 640x480:

HFP=152 HSW=48 HBP=176 kHz=34 VFP=28 VSW=1 VBP=54 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 1

720x480p=720,76,40,100,480,29,1,53,31590,272


Generic timing details for 720x480:

HFP=76 HSW=40 HBP=100 kHz=34 VFP=29 VSW=1 VBP=53 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: Desktop Widescreen 1

848x480p=848,88,48,120,480,28,1,54,37260,272


Generic timing details for 848x480:

HFP=88 HSW=48 HBP=120 kHz=34 VFP=28 VSW=1 VBP=54 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: Desktop Widescreen 2

856x480p=856,87,48,121,480,28,1,54,37530,272


Generic timing details for 856x480:

HFP=87 HSW=48 HBP=121 kHz=34 VFP=28 VSW=1 VBP=54 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 1.5

1080x480p=1080,108,48,164,480,29,1,53,47250,272


Generic timing details for 1080x480:

HFP=108 HSW=48 HBP=164 kHz=34 VFP=29 VSW=1 VBP=53 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 2

1440x480p=1440,144,80,208,480,29,1,53,63180,272


Generic timing details for 1440x480:

HFP=144 HSW=80 HBP=208 kHz=34 VFP=29 VSW=1 VBP=53 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

-----------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 2.5

1800x480p=1800,154,96,246,480,32,1,50,77490,272


Generic timing details for 1800x480:

HFP=154 HSW=96 HBP=246 kHz=34 VFP=32 VSW=1 VBP=50 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 540p

1800x540p=1800,148,96,244,540,7,1,15,77220,272


Generic timing details for 1800x540:

HFP=148 HSW=96 HBP=244 kHz=34 VFP=7 VSW=1 VBP=15 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 540p

1920x540p=1920,161,104,255,540,7,1,15,82350,272


Generic timing details for 1920x540:

HFP=161 HSW=104 HBP=255 kHz=34 VFP=7 VSW=1 VBP=15 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

960x540p=960,98,48,142,540,7,1,15,42120,272


Generic timing details for 960x540:

HFP=98 HSW=48 HBP=142 kHz=34 VFP=7 VSW=1 VBP=15 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

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POWERSTRIP FINE TUNING

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To get an exact scan rate of 33.75Khz, go to the "advanced timings screen", type "33.75" in the horizontal scan rate box and press the TAB button on the keyboard. This will set the scan rate exactly to 33.75KHz and also adjust the refresh rate accordingly. If your scan rate is 33.75KHz and your vertical line total is 563, then your refresh rate should be 59.947Hz

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If you find your desktop has black bars on the sides (underscan), or has a bit too much overscan (image cropping), simply go back to the advanced timings screen and adjust the horizontal front/back porches using the size control buttons: To reduce horizontal overscan, increase the horizontal front/back porches. To increase horizontal overscan, reduce the horizontal front/back porches.

Before making overscan adjustments, click the "lock scan frequencies" button in the advanced timings screen. Now you can make realtime adjustments while keeping the scan rate and refresh rate locked. You'll probably find that a couple of clicks on the horizontal size control buttons will do the trick.

Do NOT use this method for vertical adjustments as it will change your vertical line total and your set could lose sync after a click or two.

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Keep the progressive vertical line total at 563 (interlaced 1125).

You don't have any range of vertical sizing adjustment, only positioning. To compensate for vertical underscan, it is best to create a custom resolution and add more lines to the vertical line total since the range of adjustment is limited. Try to maintain a 16x9 aspect ratio when you add to the line total. Example: if 848x480p is underscanned, try a custom resolution of 888x500p, using the same timings. To compensate for vertical overscan, adjust using the service menus of your set.


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It is also important to note that the monitor you specify in Windows must be capable of resolving the resolutions you present to the display driver in progressive scan mode. I have used the Sony GDM-W900 monitor drivers because it has a max resolution of >1920x1200p as listed in Powerstrip 3 monitor profiles. Make sure to "disable plug & play monitors". Selecting a high-resolution monitor will also help avoid "virtual desktop", or a side scrolling desktop. Powerstrip will allow you to create your own custom monitor driver. I made a driver for my Mits HDTV based on the Sony specs and is attached later in this thread. If you are having trouble activating high resolutions, try double-clicking on the monitor icon next to the resolution slider in the Display profiles screen, and Powerstrip will attempt to uncap rez restrictions. When using the ATI HDTV adapter, it takes priority over any monitor driver you have selected.

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I use 856x480p @ 540p timings (posted above) for best 16x9 desktop results. The sides are perfect on my set with less than half of the title bar and task bar cropped, quite manageable IMO. Your results may differ depending on your sets' overscan. Try large icons and a Windows Standard -large- Appearance for a smooth, easy to read desktop and a neutral grey desktop color for even tube wear. There are also utilities available to hide the desktop and mouse completely, such as Icon Hider and BZ (mouse) Hider . Powerstrip now features desktop and mouse blanking as well. There are several Front End programs available as well, I prefer MyHTPC.

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ATi HDTV ADAPTER TIMINGS

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I can get the following resolutions to work (at 540p/1080i timings)

with the ATi HDTV adapter:

640x480p

720x480p

856x480p

1776x1000i

1920x1080i
UPDATE: Catalyst 4.2 drivers now feature Center Timing Mode, which allows for more standard Windows resolutions to be displayed. Catalyst 4.6 has custom resolution support for the adapter. Be careful making timing adjustments in Powerstrip, as the adapter seems to want a specific horizontal sync width value, and strange things happen if you deviate very far....the black levels change, making it difficult to calibrate, along with picture distortion during DVD playback. Many of the interlaced resolutions listed below now work with CTM enabled.
YMMV

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Powerstrip dongle 540P/1080i custom timings:

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

640x480p HDTV adapter=640,143,48,169,480,28,1,54,33750,272


Generic timing details for 640x480:

HFP=143 HSW=48 HBP=169 kHz=34 VFP=28 VSW=1 VBP=54 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

-------------------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

720x480p HDTV adapter=720,72,48,88,480,29,1,53,31320,272


Generic timing details for 720x480:

HFP=72 HSW=48 HBP=88 kHz=34 VFP=29 VSW=1 VBP=53 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

-------------------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

856x480p HDTV adapter=856,88,48,120,480,28,1,54,37530,272


Generic timing details for 856x480:

HFP=88 HSW=48 HBP=120 kHz=34 VFP=28 VSW=1 VBP=54 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

1776x1000i HDTV adapter=1776,136,48,240,1000,42,5,78,74250,280


Generic timing details for 1776x1000:

HFP=136 HSW=48 HBP=240 kHz=34 VFP=42 VSW=5 VBP=78 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

1920x1080i=1920,169,56,295,1080,2,5,38,82350,280


Generic timing details for 1920x1080:

HFP=169 HSW=56 HBP=295 kHz=34 VFP=2 VSW=5 VBP=38 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------------------

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I cannot stress this point enough: test on your PC monitor first, get a stable picture with acceptable values, connect to your HDTV, then adjust as needed.
As always, results may vary according to manufacturer.

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Here are several UPDATED interlaced custom T & R strings for the ATi Radeon card, created with Powerstrip 3.30 build 366 and Catalyst 3.1 WinXP ATi drivers, Radeon 9500pro, and displayed on a Mitsubishi W55819 1080i 16x9 HDTV. Scan rate is 33.75KHz and refresh rate is 30Hz for all resolutions. Most of these should work with Center Timing Mode enabled (1776x1000i being the exception).
***Interlaced overlay support (VGA) is fixed with Catalyst 3.4 drivers***Center Timing Mode requires Catalyst 4.2 or higher***

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

800x600i=800,279,56,329,600,250,1,274,49410,280


Generic timing details for 800x600:

HFP=279 HSW=56 HBP=329 kHz=34 VFP=250 VSW=1 VBP=274 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

-------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

1024x768i=1024,164,56,220,768,160,1,196,49410,280


Generic timing details for 1024x768:

HFP=164 HSW=56 HBP=220 kHz=34 VFP=160 VSW=1 VBP=196 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

--------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

1152x864i=1152,190,112,218,864,112,1,148,56430,280


Generic timing details for 1152x864:

HFP=190 HSW=112 HBP=218 kHz=34 VFP=112 VSW=1 VBP=148 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

1280x720i=1280,125,120,139,720,180,1,224,56160,280


Generic timing details for 1280x720:

HFP=125 HSW=120 HBP=139 kHz=34 VFP=180 VSW=1 VBP=224 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

1280x768i=1280,138,96,166,768,156,1,200,56700,280


Generic timing details for 1280x768:

HFP=138 HSW=96 HBP=166 kHz=34 VFP=156 VSW=1 VBP=200 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

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PowerStrip timing parameters:

1280x960i=1280,128,96,160,960,44,1,120,56160,280


Generic timing details for 1280x960:

HFP=128 HSW=96 HBP=160 kHz=34 VFP=44 VSW=1 VBP=120 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

1280x1024i=1280,127,96,161,1024,43,3,55,56160,280


Generic timing details for 1280x1024:

HFP=127 HSW=96 HBP=161 kHz=34 VFP=43 VSW=3 VBP=55 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

----------------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

1440x960i=1440,140,104,180,960,60,1,104,62910,280


Generic timing details for 1440x960:

HFP=140 HSW=104 HBP=180 kHz=34 VFP=60 VSW=1 VBP=104 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

------------------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

1600x900i=1600,159,80,249,900,89,3,133,70470,280


Generic timing details for 1600x900:

HFP=159 HSW=80 HBP=249 kHz=34 VFP=89 VSW=3 VBP=133 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

-----------------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

1776x1000i=1776,166,88,274,1000,44,5,76,77760,280


Generic timing details for 1776x1000:

HFP=166 HSW=88 HBP=274 kHz=34 VFP=44 VSW=5 VBP=76 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

------------------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters:

1920x1080i=1920,169,56,295,1080,2,5,38,82350,280


Generic timing details for 1920x1080:

HFP=169 HSW=56 HBP=295 kHz=34 VFP=2 VSW=5 VBP=38 Hz=30

interlace +hsync +vsync

-----------------------------------------------------------

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Ok, by popular request here are some 480p based timings for 4x3 HD sets for the ATi Radeon card. These basically emulate a 480p progressive scan DVD player. They were created on a 16x9 Mitsubishi HDTV in 480p mode and in 4x3 horizontal squeeze mode, so you might have to adjust for horizontal overscan and positioning relative to your own set.

Timings are exactly 31.5KHz scan rate and 60Hz refresh rate for all resolutions.

There is some vertical overscan, but it's not too bad.
Use at your own risk.

-------------------------------------------------------

480p timings-----Radeon Catalyst 2.5 drivers

-------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: Desktop 4x3

640x480p=640,55,96,57,480,11,5,29,26712,272


Generic timing details for 640x480:

HFP=55 HSW=96 HBP=57 kHz=32 VFP=11 VSW=5 VBP=29 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

-------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 1

720x480p=720,67,96,85,480,21,5,19,30492,272


Generic timing details for 720x480:

HFP=67 HSW=96 HBP=85 kHz=32 VFP=21 VSW=5 VBP=19 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

--------------------------------------------------------

PowerStrip timing parameters: DVD 2

1440x480p=1440,118,144,218,480,13,5,27,60480,272


Generic timing details for 1440x480:

HFP=118 HSW=144 HBP=218 kHz=32 VFP=13 VSW=5 VBP=27 Hz=60

+hsync +vsync

--------------------------------------------------------

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UPDATE: TIPS ON USING POWERSTRIP FOR THE FIRST TIME:


Creating a custom resolution in PowerStrip is actually very easy, but you must have a graphics card that supports user-defined, custom resolutions, and you must know what custom resolution and timing your monitor needs.

These are the prerequisites:


A. You must be using a Matrox G-series, Parhelia, NVidia, 3dfx or ATI Radeon graphics card, with the latest driver. At this time, no other graphics chips or drivers allow custom, user-defined resolutions. Put another way: S3, SiS, Trident, Intel, and ATI Rage and Rage128 users should go no further - you are limited to the resolutions you find in Display properties. REMEMBER THE TIMINGS LISTED ABOVE ARE RADEON SPECIFIC. DO NOT USE THEM ON A GEFORCE CARD.


B. Go to Windows Display properties > Settings, and check the maximum resolution you are allowed there. There is no point in trying to create a custom resolution that *exceeds* this resolution. If the maximum is 1600x1200, don't bother with 1920x1080; if the maximum is 1280x1024, forget 1400x1050. To raise the maximum, you must tell Windows - and your display driver - that your monitor can support the resolution you want to create. Sometimes it is enough to change your monitor type in Windows Display properties > Settings > Advanced > Monitor, and sometimes some driver specific switches need to be set. TRY DOUBLE CLICKING ON THE MONITOR ICON NEXT TO THE RESOLUTION SLIDER IN THE DISPLAY PROFILES SCREEN TO UNCAP RESOLUTION RESTRICITONS.


C. You must know the resolution your monitor wants, and you must understand that not all resolutions are possible. In particular, note that graphics cards generally do horizontal timings in character clocks of 8 pixels, not individual pixels. Unless you have a Matrox Parhelia or early Kyro, your desired horizontal resolution should be evenly divisible by 8, and your vertical resolution should be an even number. If you have a plasma or LCD display that wants 1366 or 852 pixels, you will need to settle for slightly more or less. And modern graphics controllers generate interlaced resolutions with great reluctance or not at all - use progressive resolutions like 960x540p instead of 1920x1080i wherever and whenever possible. ALL THE T & R's LISTED ABOVE WORK ON MY MITS HDTV.


D. You either need to have a multisync monitor that accepts VESA timings, or you need to know the exact timing your monitor wants, or you need to be prepared for a lot of trial-and-error experimentation. All HDTVs, for example, claim support for 1080i - but no two HDTVs are actually alike or look perfect with the industry standard 1080i timing definition. If you don't know what timing your monitor wants, check with others who have the same model as you.


E. Finally, and needless to say, make sure your computer is working properly at 640x480 before you try to add more complexity to it. Don't try to set up a second head/monitor until the 1st head/monitor works very well. If you have a HDTV, set up with a regular monitor before connecting the HDTV. And remember the PowerStrip safe mode hot key - Ctrl+Alt+S by default - in case you run into trouble.

If these 5 conditions are met and understood, you create a custom resolution by following the steps below:


1. PowerStrip menu > Display profiles > Configure > Advanced timing options > Custom resolutions


2. Scroll thru the list of pre-defined resolutions to see if the one you want is already in there - if it is select it, and jump to step 4.


3. If it isn't, enter the resolution you want in the "Active pixels" properties and then adjust the timing parameters in the following order: front porch, sync width, back porch. Only after those parameters are set should you change the refresh rate values. And remember that all these values are interdependent - change one and another will necessarily change. IN THE CASE OF THIS GUIDE, SIMPLY COPY THE TIMING STRINGS AND CLICK THE PASTE BUTTON, AND THE VALUES WILL BE ENTERED AUTOMATICALLY.


4. Click "Add new resolution" and follow the instructions on screen - you will normally need to reboot to see if the resolution was accepted.


5. When Windows restarts, you will still be at the old resolution - go to Windows Display properties > Settings and see if the new resolution is now listed. Note that under XP only resolutions of 800x600 and higher will be listed - if yours is below that, click Advanced > List all modes to see if its there. If it isn't go back and make sure the prerequisites are met. If it is listed - *don't* select it... yet.


6. Make sure PowerStrip is loaded - PowerStrip isn't needed for the resolution, but it may be needed to enforce the timings you specified. Go to PowerStrip menu > Display profiles > Configure and select the resolution and then click "Apply"


7. If the screen syncs and you can see it, jump to step 8. If the screen goes blank, do absolutely nothing - PowerStrip will revert to your old resolution in seconds. OR PRESS THE ESC BUTTON. Then go back to Step 3 above and change your timing parameters - the ones you used before are wrong.


8. If you can see the screen, chances are it is less than perfect and needs fine tuning - click Advanced timing options, and make the necessary adjustments there, keeping in mind that the values here are interdepedent. SEE THE SECTION ABOVE REGARDING CORRECTING FOR OVERSCAN.
 

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Echoing what thorr said...great to see you back, as well as bringing back this thread which I attempted to link to a few times in vain recently
 

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Stick around... and HAPPY NEW YEAR !!!
 

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Awesome , so very happy to see you back Karnis
!!!

-- And thank you for the Update !

--- Jason Berg
 

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Welcome back & happy new year.
 

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Yea! Karnis.... You-da-Man!


Cheers, and A Happy New Year.


Tp, in Torrance
 

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That's great information, thanks for putting it all together!


Maybe this is a little OT for this post, but I'm a little confused about what is going on when you are running a specific resolution at some timing (ie 1080i timing). What is really going on here, does the tv think it is receiving a 1080i signal but you are really running at a different resolution.

Also, the TV I am considering will take 720p signals, do any of these powerstrip settings apply to that, or do I need settings for running at "720p timings"?


Thanks!

Tim
 

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Mr.Pibb,

If you are considering a Sony RPTV it should take the standard 1280x720p timing in powerstrip.

(atleast mine does anyway)

I will say that I don't use this timing much because the picture is pretty fuzzy.


Hope this helps
 

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Qyv10,


Actually I was looking at the Toshiba 34HDX82. It's the only widescreen directview that will fit in my current entertainment center. It is hard enough convincing the wife that we should spend $2k on a tv without trying to get her to replace our custom entertainment center! It accepts 480i/p, 720p (upconverted to 1080i), and 1080i. What resolution do you use that doesn't look fuzzy? It's got to be better than the s-video to SD TV I'm using now!


Thanks,

Tim
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·

Quote:
Originally posted by Mr.Pibb
What is really going on here, does the tv think it is receiving a 1080i signal but you are really running at a different resolution.

Also, the TV I am considering will take 720p signals, do any of these powerstrip settings apply to that, or do I need settings for running at "720p timings"?

Thanks!

Tim

HDTVs could care less about resolutions per se.....they want scan rates and refresh rates they can accept. So you are correct in your assumption...you are running a given resolution (848x480p, 1440x480p, etc) but with Powerstrip you are locking these resolutions at 33.75KHz scan rate and 59.94Hz refresh rate, 1080i-HDTV-safe timings.

If your set will display 720p (not just accept and convert to 1080i), then yes, you should work with resolutions using 720p timings.
 

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Mr.Pibb,

I generally use 1440x540p for the satellite thru the H3D.

I use 1440x480p for DVD (TT 1.5)

I use 900x500 for computer desktop, no overscan.

I only use 1280x720p for computer when I need to hit the "OK" button on screens that don't fit the 500 vert. lines, I switch to 720 then hit the OK then back to 900x500.


btw My sony accepts 720 but DOWNconverts it to 480p.

I don't really understand why it is so fuzzy given the downconvert.

I would think it should look great since it is starting with more info and removing some rather then creating info in the case of upconvert.


Karnis, any idea on this?

Also it's nice to see you here again and thank you for your work on the powerstrip timings.

They have helped me out
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Downconverting will always look like crap. You are removing 1.5x of the vertical resolution. I'm surprised it doesn't convert to 1080i!
 

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This is the best resource I've found on these forums (and that's saying a lot!) So I'm very happy to see it continuing. Thank you Karnis.


matt
 

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Is there some reason the 1440x480 timings are missing and only 1400x480 and 1800x480 are included? I have found 1440 to be a sweet-spot on my display.


matt
 

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Karnis,

For some reason Sony decided to have the HW series downconvert and have the XBR series upconvert.


Typical Sony
 

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Excellent information. I can't get the interlaced resolutions to work and I think it's probably because my current monitor driver is the "default monitor" driver in Windows XP. I can't find the Sony GDM-W900 monitor driver (Windows XP SP1). Can anyone point me to it, or would Karnis be kind enough to share his custom driver (I'm using a Mitsubishi WS-65909)?
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·

Quote:
Originally posted by wormzer
Is there some reason the 1440x480 timings are missing and only 1400x480 and 1800x480 are included? I have found 1440 to be a sweet-spot on my display.


matt

Sorry, typo on my part. 1440x480p has been added.
 
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