[papashango61]

If I can find the space for a well regarded 3k priced tower, versus going with an equally well regarded 3k bookshelf, is there any downside at all to sound quality going with the tower? for ex - I see great reviews of 5k-6k large monitors from dynaudio, b&w, kef, but they compare them to other large bookshelves in the reviews. Wouldn’t a highly rated 4K floorstander clearly best the more expensive monitors in sound? Posted this randomly in a thread but wanted to open it up to discussion. On a related note, are there any highly regarded smaller towers that may give me the best of both worlds?

 

[Lp85253]

at 3k $$ you better be getting something good with either..the real answer is : a 3k book *should* be better than a 3k tower , but other factors come into play.. including how much you like the sound..

 

[papashango61]

at 3k $$ you better be getting something good with either..the real answer is : a 3k book *should* be better than a 3k tower , but other factors come into play.. including how much you like the sound..

well for instance the bookshelf is going to have higher quality components , like a higher model tweeter. But won’t the tower give a vastly bigger soundstage and more versatile sound, can multitask better etc? When we reach the 3-5k threshold, I feel like towers are so good that won’t a high end bookshelf lose out due to physics limitations no matter how good the tweeter is? Ie would anyone choose a Contour 20 over whatever dynaudios 5k floorstander option is assuming the decision is based on sound rather than a smaller size preference?

 

[Lp85253]

well for instance the bookshelf is going to have higher quality components , like a higher model tweeter. But won’t the tower give a vastly bigger soundstage and more versatile sound, can multitask better etc? When we reach the 3-5k threshold, I feel like towers are so good that won’t a high end bookshelf lose out due to physics limitations no matter how good the tweeter is? Ie would anyone choose a Contour 20 over whatever dynaudios 5k floorstander option is assuming the decision is based on sound rather than a smaller size preference?

the dynamics are compensated for with a subwoofer.. however , if you are going to be strictly 2.0 music then yes a tower may be the better play , but a good sizes book in a small room should also be plenty , then we get back to the quality of component issue...

 

[RayGuy]

Meh. At that price point, it's more about taste/function/the room than any inherent advantage one has over the other. Get both in-house, try 'em out, keep the winner.

 

[callas01]

at 3k $$ you better be getting something good with either..the real answer is : a 3k book *should* be better than a 3k tower , but other factors come into play.. including how much you like the sound..

well for instance the bookshelf is going to have higher quality components , like a higher model tweeter. But won’t the tower give a vastly bigger soundstage and more versatile sound, can multitask better etc? When we reach the 3-5k threshold, I feel like towers are so good that won’t a high end bookshelf lose out due to physics limitations no matter how good the tweeter is? Ie would anyone choose a Contour 20 over whatever dynaudios 5k floorstander option is assuming the decision is based on sound rather than a smaller size preference?

Ok so I owned $4900 Dynaudio Focus 260s and now own $5000 Dynaudio Contour 20s.

The 260s have stronger bass, and I could get them to hit 25hz but at the expense set of bass detail. The 20s bass doesn’t require a subwoofer, it’s deep and powerful as well, I’d say low 30s but haven’t tested it because I’m fully satisfied, but the 20s have greater definition and nuanced textures, making the 260s sound a little flabby in comparison. Now the 20s sound more open, natural, music flows more easily from them. The highs have more detail, and I felt the 260s had tons of detail, but the 20s somehow give a little more insight with (again) ease. The mids are both great, but I think the 20s soundstage is much wider, and instrument separation is much better too. The 260s do play louder more easily, but the 20s play louder then my wife likes them to. I used the same amp with both. I also have a large enough room I can move them around and give plenty of space.

 

[Williams2]

Often times the large bookshelf or small towers can sound better than larger towers even within the same speaker line. This is from the smaller cabinets being more rigid with less resonances. Also, from my experience, the bookshelf speakers can have a better soundstage than the towers, not worse.
Myself I would buy bookshelf speakers with 5 1/4" or 6 1/2" drivers and a sub or 2, and calibrated with ARC or Dirac.
The only reason I'd buy towers is if I needed the absolute most sensitivity.

 

[thebrieze01]

At the same price point - a bookshelf should have better components that the corresponding tower from the same line/manufacturer.

However towers do have some inherent advantages. A well implemented 3 way tower could be better sounding than a 2 way bookshelf, the bass integration is factory set and designed for within the crossover. Doing it yourself with a subwoofer- even with room correction is not always optimal. Generally the sensitivity increases as you go larger with more drivers, which (depending on your circumstances) can also improve sound.

I went through the same dilemma, and eventually chose to go tower, and have not regretted it


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BillP]

I care more about music, and therefore prefer towers. As others have stated, try out both and decide which you prefer. If comparing across different brands of speakers, it really depends on which sound you prefer (between towers and bookshelf speakers, one is not necessarily better than the other).

 

[derekmoore]

I think some context is required for proper advice to be given by the experts around here.

What are your primary listening habits and goals? Music, movies, blend of both?


What are the measurements and construction materials of the room you will use them in?

Most importantly, how do you intend to handle bass management?

Do you already have, or intend to add a sub, or two? or more?


What bass management do you have with your AVR/PrePro?


What is your total budget?


If going the book/stand mount route, you have to factor in the cost of stands and subs also to compare against any tower candidates.

The primary reason many prefer stand mounts + subs is for flexibility of placement of the subs for best in room response on the low end. The best in room response is most often not where the LR speakers need to be for best imaging/sound stage. This is why many also add subs to their towers too. This equates to mo-$.

 

[18Hurts]

Then there is that "other" factor,

Just because it is a tower does not mean you get deeper bass response--depends on the design. For instance, a JTR 212HTR is a "tower" speaker at 40 inches or so tall and around 15 inches wide--very "tower-ish". However, the specs are 70 Hz to 24 KHz and it has two 12 inch woofers and a coaxial compression driver for a three way system. The point of that design is to make it a "tower" to gain massive efficiency--data-bass measured the 80 to 350 Hz efficiency at 105dB at one one/one meter. It is all part of Hoffman's Iron Law, little, low frequency or high efficiency, pick two and lose the third. The JTR lost the low bass extension but has incredible efficiency.

In reality, many people use multiple subs so choosing towers that are more efficient allows higher SPLs of reference levels in larger rooms where it is required. Towers can be that size to either gain lower bass extension, gain much higher efficiency or a mix of both.

Now for a lot of "towers" I see now that seem to be popular is their bookshelf drivers mated with more or slightly larger woofers. That design severely limits the tower to being a bookshelf with better bass (but not as good as a subwoofer) That kind of thing I avoid, get the bookshelf since the mids/highs are limited anyway and pick up an extra sub or two from the cost difference. It all depends on the design, for me I expect more efficiency from a tower, more power handling and less distortion compared to a bookshelf. Sadly, the style is skinny towers with a bunch of wee little woofers which look stylish but when used with subwoofers--a waste of space compared to the bookshelf version.

For the record, I use subwoofers and have used them for decades because it works better for my use and my preferred music. My present speakers are "large bookshelves", at least that is the lie I tell my wife. 20" H X 12.5" W X 12.7" D. They have no deep bass but the mid-bass slam will be felt very easily. My 10" woofer is for the midbass slam and at 98dB 1w/1m--no problem rolling right past reference levels even with basic AVRs.

So as with most things--it depends. If you can, look at other towers with higher efficiency as an option and leave the deep stuff to the drivers that are designed to perform--the subs. Good luck and I hope it works out for you.

 

[sk373]

Now for a lot of "towers" I see now that seem to be popular is their bookshelf drivers mated with more or slightly larger woofers. That design severely limits the tower to being a bookshelf with better bass (but not as good as a subwoofer) That kind of thing I avoid, get the bookshelf since the mids/highs are limited anyway and pick up an extra sub or two from the cost difference. It all depends on the design, for me I expect more efficiency from a tower, more power handling and less distortion compared to a bookshelf. Sadly, the style is skinny towers with a bunch of wee little woofers which look stylish but when used with subwoofers--a waste of space compared to the bookshelf version.

I happen to have tower speakers that fit this description. I went with small towers for two reasons:

1) We don't have space for anything larger, and more importantly,
2) Our cat can't easily knock them over vs stand mounted bookshelf speakers.

 

[RayGuy]

I happen to have tower speakers that fit this description. I went with small towers for two reasons:

1) We don't have space for anything larger, and more importantly,
2) Our cat can't easily knock them over vs stand mounted bookshelf speakers.

[email protected] cats making all the speaker decisions around here! Instead of WAF, it should be CAF!

 

[papashango61]

the dynamics are compensated for with a subwoofer.. however , if you are going to be strictly 2.0 music then yes a tower may be the better play , but a good sizes book in a small room should also be plenty , then we get back to the quality of component issue...

Ahh the sub! Thats why...well no sub for me as I am in an apartment.

Ok so I owned $4900 Dynaudio Focus 260s and now own $5000 Dynaudio Contour 20s.

The 260s have stronger bass, and I could get them to hit 25hz but at the expense set of bass detail. The 20s bass doesn’t require a subwoofer, it’s deep and powerful as well, I’d say low 30s but haven’t tested it because I’m fully satisfied, but the 20s have greater definition and nuanced textures, making the 260s sound a little flabby in comparison. Now the 20s sound more open, natural, music flows more easily from them. The highs have more detail, and I felt the 260s had tons of detail, but the 20s somehow give a little more insight with (again) ease. The mids are both great, but I think the 20s soundstage is much wider, and instrument separation is much better too. The 260s do play louder more easily, but the 20s play louder then my wife likes them to. I used the same amp with both. I also have a large enough room I can move them around and give plenty of space.

Great anecdote! Do you prefer the 20s overall if u have to keep one?

Often times the large bookshelf or small towers can sound better than larger towers even within the same speaker line. This is from the smaller cabinets being more rigid with less resonances. Also, from my experience, the bookshelf speakers can have a better soundstage than the towers, not worse.
Myself I would buy bookshelf speakers with 5 1/4" or 6 1/2" drivers and a sub or 2, and calibrated with ARC or Dirac.
The only reason I'd buy towers is if I needed the absolute most sensitivity.

Great point on sensitivity

I think some context is required for proper advice to be given by the experts around here.

What are your primary listening habits and goals? Music, movies, blend of both?


What are the measurements and construction materials of the room you will use them in?

Most importantly, how do you intend to handle bass management?

Do you already have, or intend to add a sub, or two? or more?


What bass management do you have with your AVR/PrePro?


What is your total budget?


If going the book/stand mount route, you have to factor in the cost of stands and subs also to compare against any tower candidates.

The primary reason many prefer stand mounts + subs is for flexibility of placement of the subs for best in room response on the low end. The best in room response is most often not where the LR speakers need to be for best imaging/sound stage. This is why many also add subs to their towers too. This equates to mo-$.

20 x 15 room, 100% music, no subs, carpeted. Apartment. No bass management..Ideally speaker budget is around $2500 but im someone who could do something really stupid (but brilliant) and wake up and decide to buy 805's instead, or these cool dynaudios mentioned above. I have stands right now that bookshelfs sit on, but are stands where you screw them in absolutely important? I can see that being true for bass? But whenever i go into a demo room, the tower soundstage is so much taller and sound fuller than the bookshelf, even in music having very little bass, so it got me thinking "why would i get a bookshelf" .. EX: Listening to 705s2 and then 702s2 or even 704 (yes i know the 705s are cheapest). Its a big difference in listening experience, even in acoustic music

 

[pase22]

well for instance the bookshelf is going to have higher quality components , like a higher model tweeter. But won’t the tower give a vastly bigger soundstage and more versatile sound, can multitask better etc? When we reach the 3-5k threshold, I feel like towers are so good that won’t a high end bookshelf lose out due to physics limitations no matter how good the tweeter is? Ie would anyone choose a Contour 20 over whatever dynaudios 5k floorstander option is assuming the decision is based on sound rather than a smaller size preference?

I think this would apply more in the lower price brackets. A pair of $1500 bookshelf speakers likely puts you a level up from $1500 towers. When you get up into the 3-4k range, the advantages quickly diminish.

 

[papashango61]

I think this would apply more in the lower price brackets. A pair of $1500 bookshelf speakers likely puts you a level up from $1500 towers. When you get up into the 3-4k range, the advantages quickly diminish.

Are you saying at 3k+ range the tower advantages diminish?

 

[papashango61]

A huge question i forgot to ask - the towers i am looking at have a deeper cabinet than most bookshelves, but one for exemple Aria 926 is front ported: does this mean i can have it closer to the backwall thus diminishing some of its (too big) size downsides?

 

[derekmoore]

Ahh the sub! Thats why...well no sub for me as I am in an apartment.


Great anecdote! Do you prefer the 20s overall if u have to keep one?


Great point on sensitivity


20 x 15 room, 100% music, no subs, carpeted. Apartment. No bass management..Ideally speaker budget is around $2500 but im someone who could do something really stupid (but brilliant) and wake up and decide to buy 805's instead, or these cool dynaudios mentioned above. I have stands right now that bookshelfs sit on, but are stands where you screw them in absolutely important? I can see that being true for bass? But whenever i go into a demo room, the tower soundstage is so much taller and sound fuller than the bookshelf, even in music having very little bass, so it got me thinking "why would i get a bookshelf" .. EX: Listening to 705s2 and then 702s2 or even 704 (yes i know the 705s are cheapest). Its a big difference in listening experience, even in acoustic music

No subs, no bass management, pure two channel music.


This would lean towards speakers with low end extension down into the 30's at least IMO. IIRC, the lowest note on a piano is ~27.5htz. On bass guitar its ~42htz. Pipe organs can get down to single digits. So, the type of music you plan on listening to will play a role here. Some of these higher end books can play down to the 30's but not many. I'd be looking at that low end extension and the trade off with efficiency that low extension compromises to help guide my selection of a short list. You have a pretty big room to fill so efficiency should be an important consideration depending up what you are driving them with (sorry I forgot what you have for an amp if you stated already). There will be far fewer books' that meet this criteria than towers.

 

[papashango61]

Ahh the sub! Thats why...well no sub for me as I am in an apartment.


Great anecdote! Do you prefer the 20s overall if u have to keep one?


Great point on sensitivity


20 x 15 room, 100% music, no subs, carpeted. Apartment. No bass management..Ideally speaker budget is around $2500 but im someone who could do something really stupid (but brilliant) and wake up and decide to buy 805's instead, or these cool dynaudios mentioned above. I have stands right now that bookshelfs sit on, but are stands where you screw them in absolutely important? I can see that being true for bass? But whenever i go into a demo room, the tower soundstage is so much taller and sound fuller than the bookshelf, even in music having very little bass, so it got me thinking "why would i get a bookshelf" .. EX: Listening to 705s2 and then 702s2 or even 704 (yes i know the 705s are cheapest). Its a big difference in listening experience, even in acoustic music

No subs, no bass management, pure two channel music.


This would lean towards speakers with low end extension down into the 30's at least IMO. IIRC, the lowest note on a piano is ~27.5htz. On bass guitar its ~42htz. Pipe organs can get down to single digits. So, the type of music you plan on listening to will play a role here. Some of these higher end books can play down to the 30's but not many. I'd be looking at that low end extension and the trade off with efficiency that low extension compromises to help guide my selection of a short list. You have a pretty big room to fill so efficiency should be an important consideration depending up what you are driving them with (sorry I forgot what you have for an amp if you stated already). There will be far fewer books' that meet this criteria than towers.

I have a Yamaha 2 chan 100wpc receiver. Worst case I can upgrade. Can you look at my space and tell me if you think towers are my best bet? I actually have it set up so speakers are on the long wall, but with the couch where it is now it’s 9-10ft from ears to speakers

 

[derekmoore]

You have people with far more expertise than I do already responding to your questions, so I'd wait for their feedback.


But from what I gather you are aprox 2400 cubic ft. So not too big for books'. Key will be getting an even bass response down to the low 40's. I'm assuming you are not listening to heavy pipe organ music or piano intensive stuff so straight RnR will do acceptably well with 40htz speakers and no sub. Although I'd still want at least two sub's but that's just me.


One thing that stands out from the pic, is the position of your couch. Having it positioned against the back wall will always subject you to bass nulls. Experiment with pulling it forward a bit to see how it affects the low end of your existing setup.