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So I just watched the 1/2 time show of the Superbowl (never seen one before, could care less about the game), which coincided with me hanging and very roughly tweaking a retubed XG 110 on my ceiling, the first time in 3 weeks that I had a projector on my ceiling, DOH!


So as I'm watching and marvelling at how nice the image is, it occurs to me that the colors on the broadcast are super rich even as compared to DVD.


Does anyone know or has anyone observed this as well? I personally can't stand washed out colors, and even back in my TV days

I'd bump up the color, but I can't help but think that if I had access to a color intensity control I'd actually bump it down a hair in these HDTV broadcasts.


But it sure makes for good demo source material. I can't wait until they release an HD decoder with a built in hard drive recorder, they're not available in Canada yet..:(


Curt
 

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Curt,

Colors are more rich which is wonderful. What I have discovered also however is that the blacks are almost to black. The saturation of the dark scenes in HD exceed by a significant amount those in SD broadcasts. Has anyone else made this observation or is my CRT just jacked?
 

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Nope, I've nopticed the same thing about the blacks. Makes me wish I had a gamma adjustment on my HD reciever.


Cary
 

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Curt,

I'm curious about this statement "...that the colors on the broadcast are super rich even as compared to DVD". Even as? To me, DVD's are very close to unwatchable if you view much HD. They're not even a distant second unless the projector isn't capable of resolving the difference (or as much of the difference as there is). I'm not a game fan either, but the Superbowl on CBS was some excellent HD and the colors seemed very natural to me.


IMO HD is the standard by which you judge the rest of your equipment, including DVD playback. There's a handful of DVD's which have reasonable detail, fairly saturated colors and a decent black rendition... but the majority are abysmal for one reason or another.


D-Theatre D-VHS tapes (transferred from film, or of video origin) are also excellent, and well transferred quality movies as seen on the likes of HD-Net, Discovery HD -- even Showtime and HBO HD are way superior to what us consumers get to buy on DVD.


For those of us that are forever tweaking and improving our projectors, unfortunately, the difference between HD and DVD gets a lot more obvious.


--Bill
 

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Yeah... HD makes everything else look bad.


Try scaling a DVD using the MyHD or a BravoD1 and you will notice the difference as well vs SVideo or otherwise scaled DVD.


SD is just crap. SD via DirecTV or Dish is even worse (from the compression). Very washed out...
 

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I agree with Bill's comment about DVD being close to unwatchable after steady exposure to HD. This weekend I'm going to re-do my mechanical setup to ensure that my projector is optimized for HDTV. Since I've had HD in my home theater, my DVD purchases have all but stopped. Bring on HD-DVD!!



Johnny
 

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I watched the game on my 1208s/2 DTC 100 and wish a scaled DVD would even come close.


Everything, colors, sharpness, blacks, saturation, is perfect and don,t see any issues that would weigh in any directions


With HDTV so sharp it makes you wonder sometimes that you haven,t set your PJ up just "right" when you put in a scaled DVD, but low and behold that HD signal just nails any doubts.


David
 

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Four HD pixels fit into the space of one NTSC pixel, one would assume that would mean the possible color depth is four times that of regular video, hence, the richer, more vivid and saturated colors.
 

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I was involved with a forum post not too long ago where someone had claimed that a Sony D50 would not reproduce "component" video properly and they claimed to have a test pattern that was "special" for component video. I asked what "standard" the pattern followed and if I could get a copy of the pattern and that was the last I heard, he never responded.


It's true that HDTV followed a different color matrixing scheme that is slightly different than the present one used for NTSC and follows a new SMPTE recommended practice or standard, however, it really shouldn't pose that much of a problem. As for the blacks, if your projector is setup for a 0 IRE pedestal level (Japanese EIAJ standard), you should at least bring it up to 7.5 IRE units (American EIA standard) to avoid crushing the blacks, or create a new projector setup with a higher "brightness" control level.


If I am able to obtain a test pattern for this new standard, I will post it. I haven't been paying too much attention to any new standard approvals and was under the impression that this "matrix" change was simply a recommended practice and not yet been approved as an actual "Standard".
 

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How many of you that say DVD is really bad are not using a HTPC? A properly setup HTPC makes it look close to hd and rich in color. Are most of you using progressive scan set top players or just line doublers or maybe moshitzu's?


True, nothing beats true HD but good dvd's are a close second via htpc or spendy scalers.

I am using a marquee and scaling dvd to as much as 1600x1200 though, so that may have something to do with it also.


Don't get me wrong dvd isn't perfect and lots of dvd's are just plain poor, but with the right equipment the good transfers are still stunning just not quite as much as hd.


On a side note: I recorded most of the superbowl via my FusionII btw, the full stream uncompressed ate up 30gigs plus... I'm not a football fan either but just wanted to see the quality. It seems that gamma ramped up a bit between half time did anyone else notice this? Also you could see on a big screen that Janet Jackson staged the boob thing. A blond female dancer to her right (our left) went to rip her top off and she chickened out and stopped her, pushed her hand away and you can clearly see it in the set before that guy came on. Then when the guy (don't know his name) ripped it off you can clearly see the silver pastie she was wearing so sure, I'm sure she wears pasties all the time. Tell me that wasn't planned all along.


All easy to see in HD on a big screen. I love HD, I want HD-DVD bad too, but I wouldn't put regular dvd into the unwatchable category just yet.


Troy
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by techman707
I was involved with a forum post not too long ago where someone had claimed that a Sony D50 would not reproduce "component" video properly and they claimed to have a test pattern that was "special" for component video. I asked what "standard" the pattern followed and if I could get a copy of the pattern and that was the last I heard, he never responded.


It's true that HDTV followed a different color matrixing scheme that is slightly different than the present one used for NTSC and follows a new SMPTE recommended practice or standard, however, it really shouldn't pose that much of a problem. As for the blacks, if your projector is setup for a 0 IRE pedestal level (Japanese EIAJ standard), you should at least bring it up to 7.5 IRE units (American EIA standard) to avoid crushing the blacks, or create a new projector setup with a higher "brightness" control level.


If I am able to obtain a test pattern for this new standard, I will post it. I haven't been paying too much attention to any new standard approvals and was under the impression that this "matrix" change was simply a recommended practice and not yet been approved as an actual "Standard".
Very well put Bruce. If I could add anything, A true HD signal should have 0 IRE pedestal. And a proper setup for HDTV should have dual setups in the projector, one for 0 IRE and the other for 7.5 IRE. Mainly because I've found some HDTV signals to have one or the other IRE pedestals. And being able to select from projector memory the proper setup, would make for a more consistant HD performance. After all, the real performance of HD really depends on having the display device at the correct black level.
 

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They can't seem to agree on the pedestal, or even how the matrix should be. I have now seen at least 3 different stations broadcasting HDTV using 3 different methods. It now appears that the SMPTE is working jointly with the ISO on a number of standards involving HDTV, so it appears that NOTHING is forthcoming very soon.


PBS in New York is broadcasting 1080I with one strange setup, ABC (network feed) broadcasting 720P 7.5 IRE, CBS (network feed 1080I 0 IRE. Since I really never checked to see what all these so called "HDTV Ready" rear screen units all the stores are selling, NOTHING seems to be clear. It wouldn't surprise me if the FCC pushed back the "mandatory" start date and changeover for HDTV ONLY broadcasts. I guess the reason that none of the TV manufacturers have talked much about how people with regular NTSC televisions MUST buy "set top boxes" in order to continue to use their televisions will probably create a real backlash and they want to continue to mislead people so they can sell expensive XBR TV's they will really become boat anchors with wires.
 

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It's the FCC. No one has ever been able to CLEARLY understand what they're allowing. If they could only get their writings to be clear, half of these problems would not exist. The other half comes from manuafacturers rushing to press (manufacture), and being willing to pay a fine if wrong, because they're pretty aware of the process. Just think, if the FCC knew what it was doing there's no way there would be so much confusion out there with "standards". And this happens everytime with everything, unless HOLLYWOOD mandates that it should be one way, and that way must not effect Hollywood sales, The FCC will usually defaut back to their system of not being clear in their government documents on anything. I doubt if anyone ever really understood a FCC document. There just might be one single rule in one of the FCC documents, it's just that no one will ever know what it means.


There are standards for component Beta, and there's test patterns that will show correct component color space, but there's not a test pattern for true HDTV component. This one still has everyone waitng on the fence.
 

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Just as an aside Curt...... How did JJ's Boob look in bigscreen HD. ;)

That in itself is worth the effort of mounting a projector.





Sorry i couldnt resist.
 

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But seriously a lot depends on what is being broadcast to you locally. Our CBS Affiliate (Phila) Was broadcasting a full 1080i signal. It looked spectacular. Fox was broadcasting its pregame show in HD. In Phila tihs means 480p. It looks real bad.


There is increased color saturation in hd and it really looks good on a good projector.
 

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BTW Pccinema, it wasnt a pastie it is a Sunburst nipple ring.:D


I'm sorry for drooling.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by emdawgz1
But seriously a lot depends on what is being broadcast to you locally. Our CBS Affiliate (Phila) Was broadcasting a full 1080i signal. It looked spectacular. Fox was broadcasting its pregame show in HD. In Phila tihs means 480p. It looks real bad.


There is increased color saturation in hd and it really looks good on a good projector.
CBS and PBS are both broadcasting 1080I and the CBS network feed comes out of NY. Sure it's spectacular, that's not the problem, the problem is conformity. The FCC took a long time to finally approve an "HDTV System", yet, there are ISO and SMPTE standards related to the "approved" system that have yet to be finalized. How can manufacturers sell systems if the "basic" setup hasn't been clearly defined and published.


As for projectors, you can setup a projector to "conform" more or less to most anything broadcast, but it's just a subjective "looks good to me" setup. Just like the SMPTE, which finally came out with the "SMPTE Color Bars" that had the I Q boxes and the reversed cyan and magenta strips that allowed the use of a Blue Filter to confirm proper setup, the SAME THING should be available to check the HDTV setup, hue and color saturation. Until they finally AGREE on what those levels should be and spell it out clearly, each broadcaster will be free to use their "best guess" on what should be done.


Apparently, the only thing the FCC really finalized, is the frequencies to be assigned to HDTV, which at this point in time, appear to be NO bargain.
 

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Looked like a boob... Not really a big deal unless you are under 10 and never had cable. That was awfully big to be a nipple ring. I never did like nipple rings, detracts from the natural beauty.


(sorry to take your thread so off topic Curt)


Colors were great..


Troy
 

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looked like a boob? i wasn,t sure either, to me there was nothing to see, if they want to flash some boobs they should talk to al bundy about some bigun,s not wanna bes can,t understand what the fuss is about , i was more offended and embarrased by kid rock defiling the flag than j.j..............
 
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