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Discussion Starter #43
very minor update :

Today I finished what I needed to do earlier then I'd anticipated and left me free for the mid morning, early afternoon.. I took the opportunity to try out my newly purchased Bosch Pex 300 random orbital sander on the cabinets.. Basically I wanted to smooth down the rough corners and excess glue, preparing them for the front baffle which will hopefully be arriving next week, fingers crossed..

Let me tell you.. I've never owned a random orbital sander but this little beauty is absolutely brilliant.. Such a beautiful machine and easy to work with.. I definitely reccomend anyone who maybe looking to buy one...

Here are a couple of closeup shots of the edges etc... I appreciate they will be filled and re sanded but it cleaned them and prepared them nicely for the next stage hopefully next week..







In addition to this I thought it would be good if I prepared the horizontal and vertical braces.. Clearly I have no intention in gluing them in before the front baffle arrives but again just wanted them ready as I had the time to knock them out today.. Hope they look ok? I think I may need to round the horizontal braces a little as they are maybe too square? Would appreciate any advice on this .. Thank you.











 

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Braces look great. As long as they fit nice and tight, you won't need to do a thing with them. If you have the time, and the tools, and are so inclined, you can use a router to round over all the exposed internal non-glue edges, which is common among the OCD-obsessed in this corner of the world (including me on my SDX-10 build). I think the consensus is that it may not do anything, especially not at lower frequencies, but it definitely doesn't hurt anything.
 

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Discussion Starter #45 (Edited)
Braces look great. As long as they fit nice and tight, you won't need to do a thing with them. If you have the time, and the tools, and are so inclined, you can use a router to round over all the exposed internal non-glue edges, which is common among the OCD-obsessed in this corner of the world (including me on my SDX-10 build). I think the consensus is that it may not do anything, especially not at lower frequencies, but it definitely doesn't hurt anything.
Thank you so much I was actually thinking of rounding them out like the attached picture. Would you reccomend this? I mean would it make any difference or shall I leave as is? Thank you.


@mtg90 I would really appreciate if you could advise if the squares need to be larger or if I need to make them circles.. Thank you , much appreciated :)
 

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Thank you so much I was actually thinking of rounding them out like the attached picture. Would you reccomend this? I mean would it make any difference or shall I leave as is? Thank you.



@mtg90 I would really appreciate if you could advise if the squares need to be larger or if I need to make them circles.. Thank you , much appreciated :)
Oh, I thought you meant round over the edges, sorry! I'll still give you my unsolicited, unexpert opinion though. Lol. I'd say if you can do it without too much trouble, then go for it. It won't make a measurable or audible difference, but it would slightly increase the usable volume. And it would look nice.

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Yep, so long as you still have the strength with no pliability in the brace and you are keeping as close to spec'd internal volume as possible, you'll be fine. I've seen plenty of gorgeous window braces in DIY cabs - but in reality they will never be seen again once the baffle is placed over top of them.

You are gonna love these speakers. I was this close to building a set of three myself, but ended up buying them from another kinda local AVS fellow all completed. My only "complaint" is they are so smooth sounding that I forget how loud they truly are. Too many evenings enjoying my setup of late have left me with ringing ears afterward.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
Yep, so long as you still have the strength with no pliability in the brace and you are keeping as close to spec'd internal volume as possible, you'll be fine. I've seen plenty of gorgeous window braces in DIY cabs - but in reality they will never be seen again once the baffle is placed over top of them.

You are gonna love these speakers. I was this close to building a set of three myself, but ended up buying them from another kinda local AVS fellow all completed. My only "complaint" is they are so smooth sounding that I forget how loud they truly are. Too many evenings enjoying my setup of late have left me with ringing ears afterward.
Hey @JCJetta, just checked your build thread and your room looks sweet. I am super excited about the HTM-12's but they are up against speakers that I literally loved (XTZ Cinema M6) cinema series so the expectation is very high.. :) I do believe it will beat it though ( I hope ) LOL as I have heard too many good things about the HTM-12's.

I'd like to hear some feedback on how you think they perform with movies etc sometime.. Thanks for your input ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Christmas has definitely come early ;)

The packaging was truly remarkable and you can see that Erich put a lot of effort into it, to ensure that there will be no damage during delivery..

Back to work tomorrow so won't get much done over these next few days.. Checked all parts arrived safe and sound.

The front baffles fit perfectly on the cabs I built so very happy with that... The tweeters are very well built and quite heavier than what I had assumed.. Here are a few more pics:







Thank you @mtg90 for the beautiful crossovers :)












 

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K, here’s a little write up as I’ve enjoyed the HTMs for more than a month now. I may copy/paste this to my build thread too.

Glass Breaking
This sound to me has always had a great way of showing off speakers’ strengths or weaknesses as it were. War of the Worlds scene where the tripod initially emerges from the street comes to mind. I’ve heard this scene on everything from alarm-clock-radio style speakers, PA speakers, nearfield monitors, and of course our HTMs. The HTMs nail the sound as natural and brutal, but without being harsh like nails-on-chalkboard. This is a sound that you can tell when a tweeter is being stressed, and the HTM’s CD handles it with ease. You also can enjoy the many other complex sounds occurring simultaneously in that scene such as screams of terror, street pavement cracking, and the ominous strings from the musical score ramping up.

Female voice
You don’t get the harshness of the “ESSSSes” or taking a breath with the HTMs like you do with lesser speakers. The woman sounds like she is speaking/singing right in front of you (albeit a bit louder than normal, thanks to my prodigious volume level).

Male voice
The HTMs don’t boom or drone when a male with a baritone is speaking. Take a stand-up comedian recording and it seems like you are at a live performance (thank you for sharing Jimmy Car with us Yanks, by the way!) Sure, sometimes the pops from the microphone are a bit annoying, but that could be a product of the recording instead of the speakers.

Acoustic Guitar
Yeah… again these make guitars sound pretty much live on the stage. You hear fingers moving on frets, harmonic chords sound natural. Do yourself a favor and enjoy some live concert recordings on these.

Midbass
Perhaps the only weakness with these speaks is they won’t quite provide the chest impact from snares, toms, gunshots, and Ferrari exhaust that say the Titans or Fusion 15s give. Of course, those speakers are using 15” mids verses our 12s – and they have considerably larger footprint. For my small room, the HTMs are already overkill; the aforementioned speakers I simply would not have room for. Of course, in the end the HTMs are designed for use with a subwoofer, and the HTMs can play along very nicely with some nasty subs.

I’d also suggest you doing some before and after comparisons. Especially if you have the ability to swap out your XTZs quickly (SpeakOn connections). That’s something I’ve had fun doing, when I can actually peel myself away from just enjoying a movie.
 

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Discussion Starter #51
K, here’s a little write up as I’ve enjoyed the HTMs for more than a month now. I may copy/paste this to my build thread too.

Glass Breaking
This sound to me has always had a great way of showing off speakers’ strengths or weaknesses as it were. War of the Worlds scene where the tripod initially emerges from the street comes to mind. I’ve heard this scene on everything from alarm-clock-radio style speakers, PA speakers, nearfield monitors, and of course our HTMs. The HTMs nail the sound as natural and brutal, but without being harsh like nails-on-chalkboard. This is a sound that you can tell when a tweeter is being stressed, and the HTM’s CD handles it with ease. You also can enjoy the many other complex sounds occurring simultaneously in that scene such as screams of terror, street pavement cracking, and the ominous strings from the musical score ramping up.

Female voice
You don’t get the harshness of the “ESSSSes” or taking a breath with the HTMs like you do with lesser speakers. The woman sounds like she is speaking/singing right in front of you (albeit a bit louder than normal, thanks to my prodigious volume level).

Male voice
The HTMs don’t boom or drone when a male with a baritone is speaking. Take a stand-up comedian recording and it seems like you are at a live performance (thank you for sharing Jimmy Car with us Yanks, by the way!) Sure, sometimes the pops from the microphone are a bit annoying, but that could be a product of the recording instead of the speakers.

Acoustic Guitar
Yeah… again these make guitars sound pretty much live on the stage. You hear fingers moving on frets, harmonic chords sound natural. Do yourself a favor and enjoy some live concert recordings on these.

Midbass
Perhaps the only weakness with these speaks is they won’t quite provide the chest impact from snares, toms, gunshots, and Ferrari exhaust that say the Titans or Fusion 15s give. Of course, those speakers are using 15” mids verses our 12s – and they have considerably larger footprint. For my small room, the HTMs are already overkill; the aforementioned speakers I simply would not have room for. Of course, in the end the HTMs are designed for use with a subwoofer, and the HTMs can play along very nicely with some nasty subs.

I’d also suggest you doing some before and after comparisons. Especially if you have the ability to swap out your XTZs quickly (SpeakOn connections). That’s something I’ve had fun doing, when I can actually peel myself away from just enjoying a movie.
Thank you so much for such a fantastic review of the HTM-12's I am even more excited now lol :) I hope I can finish them and have them up and running by xmas. I really want to demo these with the Polar Express on xmas day with the kids :) Love that movie.. Great for showing off your speakers :)

I was hoping the mids gave me a slight punch in the chest but from what your saying that's not the case , is that right? I hope the mids are atleast better than my xtz speakers.

Unfortunately I won't be able to do swap out comparrison as I have already sold my XTZ speakers and were delivered yesterday but I do know the sound of the XTZ cinema series very well so will still be able to compare especially with scenes from my favourite movies and will do a write up in a couple of months time once I have bedded in the drivers of the HTM-12's and feel that I am ready to make a judgement on them...
 

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Discussion Starter #52
Minor update:

After work when I arrived home there was still daylight so I thought I may as well adjust the horizontal braces (make the squares larger) and atleast glue on in the cabinet..tomorrow I'll glue in the other two I guess.





I am going to concentrate in finishing off the cabinets hopefully in a professional way.. I was considering tuff cab but I'm not sure about it as I prefer a smooth matt black finish.. So what I intend is using leyland acrylic primer undercoat x 2 coats and then spray with matt black paint.. I was considering buying a little electric spray gun but not worth as it's such a small project it will just sit in the garage so I think I'm going to stick with the spray can 500ml matt black 1 can per coat so 2 cans per cabinet total or 6 cans for the job (I think), £5.00 a pop.. It'll cost me £30 for the spray finish which ain't bad..

I welcome any ideas or reccomendations if I'm going the wrong path about it
 

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I am sure these will give more thump than the small XTZ's, however I think the general consensus is that chest thump should be chased by subs and not mains as missed punch is usually down to a combination of placement and drivers and some of the time the mains aren't placed exactly where the subs would be placed for optimal bass. From my old hifi speakers these definitely have more attack but I'm hoping my llt pro driver sub builds will provide me with even more slam.

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Great review j.k.!

Monitor speakers....ones that dont sit on the floor can and often will have floor bounce issues that lower that midbass around 100 to 250 or 300. You can see it graphically in my build thread. Tuxedovic has a wonderful thread on this.

Best solution is a baffle wall which they were designed for. It removes the floor bounce issue along with cabinet diffraction.

2nd best is to build mbms that sit on the floor and fill this range naturally without eq. You also gain the benefit of being able to increase the volume in whatever range you build. Then you can boost it all u want.

Third is eq. Since i got outboard amps I used eq first and it works great. The issue is variability. I can make the average of all measured positions flat....but theres big variations.

No matter what you do with mbms, as I mentioned in my review....do not chase midbass with mains.

The real magic is happening under 100hz imo. Ive tested my mbms vs my htm12s vs my 4 ported subs....no contest. Sure the mbms work great but they sure aint subs. All i can say is imo bloating the midbass makes everything sound worse. But having it strong and powerful does work without coloration.

My honest opinion is if you love tactile feel your subs should be crossed higher...at 100 or even 120hz. With well placed and integrated subs you cannot -- at all-- locate the subs. You can create excellent tactile feel with mbms too...but my issue is where should they cross? Ive tried 40 60 80 100 120 and ill tell you no setting matches the subs...and shouldnt. Htms are for perfectly accurate playback imo. Jks comment about mic pops is perfect. Darn right thats the recording! It sure isnt the htms. Bad recordings are much easier to hear.

Mbms and subs are for midbass and tactile feel. Only if you have a baffle wall will you have zero midbass issues with the htms....but floor bounce is more relevant 100 to 300...not 40 to 100 where an mbm might normally play. I hope this helps.
 

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So many good reviews with the HTM-12’s this speaker was one of my favorites at my GTG meet. He’s going to be very happy with the results. Nice work on the cabinets to they look good.
 

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Discussion Starter #56
Back on it today... Braces all installed now gluing on the front baffles.. Do you reckon that's enough clamps lol :)

Oh, I also forget to ask.. Sorry if this is a silly question but with the CD there are 2 screws that screw into the CD and then into the waveguide. one side of the screw has more thread than the other. Does the side with little thread go into the CD and the side with more thread go into the waveguide ? Would appreciate your help. Thank you :)


 

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FTR for some it's generally easier to get the stuffing in place before attaching the baffle,

just a personal preference of working space . . .

looking clean tight and right.

after your latex primer, since I'm unfamiliar with tuff coat, can that be rolled on with a foam roller for very flat minimally reflective top coat?

and "clamp pron", yeah some real action . .
 
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Back on it today... Braces all installed now gluing on the front baffles.. Do you reckon that's enough clamps lol :)

Oh, I also forget to ask.. Sorry if this is a silly question but with the CD there are 2 screws that screw into the CD and then into the waveguide. one side of the screw has more thread than the other. Does the side with little thread go into the CD and the side with more thread go into the waveguide ? Would appreciate your help. Thank you :)


I put the long threaded side into the CD and the short onto the seos. Make sure they are nice and tight, spanner will be necessary!

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As long as the threads allow you to tighten down the waveguide good it won't matter which direction you put the the bolt in. I put the short threaded part into the compression driver and the longer side into the waveguide. But it really doesn't matter either way.
 
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