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Discussion Starter #1
Not sure I understand your questions, but here's my 2cents: (note: lots of detailed info on the various Audio/Video egroups, and try searching with google.com):


1.) Some 4:3 aspect sets do compress 1080i as part of normal operation. The Sony HS10 series for example.

2.) Some 4:3 aspect sets can be manually forced to compress 1080i with service mode adjustments: Toshibas and the Panasonic HX40 series.

3.) I believe all 4:3 aspect sets can display 1080i very well without compression, using the "letterboxing" technique that downsamples vertically, throwing away some lines of resolution. This because your eyes are not very critical of lowered detail in the vertical direction, and 1080i has plenty of resolution in the horizontal direction that your eyes are more sensitive to. I've never heard any complaints about "missing lines of resolution" when the picture was not squeezed.

4.) I believe none of the 4:3 sets (neither directview or RPTVs with 7" crts) can resolve the full horizontal and vertical resolutions required by 1080i, but all brands seem to offer a pretty darned good picture, after even basic calibration.


Don
 

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Thanks for the reply Don


I was asking about 810i mode after researching several options...


I decided on a 4x3 set because that is the format I expect to watch most often. As I looked at features for various sets, I noticed that the Tosh's list an "810i" 16x9 capability ( http://www.toshiba.com/tacp/tv/36HFX71.html . I assume that this means that when this set is in 16x9 mode, it is reduced from 1080 to 810 lines of resolution (makes sense?). I have decided to get a Sony XBR450 because the specification describes an ability to reduce the picture size to 16x9 without a loss of resolution. Comments? corrections?


[This message has been edited by fletchoman (edited 09-09-2001).]


[This message has been edited by fletchoman (edited 09-09-2001).]


[This message has been edited by fletchoman (edited 09-09-2001).]
 

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Very few sets do this 810i cheat. Beware Hitachis bearing fake squeezes.


A lot of 4:3 HD-ready direct view sets and a few 4:3 HD-ready RPTV's do a vertical squeeze, in precisely the same manner as 16:9 sets. For example, as far as I know, the 4:3 Philips 60PP9601 really is a 16:9 Philips 55PP9701, except that the 4:3 60PP9601 costs less and has a taller screen - both produce the same 55" 16:9 picture in the same manner using the same hardware.


Sony calls their (proper) vertical squeeze "vertical compression", so using "compression" to mean a 1080i->810i downscaling cheat is causing some confusion in this thread.



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Here is the quote from Sony
Quote:
With their 16:9 enhanced mode feature, the new Hi-Scan sets are capable of displaying full vertical resolution in widescreen format.
here is the link http://64.35.93.160/pressrelease/166


I see that they mention vertical resolution but not horizontal resolution. I assume that this means that they are compressing (horizontally) like everybody else.


Has anyone had a chance to see the Tosh 36" direct view? I liked the Sony better at the local B&M but they didn't have the Tosh's.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
OK, I read the links. It sounds like the Tosh will handle 1080i input by throwing out scanlines to down-scale the 16:9 image into the letterbox aspect on a 4:3 set. This is what some HD-STBs also do (like my Pany HDS-20).



I don't know much about the XBRs, but the similar Sony HS10/HS20 series do a much better job than most 4:3 sets handling 1080i & 480p. They vertically squeeze these inputs, which increases the detail and number of lines within the 16:9 "window". That's why people who watch a lot of 4:3 material and some HDTV/DVDs love these sets.


You might be able to get some technical info on the XBR by checking with the Sony enthusiasts on the Yahoo egroup:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sonyhs10


Some of them have XBRs.


Good Luck,

Don
 

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dtycholis,


The new Toshibas (you can the manuals from their website now) have 2 options for handling 1080i and anamorphic DVDs. One is letterboxing, which displays the image in 810 lines of resolution, which is what you have been refering to. However, they also have the option of doing the full squeeze to get the full 1080 lines in a 16:9 area. This is a manual selection from the remote, and not an "automatic" squeeze like that found on the Sony. However, one the upside, you do not need to enter the service menu to do this, it is an option on the regular user menu.


Hope this helps.
 

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IMHO, there is a significant visual improvement in the 4:3 sets that do vertical compression for native HDTV input, compared to those that don't.




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Thanks for all the great input everyone!


So after looking and lurking and looking some more...I decided to go with the XBR450. Nobody in town had the new Tosh's but oooh the Sony looks so good. I will let y'all know how it works out.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
George King,

Thanks for the info on the new Tosh models, glad to see them add this feature.


fletchoman,

good luck with the sony and remember to get the extended warranty!


Don
 
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