[alwayswanting]

I have basically given up on upconverting dvd players and am now looking for a solid dvd player that will give me a great picture on a CRT. I have yet to try the 2910 so that is why it is included in the list. Which would you recommend for a Sony 34HS20? The denon 2900, 2910, Panasonic rp82 (used), or the xp30? Any help/recomendations would be appreciated

 

[iblumberg]

If you plan to use component video at 480p, then the Panasonic RP82, XP30, XP50, and Denon 1600 units all seem like winners. I have been using an RP82 for about 1.5 years and have been very happy with it. The knock on the RP82 is the reportedly weak motor that tends to wear out relatively quickly. Folks who seem to know claim that the XP30 and XP50 motors are better.


I just got the Denon 2910 specifically for its upscaling capability. It is built much more solidly than any of the other players mentioned and appears to have lots more metal in the case and chasis. Of course for 1.5x to 2.5x the price, it better have some improvements ;-)


I'm happy with the 2910, but do think hard about whether the $400 price difference is worth it.


Ira

 

[blgentry]

Also remember that the 2900 has both superior image quality *and* a video buffer that prevents you from seeing layer changes. Before anyone gets in a huff and starts quoting Secrets benchmarks, the image quality I'm refering to is the analog video quality, not the deinterlacer tests that Secrets do. The 2900 is visually superior in analog video.


The transport on the 2900 is also lightning fast, which is a major plus in my book. I should disclaim myself and say:


I own a 2900 and love it. I've never had the exact Panasonic models mentioned above in my system, but I have had (for several weeks) a Yamaha 2300, which uses a Panasonic core from (I believe) the RP-82. It's image quality was good, but not nearly as good as the 2900. The transport quite slow and the layer change was in the neighborhood of 2 seconds, which I found distasteful.


As the previous poster said, it's all about how much the better quality is worth to you.


Hope this helps some.


Brian.

 

[scpanel]

Does the 2900 play DVD+R, RW and DVD-R, RW discs?

 

[Bytehoven]

If you were going to component 480p, I agree with the rp-82/XP30/1600 selection.


If you were going to run component 480i, the RP-91 is still my favorite choice, even above those player I just mentioned. Mainly for additional picture controls but mainly for the reproduction of the higher end whites. I found the RP-91 gave me better seperation of the 90-100 IRE scale, while it was a little crushed at the 98-100 IRE range on the RP-82 and derivatives.


Then there is the other benefits of the mpeg decoder in the RP-91, which contribute to a slightly more pleasing picture to my eye.



However... I have found the perfect compromise player for component 480i and 720p/1080i DVI. It's the Denon 2910. I would have included component 480p, but some folks are reporting the FLI2310 processing only works on the digital outputs. I don't know if that is true, and I have not tested the component 480p output on the 2910, to see how well it's deinterlacing works.


If I were buying a new player today, I pick up the 2910, and if you watch Ebay, they are selling below MSRP for new units.

 

[umr]

Get the 2900 for film or the XP30 for video.

 

[Beetlejuice]

umr would you recommend the Denon 2900 for use with an Infocus 4805 projector. I'm looking for a player that doesn't crop the image. According to Secrets the 2900 is one of the few players that is available that doesn't crop the image over component.

 

[umr]

Quote:

Originally posted by Beetlejuice umr would you recommend the Denon 2900 for use with an Infocus 4805 projector. I'm looking for a player that doesn't crop the image. According to Secrets the 2900 is one of the few players that is available that doesn't crop the image over component.

It would seem to be a good choice unless the component inputs are substandard.

 

[JeffZX9R]

Quote:

Get the 2900 for film or the XP30 for video.

umr,


If you'll indulge me, I just want to be sure I have this right.


The Silicon Image chip sets like the 2900 uses has a problem with the chroma bug on alt progressive flag content, correct? This shows up on some of the Disney animated releases such as Monsters Inc. ect. So you're saying these Pixar films are really like video on dvd and not film? I never knew that.


Thanks

Jeff

 

[ranster]

I don't know what the chroma bug is (for certain), but I watched Monsters Inc, Toy Story 2 and Aladdin this weekend (with the kids of course!). Absolutely stunning picture from my 2900 (hooked to a LCD RPTV). I've thrown everything at this player and it has performed almost perfectly. I'm saving for a 2910 for another room, but am quite happy with the 2900.

 

[umr]

Quote:

Originally posted by JeffZX9R umr, If you'll indulge me, I just want to be sure I have this right. The Silicon Image chip sets like the 2900 uses has a problem with the chroma bug on alt progressive flag content, correct? This shows up on some of the Disney animated releases such as Monsters Inc. ect. So you're saying these Pixar films are really like video on dvd and not film? I never knew that. Thanks Jeff

Jeff,


Just buy one and take a look. I bought a 3800 and I'm not going back to Faroudja.

 

[JeffZX9R]

Well, my 2910 is supposed to arrive today. I was on the fence, and I liked the good deals and the better audio on the 2900, but the Secrets write ups on these Silicon Image players always seem to mention this chroma thing. I guess it's generally visible on Disney's stuff including the Pixar movies. And that was a deal breaker for me. I love the Pixar stuff and it has to look great. But now it sounds like maybe it's not such a big deal. Guess I'll give the 2910 a shot and look at the 2900 as my backup plan.


Oh, so umr, you didn't answer the question. Are the Pixar's flagged as video then? Is that what causes this?


Jeff

 

[umr]

Quote:

Originally posted by JeffZX9R ...Oh, so umr, you didn't answer the question. Are the Pixar's flagged as video then? Is that what causes this? Jeff

Pixar is not video they just alternate the film and video mode flags.


Many of Secrets tests are torture tests for certain difficult scenes. I am not convinced that passing all of them is always a virtue. Secrets ignores chroma resolution entirely at this time. I could filter it all out and pass their tests with flying colors, but the player would look horrible.


Their tests are also changing with time. The 3800 that I have for example passed the test you are talking about while the 2900 failed. Another site that I use other than Secrets reports the two players perform the same on Pixar movies. The question you need to ask is. Do you want a player that reduces the chroma resolution for ALL movies to or do you want one that displays movies in all their glory, but can display a few warts? I choose to see what is on the disk.

 

[JeffZX9R]

umr,


Taken in that context, I'd chose a few warts as well.


I'll find out if my B&M has a 2900 I can try. I don't like doing the mail order thing on big stuff.


Thanks for the education!

 

[dpippel]

I'll cast another vote for the 2900 and its Silicon Image deinterlacer. I've had all of the big name Faroudja-based players in my rack - Denon 5900/3910, Zenith DVB318, Panasonic RP82/XP50 - and to my eyes the 2900 produces superior 480p component video to them all. In fact I had a head-to-head between it and the 3910 and the 3910 went back. I agree with umr about the negative impact of Faroudja's chroma strategy on overall image quality. DCDi is nice, but it only improves video source material. If you're like most of us the bulk of your DVD watching is film-based material then it's not a big factor. Besides, I find the 2900s performance on video sourced stuff very good indeed.


Jeff - Crutchfield is discounting the remaining stock of their brand-new 2900s (can't name the price per forum rules) with free shipping and their outstanding service and support. They have a no-questions-asked 30 day return policy and even pay for return shipping if you decide to send the player back. It's a risk-free proposition and a great deal if you can't find one locally for a good price with a decent return policy.

 

[colofan]

Denon claims to have a version of 2900 that is"bug free" does anyone know what serial number starts to get a bug free player?

 

[pnichols]

dpippel,


"Besides, I find the 2900s performance on video sourced stuff very good indeed."


I couldn't agree with you more. I haven't found any video scene in a DVD yet that looks as "bad" on my 3800 as that waving flag on the Faroudja test DVD. This test DVD's flag scene was specifically designed of course to show off DCDi and Silicon Image deinterlacing does show some jaggies on the flag's edges, but I've never been bothered by it (or even barely seen it) when viewing DVD extras, which is the only situation in which I view video on my regular movie DVDs.

 

[Shazam9999]

Have you tried CSI Season 2? There's major combing on those episodes.

 

[mjmbond]

Quote:

Originally posted by colofan Denon claims to have a version of 2900 that is"bug free" does anyone know what serial number starts to get a bug free player?

Where does Denon claim this, and what is the "bug" it's supposed to be "free" from? There have been a couple of minor firmware updates, but the only "bug" I'm aware of is the alt. prog. flag issue, and per Denon, it has no fix. In any event, IMO, the alt. prog. flag issue is WAY less obtrusive (visible) that the problems observed with the Faroudja chips.


IMO, the 2900 has the smoothest, most film-like image I have observed (and I have auditioned quite a few players including the newer Denons). Add to that a seamless layer change, VERY good SACD & DVD-A processing and exceptional build quality, and the 2900 is a relative bargain.


MiD

 

[pnichols]

I'm not an expert on combing since I don't ever see it in normal films at all and I don't think I've noticed it in video-based extras because of my viewing distance. I may be seeing it and not realizing it, though.


I thought the Faroudja demonstration jaggy flag edges were just caused by normal 480i vertical resolution issues resulting from nearly horizontal lines at shallow angles that Faroudja smoothed out by their DCDi algorithm? Is the "flag edges" issue just simple combing?


It looks like a shallow angle vertical resolution limitation issue to me on the demo DVD .... similar to how slightly tipped lines look on my PC monitor. This situation can only be really improved through a combination of higher vertical resolution in the source material combined with higher vertical resolution in the display device. However, if the display's resolution is high enough to do better, but the source material is merely too low on vertical resolution such that these jaggies appear, then processing of the source material can be done to take advantage of the display's extra vertical resolution so as to visually smooth out or compensate for ("slur") the source material's nearly horizontal lines by spreading them across more of the display's higher vertical resolution lines. "Faking it" so to speak, so it looks better to the viewer. I'm guessing that DCDi is in effect, doing this.