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Hey guys im new to HT so any help is appreciated.


I am looking at getting a set of Def Tech speakers sold at Best Buy(I work there so employee discount is crucial to me being able to afford them).


Im also getting a Denon 1910. (only 5.1 for now though)


I was recommended to go ahead and get one of the Def Tech subs they had. My price range for a sub will be >$300 dollars. But with my employee discount being about half, im looking at a sub ~$500-$600 BBY price.


I was thinking though I could maybe do better than one of the Def Tech subs, either in the store through another make, through various manufacturer deals I can get, or even maybe a sweet online deal. I know when people get speakers they are recommended to get the same brand as they "match". Is this the same with subs?


More specifically...could I throw in a Klipsch sub like the RW10d, RW12d, or SW450 to go with the Def Tech speakers? I can get a great deal on all of these.


Also I saw some people recommending 2 cheaper subs over one average priced sub...but my question is with it being a 5.1 or 7.1, how to I connect 2 subs? Just wire them into the same output port? (I know my vocab is lacking)


Thanks any help is appreciated
 

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I'll bet 80% or more (of dedicated room theaters) have a sub of a different brand. You want matching on all your mains, but in most cases that doesn't hold true with the sub.


Two subs is preferable to one, as it allows you more placement options when tackling room acoustical issues. However, in this price range, I would not get two $150 subs. I'd use the whole budget on one sub, unless you could get your budget into the $600 range minimum.
 

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No, matching is not at all necessary.


There are far better subs for the money... but we don't know just how big of a discount you get to judge that. Def Tech makes "good" subs (nothing great, at least not for the $$) from what I've read - but I've never owned one.


What matters more to receiving recommended alternatives is the cubic feet you're trying to fill with the sub and your target price range for just the sub.
 

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I'd say that with your employee discount, you'll might still be paying more dollars per value earned by buying from a big box compared with what you can get with one of the small, direct purchase companies. There are some real deals out there if you look for them and/or wait for some of the usual suspects here to hold a sale, or pull from B stock.


I haven't been able to get the details on this sub yet, it may be too small for your needs, but it's $199 for one or $329 for two.
http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/final.html


A co-worker got their LFM1-Compact a while back for $319 shipped. It is one of the best value subs I've seen yet.


Check out the review for this $25 speaker:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-20...html?tag=mncol
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=300-652


Anyway, don't let your discount skew you away from what might be a better value from one of the small guys.


And to answer your question, I've only ever built one system that had a matching sub, and it would have been better off with a sub from someone else. (Expensive too, B&W).
 

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The primary matching that's important with subs is that it (they) blend seamlessly with the mains, but most subs can do that (with the help of the receiver, anyway). That means getting the crossover frequency and phase right, matching amplitude and group delay, and generally making sure the sub is not the limitation in your system (e.g. enough sound output).


As for speaker matching, I always though matching L/C/R was worthwhile but not super critical, and really never worried about the surrounds or rears. When I brought my old Maggies out storage I stuck with my Infinity center and Mirage rears to save time, effort, and money. After listening to a few other systems, it started to make sense to match the speakers better. I added a Magnepan center, then the surrounds, and in my system to my ears the difference was well worth it.


That said, the Infinity system (replacing the Mirage L/C/R/sub I was using) worked fine for me with the Mirage sats for surrounds and in fact the Magnepan L/C/R worked OK with the Mirage sats as well. I just like my current set-up better. So, I have moved from "it doesn't really matter" to "it depends" on the whole matching issue. Having a well-matched system can be very good, e.g. a friend has an all-B&W 80x system that sounds great, but I am not hard over on it. Also, "matching" does not always mean the same brand etc., and my recent experiences have taught me (but perhaps nobody else) that some systems (and listeners) are more sensitive to matching than others.


YMMV - Don
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by diamonddelts /forum/post/18811809


I've never bought into the speakers matching bs. Some of the best systems I've ever heard were comprised of a hosh posh of different brands.

You're clearly entitled to your opinion. However, there is real benefit in matching the speakers. When sounds pan from one speaker to another, the timbre of the sound should remain the same from speaker to speaker. The best chance of that happening is with identical speakers in all positions.


About 2 years ago, I upgraded my speaker system and got 3 identical speakers for the front mains. I also placed them all at the same height, with the CC behind an acoustically transparent screen. It was one of the best decisions I've ever made. Pans across the front soundstage are now seamless. Lock up of the audio with the visual image is also greatly improved. I will never go back to mis-matched speakers again.


To the OP: It is not necessary to "match" a subwoofer with the speakers. The sub plays a different frequency range than the speakers, so there is no "timbre-matching" involved. What *is* important is ensuring the speakers have some response below the intended crossover point and the sub has some response above the crossover point. This will ensure a good "splice" at the crossover. IOW, you don't want speakers that only go down to 120 Hz matched with a sub that only goes up to 80 Hz. Pay attention to the frequency responses of both the speakers and sub and ensure they have some overlap and you'll be fine.


Craig
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by surap /forum/post/18819038


I think it is hard to match a very big 18" subwoofer with very small satelites. Not that it isnt possible, but I think there would be a significant difference in sound.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 /forum/post/18819588


Not if the sub is correctly setup.

I basically agree with both of these comments. If the sub has good response up to and slightly above the -3 dB point of the speakers, the "splice" should be fine. The bigger concern is matching output potential between a large sub and small speakers.


Bottom line, small speakers *suck* in an HT environment. The mains should have good, solid output to at least a half octave below the intended crossover point, with a full octave being more ideal. This requires larger cabinets and larger drivers. Bookshelf sized speakers can work, but small "satellites" are out of their league, and should only be used in modest, budget systems. It wouldn't make much sense to mate a large, 18" sub with small satellite speakers, even if they could be "blended" properly.


Craig
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john /forum/post/18817925


You're clearly entitled to your opinion. However, there is real benefit in matching the speakers. When sounds pan from one speaker to another, the timbre of the sound should remain the same from speaker to speaker. The best chance of that happening is with identical speakers in all positions.


About 2 years ago, I upgraded my speaker system and got 3 identical speakers for the front mains. I also placed them all at the same height, with the CC behind an acoustically transparent screen. It was one of the best decisions I've ever made. Pans across the front soundstage are now seamless. Lock up of the audio with the visual image is also greatly improved. I will never go back to mis-matched speakers again.


To the OP: It is not necessary to "match" a subwoofer with the speakers. The sub plays a different frequency range than the speakers, so there is no "timbre-matching" involved. What *is* important is ensuring the speakers have some response below the intended crossover point and the sub has some response above the crossover point. This will ensure a good "splice" at the crossover. IOW, you don't want speakers that only go down to 120 Hz matched with a sub that only goes up to 80 Hz. Pay attention to the frequency responses of both the speakers and sub and ensure they have some overlap and you'll be fine.


Craig

I can only detail my own experience with very recent upgradings of speakers. There has always been this idea of matched drivers being better from a timbre point of view and that is what I have found to be true. Many months ago I had Polk R50's as the front speakers and then added an Infinity PC350 center fill speaker and then an Infinity PS212 powered subwoofer (12"). The R50's were replaced with a pair of 30 year old Infinity Qb's that I had lying around. Of course, the sound was much better. Most recently Fry's had a sale and I bought a pair of Infinity Cascade 9's. Much, much better sound and to be expected. Than I replaced the PC350 with a Cascade 3 C and was amazed at the difference in the overall sound. Note the three fronts are now all matched drivers from the Infinity Cascade series. I was able to buy an Infinity Cascade 15 powered subwoofer for a reasonable price off of e-Bay. The difference between it and the PS212 was not subtle. At first I thought that I was hallucinating because there was an interaction between the subwoofer and the output of the other speakers. I had thought that the AVR just put out its signal to the various speakers, but it turned out to not be so simple. With the Cascade 15, everything was a lot cleaner, not just the bass. It was like the PS212 was muddying up the sound and the Cascade 15 lifted the veil.
 
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