[Majicpanda]

When I first bought my 590s I was told my receiver would be more than enough but I've since added 290s for surrounds and a 520c.

Is this receiver still plenty to push them?

I watched our most intense movie last night and we enjoy about -7db listening level which resulted in 83db max at the main listening position.

I keep getting conflicting reports that I'm crazy thinking my receiver can properly push my setup, so does anyone have any real facts and info I can use?

 

[bobknavs]

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/denon-avr-x3400h-av-receiver-review-test-bench

The reduction in available power in going beyond 2 channels isn't bad. For home theater, the expectation is that you would rarely or never max out all channels simultaneously, anyway.

Trust your ears. If you aren't getting clipping or distortion at your loudest listening level, you don't need to let other people spend your money on additional amplifiers.

 

[Majicpanda]

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/denon-avr-x3400h-av-receiver-review-test-bench

The reduction in available power in going beyond 2 channels isn't bad. For home theater, the expectation is that you would rarely or never max out all channels simultaneously, anyway.

Trust your ears. If you aren't getting clipping or distortion at your loudest listening level, you don't need to let other people spend your money on additional amplifiers.

Sounds quite amazing to me! 😉 Of course it's easy to not know what you're missing and wonder.

Do the 5 channels not reserve power in full? Even full stereo music sounds great, I assume that's a full power test.

 

[bobknavs]

Sounds quite amazing to me! 😉 Of course it's easy to not know what you're missing and wonder.

Do the 5 channels not reserve power in full? Even full stereo music sounds great, I assume that's a full power test.

I believe that the amp channels are all identical. The limitation would be the power supply.

By "full stereo", do you mean multichannel stereo? I don't know whether all channels are driven identically. I have read claims that the surrounds are not driven as hard as the fronts for that.

 

[Majicpanda]

Sounds quite amazing to me! 😉 Of course it's easy to not know what you're missing and wonder.

Do the 5 channels not reserve power in full? Even full stereo music sounds great, I assume that's a full power test.

I believe that the amp channels are all identical. The limitation would be the power supply.

By "full stereo", do you mean multichannel stereo? I don't know whether all channels are driven identically. I have read claims that the surrounds are not driven as hard as the fronts for that.

I'm mainly only concerned with movies but yes multi channel stereo just as a test for music.

Do you know how those numbers convert driving 6 ohm speakers? The front stage is 6 but the rears are 8. Really impressive power rating on 5 channels driven 97.6 wpc or 97.6 / 5?

 

[bobknavs]

I'm mainly only concerned with movies but yes multi channel stereo just as a test for music.

Do you know how those numbers convert driving 6 ohm speakers? The front stage is 6 but the rears are 8. Really impressive power rating on 5 channels driven 97.6 wpc or 97.6 / 5?

6 ohms? I don't know, and don't know enough to extrapolate.

Every set of receiver specs I've seen have the AVR making more power in 2 channels at 6 ohms than for 8, though.

 

[KSpan]

I'm mainly only concerned with movies but yes multi channel stereo just as a test for music.

Do you know how those numbers convert driving 6 ohm speakers? The front stage is 6 but the rears are 8. Really impressive power rating on 5 channels driven 97.6 wpc or 97.6 / 5?

If movies are your main concern then you have little to worry about, as it is extremely rare for all channels to be firing at high volumes at the same time.

 

[Dargent0628]

You are worrying needlessly. There are countless threads that will confirm for you that db levels uncomfortably loud you are only pushing several watts. Wattage/headroom is for transient peaks and the 3400 will not clip.

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk

 

[pase22]

When I first bought my 590s I was told my receiver would be more than enough but I've since added 290s for surrounds and a 520c.

Is this receiver still plenty to push them?

I watched our most intense movie last night and we enjoy about -7db listening level which resulted in 83db max at the main listening position.

I keep getting conflicting reports that I'm crazy thinking my receiver can properly push my setup, so does anyone have any real facts and info I can use?

Are you running a sub(s) in your setup?

 

[Majicpanda]

You are worrying needlessly. There are countless threads that will confirm for you that db levels uncomfortably loud you are only pushing several watts. Wattage/headroom is for transient peaks and the 3400 will not clip.

Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk

I understand that the speakers will never really take more than say 10 watts (just rounding for simplicity since my receiver can handle 5x+ that) but at what point do you know it's producing absolutely clean power that an amp can? Is this just an old mentality that receivers cannot provide what an amp can?

 

[Majicpanda]

Are you running a sub(s) in your setup?

Yes a pos klipsch R10SW but hoping to get a VTF2/3 MK5 in the near future.

 

[Leeliemix]

I understand that the speakers will never really take more than say 10 watts (just rounding for simplicity since my receiver can handle 5x+ that) but at what point do you know it's producing absolutely clean power that an amp can? Is this just an old mentality that receivers cannot provide what an amp can?

Its somewhat of an old mentality but separate power amplifiers can have much more robust powersupplies and are able to handle more current to drive difficult loads. This does not mean all separate power amplifiers are better then recievers, and especially at the lower price brakets they arent really any better than whats in the recievers themselves.

One or two good subs will usually give a sizeable boost to a system especially for movies.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[pase22]

Yes a pos klipsch R10SW but hoping to get a VTF2/3 MK5 in the near future.

A sub crossed over at 80hz takes a huge load off the AVR. The HSU sub will be a significant upgrade.

 

[Majicpanda]

A sub crossed over at 80hz takes a huge load off the AVR. The HSU sub will be a significant upgrade.

I feel like my 590s may have sounded better set to small and crossed at 80, but that is essentially just wasting the entire setup at that point is it not? They should be set to full range and properly amplified? I just tried out full range on my 590s and rear 290s and I'm getting a lot more mids, but when fully cranked I'm not sure I'm hearing clean audio... just a lot MORE audio.

 

[pase22]

I understand that the speakers will never really take more than say 10 watts (just rounding for simplicity since my receiver can handle 5x+ that) but at what point do you know it's producing absolutely clean power that an amp can? Is this just an old mentality that receivers cannot provide what an amp can?

When you hear clipping, heavy distortion or the AVR goes into protection mode turn it down right away. The sound is unmistakable, believe me you'll know.

 

[pase22]

I feel like my 590s may have sounded better set to small and crossed at 80, but that is essentially just wasting the entire setup at that point is it not? They should be set to full range and properly amplified? I just tried out full range on my 590s and rear 290s and I'm getting a lot more mids, but when fully cranked I'm not sure I'm hearing clean audio... just a lot MORE audio.

Your sub may be underpowered for the room. Room size and placement have a huge impact on the sub's effectiveness. A good sub like HSU can play the low end a lot more cleanly and efficiently than most towers. Of course proper placement and setup are critical to getting the most out of your sub.

 

[Majicpanda]

When you hear clipping, heavy distortion or the AVR goes into protection mode turn it down right away. The sound is unmistakable, believe me you'll know.

Is there really no such thing as getting better imaging or sound stage with an amp vs what I have now then? I can't say I've ever heard distortion and I've listened to movies at 0db reference on the AVR which produces up to a max of 90db at the listening position during some scenes. Sounds like even if I thought I could get better sound from my 590s it would cost $500+ for a high quality one so this discussion appears over, thanks That money is better off going into a new sub which is all the upgrades I can afford this year.

 

[Leeliemix]

I feel like my 590s may have sounded better set to small and crossed at 80, but that is essentially just wasting the entire setup at that point is it not? They should be set to full range and properly amplified? I just tried out full range on my 590s and rear 290s and I'm getting a lot more mids, but when fully cranked I'm not sure I'm hearing clean audio... just a lot MORE audio.

They arent full range speakers, almost no tower speakers are. With a -3db at 35hz or so a crossover at 80 sounds like a good choice, you can play around with it a little and try 60hz also to check.
For 2ch music you may prefer running in direct/pure direct mode and that ignores crossover settings so running speakers full range. But whats better, stereo with crossover to sub or not depends on a lot of different things like your taste, source music, room, how well sub and speakers are set up, mood and so on so just try both some.


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[Majicpanda]

They arent full range speakers, almost no tower speakers are. With a -3db at 35hz or so a crossover at 80 sounds like a good choice, you can play around with it a little and try 60hz also to check.
For 2ch music you may prefer running in direct/pure direct mode and that ignores crossover settings so running speakers full range. But whats better, stereo with crossover to sub or not depends on a lot of different things like your taste, source music, room, how well sub and speakers are set up, mood and so on so just try both some.


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I get such conflicting info like being slammed for running the 590s crossed at all and on small but I really feel they sounded much better as small and crossed at 80. I am 99% Movies so that's the only thing that matters to me for configuration.

My small 10" sub I feel is set up in the ideal position and provides nice coverage but what I do feel like I lack is more midrange when I use small crossed at 80 vs Full Range. Is this possibly a simple tweak of changing the crossover to 60hz instead?

 

[pase22]

Is there really no such thing as getting better imaging or sound stage with an amp vs what I have now then? I can't say I've ever heard distortion and I've listened to movies at 0db reference on the AVR which produces up to a max of 90db at the listening position during some scenes. Sounds like even if I thought I could get better sound from my 590s it would cost $500+ for a high quality one so this discussion appears over, thanks That money is better off going into a new sub which is all the upgrades I can afford this year.

I never suggested getting an amp. Go for the VTF-3 if you can swing it. You'll be amazed how much depth it'll add to your setup. If you think you like your setup now, wait till you add a sub of that caliber.