[dpombrio]

I am still building my HT room in my basement (11'W x 18'L x 8'H). I want to pull the trigger on a new sub or subs. I would like to keep it under 1500.00 if possible. This room is going to be for sport, movies and some music. I really want to have slamming bass. These are just some of the subs that I have been looking at

1. A7-450 (ported)

2. A7-450s (sealed) - duals with 1300 watt amps

3. MFW-15 -duals

4. EpiK Tower or Castle

Have I missed any??

I am in the same boat as many who just don't know what direction to go. I mention Craig because of his great work and time in this arena. Any and all opinions will be appreciated.


Thanks, D-rock

 

[goneten]

In terms of unadulterated pure performance, dual MFW-15's will approach the clean output capabilities of the Elemental Designs A7-900 (according to Craigsub's test procedures).


From a subjective sound quality standpoint, all subwoofers that you have mentioned will most likely sound fantastic. A single MFW-15 basically equals the JL Audio Fathom for home theater and music. Craigsub is close to completing testing on dual MFW-15's.


My guess is that he will give the pairing a higher score due to the elevated output figures that dual subwoofers provide. I have no clue how dual A7-450's (sealed) will perform. But sealed subwoofers are generally less efficient than their ported counterparts so who knows.


One thing I like about the company AV123 is that they offer different real wood finishes for their products. I think there are four finishes for the MFW-15. This subwoofer actually looks like fine furniture. Do the subwoofers from Elemental Designs give you that same option ?


--Regards,

 

[dpombrio]

Goneten,


Thanks for the your input. I don't know what the A7-450 can do or the A7s-450. I like the idea of dual MFW - 15's and finish is not really important as I will have a light controlled room with a dark ceiling. (Black is fine) I probably will change my mind at least 20 to 30 more times based on the feedback I get from here. I really respect the posters here (especially the veterans - Craig etc.) as they seem to have info and opinions I would not have come up with myself. Keep the suggestions coming. I need all the help I can get.


D-rock

 

[goneten]

The most cost effective solution out of the subwoofers mentioned are dual MFW-15 subwoofers bar none. Dual MFW-15's will cost you $1k.


A single A7-450 should outperform the MFW-15 in pretty much every area. Clean low distortion output, extension and linearity. It also costs $1300.


Dual MFW-15's will most certainly out gun a single A7-450 in outright air shifting capability. It may not be able to play back as low but it will certainly play back louder within it's respective bandwidth.


My advice is to go with dual MFW-15 subwoofers. In my opinion, it is the best value option right now of all the subwoofers mentioned.


--Regards,

 

[CADOBHuK]

I have exactly same room dimensions as yours and I bought a single a7s-450..I didn't get it yet, but hopefully it will be fantastic, since everything else from ED is, for the price. It should be more than enough for such small a room, I hope, I know its sealed and the box isn't that huge but I also know its an 18" with 1300 watts. For $785 shipped (old price) it might've been the best bang/buck deal ever. Or not. Craig is not gonna test it which is a real shame.

I think all your options listed are overkills for that room size, but if you got the money, why not. Out of those options I would personally get a single Tower - plenty of output, extending really low, amazing sound quality. About mwf-15's, well I'm not sure how objective was the score that subwoofer recieved. Quite possibly it was 100% on, but I'd like to read some more impressions of other people against other top contenders.

 

[goneten]



Quote:
Originally Posted by CADOBHuK /forum/post/0


About mwf-15's, well I'm not sure how objective was the score that subwoofer recieved. Quite possibly it was 100% on, but I'd like to read some more impressions of other people against other top contenders.

I assume that all the subwoofers tested by Craigsub were done so under fair conditions. Each and every subwoofer was subjected to the same testing procedures and hence I must assume accurate results.


Subjective listening on the other hand can never be objective. However the panel of judges favored the MFW-15's sound quality over and above the Velodyne DD-18 which has been the reference for many years.


However it is still their opinion but an opinion that shouldn't be overlooked.


--Regards,

 

[saddlesore]

If you desire a speedy delivery, the Epik's should be the first choice. Then either of the eD combos. I would expect the AV123 sub to be delivered in 6-8 months at the earliest. It has taken them over four months to deliver my Rocket speakers (still not here). The Rockets are a mature product in AV123's line. On the otherhand, people have been on the preorder waiting list for the MFW-15's for almost two years. Couple this with high demand from Craig's rave review... you'll be waiting until Thanksgiving or Christmas.

 

[iceperson]



Quote:
Originally Posted by dpombrio /forum/post/12895645


I am still building my HT room in my basement (11'W x 18'L x 8'H). I want to pull the trigger on a new sub or subs. I would like to keep it under 1500.00 if possible. This room is going to be for sport, movies and some music. I really want to have slamming bass. These are just some of the subs that I have been looking at

1. A7-450 (ported)

2. A7-450s (sealed) - duals with 1300 watt amps

3. MFW-15 -duals

4. EpiK Tower or Castle

Have I missed any??

I am in the same boat as many who just don't know what direction to go. I mention Craig because of his great work and time in this arena. Any and all opinions will be appreciated.


Thanks, D-rock

My room is about 2000ft^3 (unsealed) and my A7S-450 can hurt you. I can't imagine 2 of them in that small of an area.

 

[mjg100]



Quote:
Originally Posted by iceperson /forum/post/12898464


My room is about 2000ft^3 (unsealed) and my A7S-450 can hurt you. I can't imagine 2 of them in that small of an area.

I agree. People think sealed, so it will not put out enough db, but that just is not the case. Also I think it is easier to blend a sealed sub into your system compared to a ported sub.

 

[Zinje]

sorry to hijack your thread... but i currently have the SVS 2039PC+ how would the A7-450 compare? Big Improvement!?

 

[ribbit]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zinje /forum/post/12903026


sorry to hijack your thread... but i currently have the SVS 2039PC+ how would the A7-450 compare? Big Improvement!?

let's see, gigantic enclosure ... check. bigger driver ... check. bigger amp ... check.


yes I would think so.

i'll have my pair of A7-450's in about a month (ocean freight) ... I'll definitely post pics and comments.

 

[Zinje]

What about the A7S-450 sealed version.

 

[warlord260]



Quote:
Originally Posted by goneten /forum/post/12896056


In terms of unadulterated pure performance, dual MFW-15's will approach the clean output capabilities of the Elemental Designs A7-900 (according to Craigsub's test procedures).


From a subjective sound quality standpoint, all subwoofers that you have mentioned will most likely sound fantastic. A single MFW-15 basically equals the JL Audio Fathom for home theater and music. Craigsub is close to completing testing on dual MFW-15's.


My guess is that he will give the pairing a higher score due to the elevated output figures that dual subwoofers provide. I have no clue how dual A7-450's (sealed) will perform. But sealed subwoofers are generally less efficient than their ported counterparts so who knows.


One thing I like about the company AV123 is that they offer different real wood finishes for their products. I think there are four finishes for the MFW-15. This subwoofer actually looks like fine furniture. Do the subwoofers from Elemental Designs give you that same option ?


--Regards,

a pair of mfw-15= to a a7-900? if so that would make it the best bang for your dollar ever!

isnt the a7-900 dual 18" woofers vs. 2 15" woofers with less power.

how could this work, please explain?

im not trying to cause problems, i just dont understand.

 

[David James]



Quote:
Originally Posted by dpombrio /forum/post/12896599


Goneten,


Thanks for the your input. I don't know what the A7-450 can do or the A7s-450. I like the idea of dual MFW - 15's and finish is not really important as I will have a light controlled room with a dark ceiling. (Black is fine) I probably will change my mind at least 20 to 30 more times based on the feedback I get from here. I really respect the posters here (especially the veterans - Craig etc.) as they seem to have info and opinions I would not have come up with myself. Keep the suggestions coming. I need all the help I can get.


D-rock

A note of caution. There is a lot of advice, suggestions, recommendations being thrown around by people who've never heard the subs in question. Their opinions may be correct, I don't know, but just so you aware they may be based on interpretations of others opinions which, may also not be from first hand experience.

 

[goneten]



Quote:
Originally Posted by David James /forum/post/0


A note of caution. There is a lot of advice, suggestions, recommendations being thrown around by people who've never heard the subs in question. Their opinions may be correct, I don't know, but just so you aware they may be based on interpretations of others opinions which, may also not be from first hand experience.

The test figures speak for themselves. Co-locating subwoofers yields a predictable increase in clean output. One can extrapolate from there. Note I have not discussed subjective sound quality only output figures and only output figures pertaining to Craigsub's test mythology.


--Regards,

 

[goneten]



Quote:
Originally Posted by warlord260 /forum/post/0


a pair of mfw-15= to a a7-900? if so that would make it the best bang for your dollar ever!

In the 20 hz-63 hz response range, dual MFW-15's should equal or out gun a single A7-900 if co-located. Add a maximum 6 dB's to the clean output figures of a single MFW-15 to attain this feat.

Quote:
isnt the a7-900 dual 18" woofers vs. 2 15" woofers with less power.

how could this work, please explain?

The A7-900 uses a very large enclosure tuned low. If memory serves, it is tuned quite a bit lower than the MFW-15. There are penalties. It will sacrifice output above the tuning point. How much I'm not sure.


But extrapolating based on Craigsub's figures, an additional 6 dB's will put it at the top of the heap and almost equal 20 hz performance.

Quote:
im not trying to cause problems, i just dont understand.

No problem.


--Regards,

 

[iceperson]



Quote:
Originally Posted by goneten /forum/post/12906930


The test figures speak for themselves. Co-locating subwoofers yields a predictable increase in clean output. One can extrapolate from there. Note I have not discussed subjective sound quality only output figures and only output figures pertaining to Craigsub's test mythology.


--Regards,

I hear this a lot, but can never find numbers to validate it. Do you have any links where I can read up about it? This is the only article I can find that gives any real numbers.

 

[warlord260]

goneten, thanks for explaining. after i posted i was thiking about it and went back and checked craigsubs #s. in theory you are correct.

im sure either of these subs would be wonderful.

i ordered a caliber that was wrecked in shipping. magnets broken on driver,amp rattled, and broked sound port. i am now waiting on new parts that will upgrade me to a tower;caliber and tower share same cabinet.

as of now my theater is basicly disassembled,had to move speakers to locate cabinet, then had to take apart cabinet, to try to repair finding broken parts.

my journey started beginning of dec. when i ordered a5-350,but cancelled after 5 wks. awaiting wood shop,then ordered the epik-now i sit with theater in disarray.

i would just like to get back to not waiting on something, its been a long time.

 

[Mark Seaton]

Hi goneten,


While I appreciate the enthusiasm, even I'll have to agree that you are reaching a bit with the number extrapolation. I haven't seen measurements of the subwoofers being discussed under the same conditions and time of measurement. There is plenty of room for tolerances and variances. I'm happy with the results of the MFW-15, but there are still some realities of physics to deal with. The bulk, external volume of the A7-900 is ~3.5x that of the MFW-15. I wouldn't hesitate to compare 2 pairs of MFW-15s to the A7-900, where that would be a very fun comparison.

We should also remember that the subjective power/output can deviate from the quantified output, especially where EQ, limiting, and headroom vs. frequency come into play. A subwoofer can be pretty well characterized by a range of measurements, but never by one quantity, and at the end someone still needs to plug it in and confirm something obvious wasn't missed in measurements.

 

[Tack]



Quote:
Originally Posted by goneten /forum/post/12906930


Craigsub's test mythology.

hehe