[sasabune]

I'm a hobbyist only, with no technical background and am trying to figure some things out. I just bought the Denon 5900, and am wondering the best way to hook it up to my Proceed AVP2 pre/pro so that I can listen to SACD and DVD-A. I do not have the "plus 6" version of the avp2. Am I hosed?


On another note, it seems that the best way to connect sources for multi-channel audio will be through an hdmi connection. The 5900 doesn't have that. Will there be any way to have an all digital multi-channel audio path from the 5900? I read that dvi (which the 5900 has) is "backwards compatible" with hdmi, but dvi is only for video, and I dno't see how I'll be able to get a multichannel digital output. Of course, I could be missing something very obvious, which is the reason I'm asking. Thanks in advance.

 

[TauRus]

If I may, a little correction: HDMI is backwards compatible with DVI, not the other way around HDMI is a newer interface. Yes HDMI carries audio, but DVI does not, so when someone talks about DVI and HDMI interoperability they only refer to video.


Does Proceed AVP2 have either 5.1 analog (RCA) inputs or iLink interface? If neither, then yes, you are hosed. You need either of those interfaces to get DVD-A or SACD signal to your pre/pro. Digital coax or optical TOSLINK would not work for DVD-A or SACD.

 

[sasabune]

Thank you TauRus. The avp2 I have does not have 5.1 analog inputs. I believe that was one of the available options when I upgraded from the avp to the avp2, and I didn't spend the extra 1k (i think) for it. I'll have to check about iLink, because I'm not really sure what that is. I thought it was a Denon proprietary connection that was only on Denon stuff. But the fact that you're asking whether my Proceed has it tells me that it's not, and that it's another type of connection that could appear on other manufacturer's products. Can you tell me what it looks like, or whether it goes by another name? Thanks gain.

 

[YellowCows]

If I may, a tiny correction to the correction :


DVI and HDMI are cross-compatible in terms of Video. In other words, using the correct cable/converter, you can hook up an HDMI DVD player to a DVI-equipped display the same as you could a DVI source to an HDMI display device.


You are correct, TauRus, in that DVI is a video interface only. HDMI can carry digital video, multi-channel audio (not implemented as yet), and other data.


Moory

 

[kmmd]

Hi...so you own a 5900 also? Anyway, do you have the AVP2 or the + 6 version that has the 6-channel analog ins for multi-channel audio? Also, if I remember correctly, the setback of the AVP2 + 6 was that it does not do direct analog passthrough. If I'm not mistaken, I believe that it took the 6 analog signals in -> ADC -> SHARC processors for bass management and time alignment. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.) BTW, you may want to ask this in the Amps/Processors/receivers forum also.

Post edited to add and say Ooops:

I just saw that you do not have the plus 6. Does it have HDMI or i.Link? If not, you may be hosed.

 

[sasabune]

I now understand the video-side of dvi/hdmi connections, and specifically that for video, you can use them interchangeably with adapters and converters, etc.


TauRus, I checked the proceed avp2 and there's nothing that says "iLink," and the only digital inputs that I don't recognize are the "aes/ebu" input, and the s/pdif (on bnc) input. Something tells me, that ain't gonna let me hear the DVD-A or SACD my Denon desperately wants to send it. Please tell me I'm wrong.

 

[sasabune]

kmmd: I do not have the "plus 6" version. I did the upgrade at the very beginning of its availability, had never heard of this forum and did not think I'd really be interested in multi-channel audio. When I decided to improve my video equipment with plasma, etc, and then wanted better source components (in particular a reference level universal player), I started reading about the multi channel audio capabilities of the 5900 and thought I really ought to try it. Now it looks like I may end with a player that can handle it but no way to get it to my speakers.

 

[kmmd]

Quote:

sasabune posted: that ain't gonna let me hear the DVD-A or SACD

I'm afraid this is true.

Wow, Shaq just made two free-throws!

 

[Kal Rubinson]

I am afraid that your Proceed is simply incompatible, in its present form, with any of the multichannel SACD or DVD-A players on the market today.

 

[sasabune]

In the words of Austin Powers: "Ouch baby, very ouch." At least the Lakers are going to win the championship.

 

[kmmd]

Quote:

sasabune posted: At least the Lakers are going to win the championship.

I agree with you. Being born and raised in L.A., I have been a Laker fan my entire life. I hope that they do win for Karl and Gary.

 

[PooperScooper]

Wouldn't it be possible to listen to 2-channel (stereo) DVD-A or SACD by connecting the FL and FR 5900 analog outs to a L/R stereo input on the Proceed? If the Proceed has a "direct mode" for analog inputs then it should work. If no "direct mode", setting the tone controls "flat" should still sound ok. There's still much to be had from listening to 2-channel hi-rez audio compared to CD 2-channel.


larry

 

[TauRus]

Yes, good idea, Larry! Indeed, sasabune, you can do it. Every single SACD disc has a DSD stereo track, and I believe DVD-A tracks can be downmixed to stereo as well (although I have not tried it so far). But in the very least you can listen to stereo SACDs this way.

 

[sasabune]

Outstanding. Are you saying that on an SACD disc there's 2 versions, one multi channel and one stereo? How do I play the stereio SACD track as opposed to the multi channel one, or am I misunderstanding. thx.

 

[TauRus]

You are right, Sasabune. SACD discs come in a few flavors:


1) SACD Stereo - this is one layer stereo (DSD) only disc, usually the sticker on the cover says it can be played on SACD players only.


2) SACD Multi-channel/Stereo - this is a one layer 5.1 multi-channels and stereo (both DSD) disc - also usually says can be played on SACD players only.


3) Hybrid SACD disc - this is a two layer disc. One contains a regular CD stereo tracks (not DSD, but Redbook CD). The second layer contains either just stereo or both stereo and multi-channel SACD (DSD) tracks. These SACD discs usually have a sticker that says they can be played on SACD and CD players. Actually they can be player anywhere (DVD-ROM, DVD Player, walkman, in the car. The difference is that when you play it in the SACD player you can access both layers and can chose which track to play, whereas in all other players you can only listen to the regular CD layer.


The important thing is that no matter what kind of SACD disc is, it always contains stereo DSD tracks.

All you have to do is to go to your player's SACD setup menu and make sure that SACD Stereo playback is selected as default. Then whenever you insert any kind of SACD disc, the player automatically will read the stereo DSD track.

 

[sasabune]

TauRus: thanks for the very clear explanation. At least I can get some hi rez audio in stereo.


I was reading on another thread ("is the 5900 stillthe player to beat," or something like that), that the 5900 has a firewire output. Can that transmit the multi-channel hi rez SACD/DVD music, or am I still hosed? Apparently the firewire wasn't originally working, but there's a fix that activated it. I'll look into it more if it will do the trick. Thanks again for your insight and patience.

 

[TauRus]

Quote:

Originally posted by sasabune TauRus: thanks for the very clear explanation. At least I can get some hi rez audio in stereo. I was reading on another thread ("is the 5900 stillthe player to beat," or something like that), that the 5900 has a firewire output. Can that transmit the multi-channel hi rez SACD/DVD music, or am I still hosed? Apparently the firewire wasn't originally working, but there's a fix that activated it. I'll look into it more if it will do the trick. Thanks again for your insight and patience.

You are welcome! As for the FireWire, yes it can transmit DVD-A/SACD multichannel tracks, but I thought we already covered that issue in this thread above: iLink and FireWire are the same thing.

Actually, for the sake of accuracy, we only need to call this interface iLink when it comes to Home THeater equipment/electronics. Apple Computer invented this interface a while ago for connecting different computer periferals. They call it FireWire. Sony licensed this technology later and called it iLink. Initially, they also used it on computers only. Then, Sony modiifed some protocols in the iLink interface to make it more suitable for electronics. So, strictly speaking, we should not call that interface FireWire - that term is applicable for computer world only.

And, as you confirmed above, there is no iLink interface on your AVP2, so call it iLInk or FireWire, you seem to be out of luck. Sorry. Perhaps, its time to upgrade?

 

[sasabune]

We already covered it, you're right. Too much "fun" over the holiday weekend must have shot my short term memory and reading skills. I'll probably upgrade when Harman Specialty Group decides what they're going to do with Proceed AVP owners in terms of a trade up. Until then, it's stereo for me.