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Did I find the WAF solution to acoustic treatment?

1762 Views 26 Replies 9 Participants Last post by krasmuzik, Jan 4, 2006

sethwas

Discussion Starter · Dec 25, 2005

http://www.artcoustic.com/Front%20screen%20option.htm

If these screens can be ordered in any pattern using fabric looks or painting looks or even family photo's why not use them as the fabric in an acoustic panel?

Now they can be hung like a painting.

Seth

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1 - 20 of 27 Posts

porterhaus

· #2 · Dec 25, 2005

Nice find Seth.

(If they had a "Bikini Destinations" section it might be of more interest to the male buyers

).

For the DIYers, try the iron-on transfer paper for use with ink jet printers. Epson makes some (#S041153). I would be somewhat concerned about the effect it might have on sound absorption vs reflection. But, maybe some small designs/photos would work ok.

JimP

· #3 · Dec 25, 2005

Nice find.

Helps with avoiding the ugglies.

Have you seen anything about using furniture in corners for bass traps?? Think that would have the ultimate acceptance factor.

sethwas

Discussion Starter · #4 · Dec 25, 2005

I don't know if anyone saw the prices but it's like $700 for a print.

Think the local t-shirt place can do it for less?

Seth

porterhaus

· #5 · Dec 26, 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by sethwas
I don't know if anyone saw the prices but it's like $700 for a print.

Think the local t-shirt place can do it for less?

Seth

When I saw the description of the cloth: "The Artcoustic designer textile range is a selection of exquisite fabrics from the finest textile houses in Europe." I knew these were out of my price range.

Hence, the DIY suggestion.

sethwas

Discussion Starter · #6 · Dec 26, 2005

Well,

If guilford had a white (not that sandy color) that could probably be fed through a printer (I don't mean a HP inkjet) for a pattern.

Seth

krasmuzik

· #7 · Dec 26, 2005

Here is something from an acoustic engineering firm. There are other commercial market manufacturers of these.

http://www.pmiltd.com/salon.html

These are very easy to DIY - go to your local blueprint/sign shop for large format print to fabric services. From there forward it is the same as making a DIY framed fabric panel.

You do not need to use acoustic fabric - even a batik print from the local saturday market will work. It just cannot be reflective fabric.

This customer used his inkjet...his wife is into quilting squares and this method is very common there. They make special fabric papers for feeding in your consumer inkjets. Probably best for a one-off to you use your local blueprint shop though - unless you like to sew sheets together.

http://krasmuzik.home.comcast.net/RSA_theater2.JPG

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sethwas

Discussion Starter · #8 · Dec 27, 2005

Hmm,

Now I have to pick what I want to enlarge. Maybe a wedding portrait?

Seth

jdurbin

· #9 · Dec 27, 2005

Cr*p! Salon Acoustics is doing the exact thing I was evaluating. Oh well, it just goes to show you that every good idea is already being done! Glad I discovered this sooner rather than later.

I've been discussing the idea for a couple weeks with a buddy of mine who sells those large-format printers. They do print on canvas in order to create a fine art look but the canvas is treated and I think the treatment has a big impact on the acoustics. It wouldn't be as significant on LF as it would on HF but still a consideration. Another issue is pigment-ink versus dyes. My gut feeling is that dyes would be better but if the canvas is treated either way, how much acoustic advantage is there to using dyes? Equipment is $7,000 - $9,000 with the dye equipment at the high end of that range.

Big hassle is copyrights. Before getting into the sales business he was a product manager for a poster/art company and he said that negotiating copyright licensing was a hassle. Sounds like too much hassle for a hobby business.

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jdurbin

· #10 · Dec 27, 2005

http://www.pmiltd.com/CinePanel%20Pa...paneldata.html

Does the top graph look hokey to you? How does the cine panel absorb 180% of the sound hitting it. I understand from reading Ethan's stuff that you can get slightly more than 100% because the edges absorb sound in addition to the front but how do they get all the way up to 180%?

[Edited to pull my foot out of my mouth.]

jdurbin

· #11 · Dec 27, 2005

http://www.pmiltd.com/salonpictures.html

Funny. I picked out the Zeldas a week ago as being pretty nice for potential wall-ceiling bass traps.

I need to investigate because they would be much cheaper than purchasing an expensive piece of hardware. I still think their stats are a bit suspect.

John Kotches

· #12 · Dec 27, 2005

Tony Grimani is the principal at PMI Ltd. He has a quite extensive background in acoustics going back to his days at THX. Perhaps you should rethink your "half-assed attempt" comment.

Regards,

krasmuzik

· #13 · Dec 27, 2005

Some more fabric print resources. For those considering the biz model of selling these - beyond copyright issues - check out your local large format print shops pricing. You may rethink it after you find out the costs.

http://www.brejtfus.com/wallart.htm

http://www.inkjetart.com/

krasmuzik

· #14 · Dec 27, 2005

Tony Grimani is THE top acoustics trainer at CEDIA.

Many panel manufacturers make kits with placement recommendations - for those who do not want to pay extra for expensive acoustical engineering consulting and measurement services. A few half-assed placed panels are better than none at all. I suggest you pick up this months HTmag inside the AVI section they have a PMIltd acoustically engineered theater.

That absorption curve is obviously not a standard measure -as you can see the impact on the RT60 is not as significant. I certainly would ask for the real data that can be used in the Sabine reverb equation before I trust that data. Only trust data that has been certified to be measured by a certified acoustic lab.

johnbomb

· #15 · Dec 27, 2005

Folks, this may sound a bit ridiculous, but is there any CHEAP fabric (or evquivalent) out there that you can paint with house latex that will look good? I want to match the fabric covering my bass traps to the color of my walls. Any ideas/alternatives? Thanks.

John

krasmuzik

· #16 · Dec 27, 2005

paint is the wrong way to go - it will make your panels as reflective as your painted walls. Dyed muslin is your solution. You are better off getting custom matched paint than custom matched dyed fabric however.

jdurbin

· #17 · Dec 27, 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Kotches
Tony Grimani is the principal at PMI Ltd. He has a quite extensive background in acoustics going back to his days at THX. Perhaps you should rethink your "half-assed attempt" comment.

Regards,

LOL.

I realized that as I researched the site some more. I still find 180% absorption hard to 'absorb'. In one of his pictures of his main product, he shows it without the GOM fabric and they look 'sculpted'. Perhaps that is how he gets his high scores - there's more surface area than a simple height x width measurement would suggest.

It's worth a phone call to learn more. Could be a very interesting advance than just wrapped OC705.

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jdurbin

· #18 · Dec 27, 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by krasmuzik
paint is the wrong way to go - it will make your panels as reflective as your painted walls. Dyed muslin is your solution. You are better off getting custom matched paint than custom matched dyed fabric however.

I agree.

johnbomb

· #19 · Dec 27, 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by krasmuzik
paint is the wrong way to go - it will make your panels as reflective as your painted walls. Dyed muslin is your solution. You are better off getting custom matched paint than custom matched dyed fabric however.

I'm not worried about the high frequency reflection- all of my fiberglass is covered with FRK, which is reflective as is. Would paint still be out of consideration?

porterhaus

· #20 · Dec 28, 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by sethwas
Hmm,

Now I have to pick what I want to enlarge. Maybe a wedding portrait?

Seth

I could be wrong.... but IMO the "dogs playing poker" pictures should have a huge WAF.

1 - 20 of 27 Posts

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