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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a Panny 42" HD plasma & am generally very happy with the PQ etc.

However, I am thinking of getting a 50" sometime in the next year.

My first choice would be Panasonic again. However I keep reading about the AVM processing in Fujitsu screens.

What improvements does it actually provide over a very competent screen like the Panasonic? I currently see no motion artefacts with fast movement on live broadcasts. With DVD (Denon 2900), there is judder with panning but I thought that was due to the inherent problem with film i.e., 24 fps: I even see it at the cinemas.

Any advice appreciated.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by newguy2
The other thing that AVM is purported to do (and I have not seen personally to confirm) is to improve SD picture quality. Can anyone confirm or deny?
Yes, that is correct. It has the best video processor of any plasma and works like a line doubler to enhance any SD signal.
 

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Yes, in fact I just demoed my P50 to a friend and showed him a Heart DVD and he couldn't believe it. I can't believe it. My wife thought it was high def until I told her it was a DVD and it was upscaled 480P material. I'm thinking about buying another P50 for the bedroom.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Interesting. I just saw this over on another thread from R Harkness whose opinons I enjoy reading.


"I've demoed both the Fujitsu P50 (many times) and the new Panasonic commercial model 50" plasma. I've seen both playing Hi-Def and DVDs many times, but never side by side. I do not see much difference in picture quality between them...for me certainly not a few thousand dollars worth.

I get the same thrill watching Hi-Def and DVDs on the Panasonic as I do on the Fujitsu.


It's been a while since I saw regular cable (NTSC) on either unit. I defer to those with more experience with those plasmas as to which will look better with NTSC.


(NTSC is notoriously hard to check out in stores because you never know how good their feed is. That said, the best NTSC image I've ever seen on a 50" plasma is the Bang + Olufeson plasma which is, like the Fujitsu, a re-jigged Panasonic plasma).



__________________

Rich H"


So he for one sees little difference Panny vs Fujitsu
 

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Hey Peter,


Let us know when you get the SONY 61. Have you had a chance to see the Fujitsu 63 in person yet? Would love to get your feedback in terms picture quality in the Fujitsu 63 vs SONY 61??


Thanks,

Gregg
 

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" Would love to get your feedback in terms picture quality in the Fujitsu 63 vs SONY 61??"


Dear Greg:


ME TOO!


But I have not ordered any Fujitsus yet.


If you prewired your system already.... YOU PROBABLY must go with the Fujitsu. That SONY Media BOX, it uses 3 cables if I am correct.


If prewiring conditions are not an issue: The sony 61" blows away out of the water last years 61 Fujitsu. SONY managed to buy all the NEC 61" glasses from under Fujitsus purchase order, they Copied the AVM, and obviously added a bunch of SONY Broadcast HDTV Know How.


The 61 may be SONY's 21st Century flagship-class display.


Before one starts saying AVM, pause and analyze.


The rules have changed. Is it fair sony copied the AVM? Is it fair that sony PUT THEIR BEST hdtv BROADCAST ENGINEERS ON THE PROJECT. iS IT FAIR THEY DO NOT WANT US TO KNOW WHAT THEY DId ABOVE AND BEYOND THE avm clone i GIVE A RATS ASS ABOUT THE WELFARE OF ANY bIG cORPORATION.


Let the Consumer win for once in Video. Because hundreds of thousands are currently getting shafted with epille[ptic attack inducing 1 chip DLP, by TI.



Do not underestimate the prowess of SONY, after the historical EVENT of befalling to the ropes (99% revenue drop fiscal 2002-2003 because of ALIS, and other excrement plasma products, SONY Music and Kazaaa, and three lousy Columbia Movies staring Jennifer Lopez).


I bet on the underdog. SONY will be back and the entire 950 series is proof to the pudding. Fujitsu may be too much of a peewee sized comany to withstand the Monster Plasma Fidelity Focus of the NEW SONY.


Assuming that the KDE61XBR950 is the Acura GT of plasmas, would you buy a prototype GT sportscar from Hiunday?


Perhaps it's not time to buy Samsung Glass based Fujitsus. Fujitsu chose this glass AS A REACTION to Sony's powerbuy.


There is very little field info on the long term lifespan and performance of the Larger KOREAN PLASMAS.


I plant the seed of doubt about the readiness of korean glass, with your best interests in Mind.


Samsung and LG are not staffed by smart american management at the moment. A one year projection may become a 5 year painul Journey.


This is specualtion, but my nose, I trust.
 

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Hey Peter,


That is the response I was looking for. I have been a SONY Guy for MANY years. Always had Sony Tubes because they had the best picture - by far - hands down. Right now I have a SONY 34" CRT HDTV (34XBR2). The picture is unreal and I can't wait to put it in my office in the new place. Originally the SONY 61" was what I was looking at and then I started reading about the Fujitsu AVM and the 1920x1080i of the Samsung 70" and I got intrigued. I am going to have this Plasma in a birght room - will the SONY Glass cause problems?!?!


After reading your review and others feedback about the SONY 61" - I am leaning back towards that - both in terms of quality and price. (BTW - send me a PM about the "GREAT DEAL" you got on this unit as I am interested.)


I agree with you - it may be too early to invest in the Samsung 70" Plasma but the size and native 1920x108i is still intriguing.


But I am excited about the SONY 61". If you get a chance to compare to the FUJITSU, SAMSUNG or SONY, let me know.


As far as the prewire - the component cabinet is right next to the plasma location and I can snake through anything I want. So the SONY Media Box would NOT be an issue at all.
 

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By the way: "Great Deal" I got on a broken Glass frame unit, which may or not become a working plasma. "Stimulating deal" is more the word. The freaking Media box is a 1,495 cost item in any XBR950. The deal is sweetened with my personal calibration, when I go visit my nephew.


But plan on a road trip to Tweeter in Delaware. The land of no taxation.


You would never guess who is also considering the Big Mac? Someone who orderd a Whopper.


to that person: The above conclusion was inspired by your PM.


As it turns out : His wife likes the SONY better, and he got me thinking for 18 hours before I made up my mind above, about McDonalds over Burger King.
 

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Wow - Delaware. Keep me posted. I would love to meet up with you guys and check it out in Delaware. Keep me posted when you come up.


Thanks again for your input. While I am not ruling out eh Fujitsu and Samsung - the SONY is looking and sounding better everyday!!!
 

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As I posted in another thread I still don't get Rich H's comment that a Fujitsu is a re-jigged Panny. Aside from the glass everything else is different. :confused:


As for Sony vs. Fujitsu....this is one time where I *may* be agreeing with Peter...to a point. ;) I think the new 950's have very good pq in the same class as Fujitsu. Although I do think they dropped the ball with the non-removable speakers. I bet if you take a poll of all the people who buy high end panels that the majority will have home theater systems. Hence, the speakers are largely moot and/or are a potential deal breaker (e.g., me), with the exception of a few who want both. Just my opinion, but I would be willing to be they change this in the next model.

"I bet on the underdog. SONY will be back and the entire 950 series is proof to the pudding. Fujitsu may be too much of a peewee sized comany to withstand the Monster Plasma Fidelity Focus of the NEW SONY."


As for them "taking over the top spot" from Fujitsu (if you fall into that camp who think Fujitsu is in that position), I would say "not so fast". ;) Yes Sony is HUGE and has HUGE resources. But have they run the top small guys out of the high end audio business? I don't think so. Why would it be different with plasma? Fujitsu is not going to stand still and they definitely have created a solid name in the high end arena. That particular niche won't go away so easily.


Now, if the sammy glass goes awry, this will obviously hurt their premium label. But unless something like that happens, I see room for both panels to co-exist. Although I still think Fujitsu is better positioned to cater to high end buyers at this time. One thing about Sony is that they have huge overhead to go with those huge resources, which means huge production runs are needed to make profits. One potential effect of that means higher risk of quality issues. Also not sure how good Sony's customer support on plasma is since I have never dealt with them (never had a Sony plasma). Fujitsu however has been very good to everyone here so far including me. Things to keep in mind anyway.
 

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Although I agree the Sony plasmas have improved greatly (they had nowhere else to go but up), I still find their color to be not as natural as the Fujitsus. I agree with Goombawa about the poor decision of using onboard speakers. How many people are going to spend that kind of money and not have a dedicated home theater stereo system? You're then stuck with that extra bulk (assuming you can't remove them...I thought you could) which to me really detracts from the minimalist design of plasmas. There is also the issue of the Sony name and the price premium that it extracts. Of course Fujitsu also commands a higher price too, but not as high (size for size) as what I've seen as Sony.


Peter, I'm curious, how did Sony manage to "copy" the Fujitsu AVM with all the patents that Fujitsu has on it?


The bottom line, as always, you must see these panels in person and let your eyes tell you which is best. Some people used to think the Fujitsu 61" was the best picture (by far) out there. I never agreed, I always found the picture inferior to their other units. Poor black levels resulted in a lack of depth. It now seems, in retrospect, that many people now look at that panel and are unimpressed. This again emphasizes the importance of using your own eyes to make this very important (and costly) decision.
 

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Ken,


I couldn't agree more. As I am now finding out while auditioning different speakers for my HT, beauty is in the eye ( or ear) of the beholder!! So many people have raved about speakers I thought sounded like s**t! While others bashed speakers that sounded great to me. And the same is true with plasmas. Some people prefer a very sharp picture as opposed to a softer/smoother picture. Black levels and Coloration are just a tip of the iceberg in terms of personal preference.


Ideally I would love to see the Fujitsut 63", Sony 61" and Samsung 70" in person and do a comparison. Unfortunately - I don't of know ANY place in the Washington DC Metorpolitian Area that is currently showing ANY of these monsters?!?! Anybody have a clue?


Again - I still welcome everyone's opinions and observations in terms of which unit they like best and why, but I have to see them in person before plopping down $16 -25K. Would you buy a car without test driving it??


But I haven't come across too many people on these boards that have seen both the SONY 61" and the FUJITSU 63" in person and can do a head to head comparision - I wish Sound Vision or some other magazine would do detailed review of both of them - head to head.
 

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First, to answer the original question -- ALL IMHO -- I think AVM maintains any of the crisp detail in the original signal that often get "smoothed" out by other processors. AVM also manages the black level better (although I must admit that I never cared for the static mode that so many others here like since it can't hold the black level constant). AVM does cut down on the jaggies and motion artifacts. It is also better at 3:2 pulldown than most and strikes that perfect balance of keeping enough data in the picture to make it 3 dimensional, yet not too much to make it noisy. Granted, that will vary by program source, but overall I think they struck a nice balance. Finally, I think AVM does a very good job eliminating false contouring.


I don't know if I would want Sound & Vision to test them, but I think Dreggman is on the right track. In the last issue of HT, they did a head-to-head comparison of RPTV's - 10 of them. Why not plasmas? I'd love to see 10 of the high end competitors go head-to-head.


I doubt Sony "copied" the AVM, but it is likely that they at least studied what AVM does and incorporated similar processing into their units, if they are looking as good as some say.


I used to respect Sony as a television manufacturer, but never cared for their audio stuff. In recent years, I've also lost any preference for Sony on the tv front as well -- started when I bought my first 27" Panny in 1987. For the most part, other than a few specific high priced CRT direct view models, I think Sony dropped the ball.


Sony has got some serious work ahead of it, IMHO, to win back a place in the market as THE premier brand in video. Whether they can do that with plasma remains to be seen.


I would bet that the boys and girls at Fujitsu however are not sitting around basking in the glory of the current AVM.


Not to go off topic, but a related and more interesting question to me is, "IF" the Sony's are comparable in PQ, what pressure, if any, will this put on Fujitsu's distribution strategy since consumers' are likely to be able to buy the Sony's from all sorts of retailers? Although consumers certainly respect Panasonic and Pioneer, Sony as a brand is another matter entirely. Average consumers believe in Sony.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by dreggman
Goombawa - are you sure the speakers are NOT detachble on the SONY's???



All of the specs I have read on the KDE61XBR950 have stated they are:

http://www.audiosound.com/sokd61inflpa.html

http://www.onecall.com/PID_20986.htm


Do you know any different from personal experience?? Please let me know as I certianly planned on NOT using the SONY Speakers!


Thanks,

Gregg
I was talking about the 42 and 50" models. Sorry. I have no reason to believe the description on the 61" is wrong:


"Detachable speakers let you customize your space. (61XBR950 only)"


But I do feel pretty darn good about my "prediction". I didn't know about the 61 until just now, and as I said earlier I knew they would make the change to detachable. Yay me. :D
 
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