[TheHinge]

I have a 7.1 receiver, but not sure I have the room for 7.1. Do most movies use all the 7.1 speakers? Or will 5.1 be just fine for something like WotW? I guess it will have to be


Thanks. I did a search and couldn't find info.

 

[Clmrt]

Actually, no movies are native 7.1. Internal processing derives 7.1 from the source.


2.0 would be fine!


5.1 is perfect for the home. 6.1 and 7.1 are simply evolutionary, not revolutionary.

 

[sdurani]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHinge I have a 7.1 receiver, but not sure I have the room for 7.1.

That depends on where you're sitting in the room. If your couch is away from the back wall, you'll be able to place speakers at your sides and speakers behind you for a 7.1 layout. If your couch is against the back wall, then you'll be able to place speakers at your sides but not behind you because there is a wall there; so it will have to be a 5.1 set-up.
Quote:

Do most movies use all the 7.1 speakers?

Any movie can be played back over a 7.1 set-up. In the surround channels, there are sounds that will image to your left, to your right and behind you. On a 7.1 set-up, sounds that normally image behind you are extracted from the surround channels and sent to speakers behind you. You can do this with any soundtrack.
Quote:

Or will 5.1 be just fine for something like WotW?

5.1 will be fine, but you won't get stable rear-vs-side directionality in the surround field. One pair of surrounds can't be in two places at once (at your sides and behind you).


Sanjay

 

[gohd]

Good description, Clmrt. I notice subtle difference between 5.1 and 7.1 in my room. Even considering taking the rears down for 2nd room use. Many in AVS swear by 7.1 though.

 

[markeetaux]

I find a significant improvement with the two additional rear speakers in my system. Especially for music videos, they really put you in the venue.

 

[Thomas Willard]

As you can see some feel 7.1 is a definite improvement and others do not. Keep in mind that only a few DVD's have a native 6.1 soundtrack and that most new releases are 5.1. And of course older releases are essentially 2.0 which is actually a mono track spread across the left and right front speakers. Now this may well change with Blu ray and HD DVD. However, HDTV uses 5.1 as does SACD and DVD-Audio.


While I use Pro-Logic II for my stereo sources, I don't notice a big difference between Pro-Logic II and stereo. I suspect I would not notice two more speakers with Pro-Logic IIx. If you are wiring a room I would put in the walls the wire for two future side speakers. It is good to have the wiring in place in case true 7.1 audio becomes available.

 

[ndabunka]

I built a house 3 years ago and wired it for true 7.1 sound in my HT. I have run 5.1 in there until last weekend when I upgraded my receiver/amp to a true 7.1 system. I have been disappointed in the lack of being able to even run 7.1 (in most cases). The processor I have can run ProLogix IIx as as well as THX EX but almost all of the DVD's I've found (including reference ones like the superbit) do not allow me to use these modes. Is this typical?

 

[fastbike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ndabunka I built a house 3 years ago and wired it for true 7.1 sound in my HT. I have run 5.1 in there until last weekend when I upgraded my receiver/amp to a true 7.1 system. I have been disappointed in the lack of being able to even run 7.1 (in most cases). The processor I have can run ProLogix IIx as as well as THX EX but almost all of the DVD's I've found (including reference ones like the superbit) do not allow me to use these modes. Is this typical?

Very typical. As stated before, there is very little "native" 7.1 source material. The 7.1 that many feel is an improvement is a DSP mode in their receivers.

 

[Thomas Willard]

ndabunka:


Pro Logic II and IIx take a stereo signal and convert it to 5.1 or 7.1 output. While there is source material (SACD or DVD Audio for example) for 5.1, there is no native 7.1 source material. I have wondered if you can feed 6.1 sources (very few DVD movies have 6.1, but some do such as the new release of Titanic) and use both rear speakers in a 7.1 set up for the single rear channel output in a 6.1 source?

 

[whoaru99]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ndabunka I built a house 3 years ago and wired it for true 7.1 sound in my HT. I have run 5.1 in there until last weekend when I upgraded my receiver/amp to a true 7.1 system. I have been disappointed in the lack of being able to even run 7.1 (in most cases). The processor I have can run ProLogix IIx as as well as THX EX but almost all of the DVD's I've found (including reference ones like the superbit) do not allow me to use these modes. Is this typical?

Does not sound typical.


Since I got my AVM 20 a year or two ago, I really have not kept up on all the newer processors, but it allows me to overlay DPL IIx on Dolby Digital and DTS formats. So, essentially, it will make 7.1 from any type of input. The only one I'm not sure it will do, since I've never tried, is to put DPL IIx on something like a SACD when using the Bass Management (as opposed to analog bypass) in the processor. Not sure why I'd want to mess with a SACD like that though...


I guess I've somewhat assumed all receivers/processors with 7.1 would/could apply DPL IIx to more or less any input source. Listing the brand/model of receiver probably would get you a solid answer.


You mentioned ugrading the receiver/processor/amp to 7.1. Sort of assuming you added the extra speakers too and turned them on in the receiver/processor setup? This you will have to do before the 6.1/7.1 modes become available. Also, these modes must be selected in the receiver, they will not appear as options in the DVD's audio menu.

 

[sdurani]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ndabunka The processor I have can run ProLogix IIx as as well as THX EX but almost all of the DVD's I've found (including reference ones like the superbit) do not allow me to use these modes. Is this typical?

No. You should be able to apply THX Surround EX decoding to all DD and DTS 5.1 sources. As for PLIIx, it depends on manufacturer and the processing chip used. PLIIx itself is format agnostic and can be applied to DD and DTS, 2-channel and 5.1-channel, digital and analogue.


Sanjay

 

[sdurani]

Quote:

Originally Posted by whoaru99 Not sure why I'd want to mess with a SACD like that though...

Same reasons you'd "mess with" anything else that you apply PLIIx to.


Sanjay

 

[Twylight]

7.1 fills the room more - i recently got around to putting in 2 more from 5.1 and wish I had done it sooner. For movies.

 

[ndabunka]

Hmmm, Sounds like others have been able to "enhance" the 5.1 encoded DVD's by applying a DSP to them. I have the Yamaha RX-V2400 but the system seems to "revert" to whatever signal the DVD is sending. This may be an issue with the 2400 or it could be due to the JVC DVD player I have. It does have both coax and Optical. For convience I have been using the coax audio connections. Maybe I need to change that (or maybe I just need to read more on the RX-V2400).

 

[Clepto]

yammy should have no problem applying various dsp modes. Make sure all speakers are configured in the receiver, feed it digital. You do have to choose which DSP mode you want to apply.

 

[ndabunka]

My problems with the yamaha was the settings. Although I had run the YPAO with all seven speakers, I "enabled" the 2nd audio Zone on the unit to use the internal amp. When you do this, it takes away the rear surrounds (or the front prescence) speakers (I guess they are pwoered by the same source). Since I have two other external power sources for the other two zones, I don't REALLY need the Yammy to provide that power. Dis-abling power from zone 2 resolves the problems I was having when trying to get 7.1 reproduction. Sounds Cool to have all 8 channels in operation (after having only the 5.1 system for the past 3 years).

 

[flint350]

For the "about to build" crowd, like me, it's a no-brainer. You don't pre-wire for today, you pre-wire for the future. My HT will be done in my new home in March 06 and my pre-wire will provide a side-by-side mount at the rear wall for 2 more Def Techs for 7.1 sound. Can I use it immediately - yes, but artificially and not at its best, but you can just turn it off. When actual 7.1 shows up, I'm ready. The only downside would be for those who can't after-wire very easily. But 5.1 is plenty good and will be for quite a while. I just have to decide on final equipment ahead of time. Probably a Yam, Pioneer or Denon A/V recv'r OR an Anthem AV30 type. It's really win-win, IMO.

 

[ndabunka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by flint350 For the "about to build" crowd, like me, it's a no-brainer. You don't pre-wire for today, you pre-wire for the future. My HT will be done in my new home in March 06 and my pre-wire will provide a side-by-side mount at the rear wall for 2 more Def Techs for 7.1 sound. Can I use it immediately - yes, but artificially and not at its best, but you can just turn it off. When actual 7.1 shows up, I'm ready. The only downside would be for those who can't after-wire very easily. But 5.1 is plenty good and will be for quite a while. I just have to decide on final equipment ahead of time. Probably a Yam, Pioneer or Denon A/V recv'r OR an Anthem AV30 type. It's really win-win, IMO.

I agree that you wire for the future. In my case I did EXACTLY what you are doing today slightly over three years ago. My one regret is that I didn't even consdier the option of "prescence" speakers. I wired for 7.1 (7.2 actually as I do have two sub jacks in use) but didn't add the additional wirign for the additional front speakers. Now that I have my Yamaha RX-V2400, I am thinking that the prescence speakers might be a good option. Luckily with my design, adding a second set of front speakers slightly higher than the first set may not actually be that difficult (backwards stringing to the holes and then pulling across the attic).

 

[klipsch]

I currently use ProLogic IIx for 7.1 when watching movies. The rear speakers are 12 feet (behind me) from my recliner, sides are 8 feet from me (about 100 degrees from my recliner), and the fronts are 12 feet in front of me. There is a HUGELY noticeable difference from the 5.1 to the 7.1. I believe this is the case for me because of the distances and size of my room.


However, Action and Horror movies are really the only movies that showcase the 7.1. Watching a movie like The Descent or Underworld has many scenes were noises literally move circular around the room or back left to side left, etc. If your main viewing pleasure is Drama, Comedy, Romance, etc. then I would say there is no need for 7.1 regardless of your room or ability to do 7.1.


If you have the speakers available it is always worth a shot for experimentation. But I'm sure 5.1 will be great (if not optimal) since you say your room does not really have the room.

 

[ndabunka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by klipsch I currently use ProLogic IIx for 7.1 when watching movies. The rear speakers are 12 feet (behind me) from my recliner, sides are 8 feet from me (about 100 degrees from my recliner), and the fronts are 12 feet in front of me. There is a HUGELY noticeable difference from the 5.1 to the 7.1. I believe this is the case for me because of the distances and size of my room. However, Action and Horror movies are really the only movies that showcase the 7.1. Watching a movie like The Descent or Underworld has many scenes were noises literally move circular around the room or back left to side left, etc. If your main viewing pleasure is Drama, Comedy, Romance, etc. then I would say there is no need for 7.1 regardless of your room or ability to do 7.1. If you have the speakers available it is always worth a shot for experimentation. But I'm sure 5.1 will be great (if not optimal) since you say your room does not really have the room.

My setup is 11 feet to the fronts, 6.5 to either side surround and about 6.0 to each of the rear surrounds. I do have a question for your system and others running 7.1.... Do you use DiPoles on the sides or do you use directional speakers? Right now, mine are directional (which I heard would be best for 7.1) but my room is also pretty noisey on the sides (actually getting some echo on testing) so it seems that I hear more from the sides than I do from the rears (even though I have calibrated the room using YPAO). I am thinking about either replacing the directs with Dipoles or focusing more on the room treatments. Do you use Di or Bi poles on your sides in you 7.1 solution. In a 5.1 this is not applicable.