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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Has anyone heard anything about the new line of speakers from Final Sound www.finalsound.com They seem like they will be reasonably priced and have a very nice form factor. I was wondering if they were at CES or if anyone knows any more details about the company or the speakers.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by DooDoo
Has anyone heard anything about the new line of speakers from Final Sound www.finalsound.com They seem like they will be reasonably priced and have a very nice form factor. I was wondering if they were at CES or if anyone knows any more details about the company or the speakers.
DooDoo,


These speakers are hardly a "new" line - they've been around for several years, and

have been well received. The company was founded in 1991.


If memory serves from when I auditioned them back in 1998, they compared quite

favorably to the Martin Logans of similar vintage which I auditioned in the same session.
 

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Final is not a new brand, but getting the prices way down into a more affordable realm is fairly new.


The one downside to the older Finals that I heard (ca. 2001) was that the sweet spot (these were hybrids) was very small.


There is a lot of "buzz" about the new speakers, but unfortunately I did not catch their display at CES.


Cheers,
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the input guys. My bad about assuming that they were a new line. I would love to hear from anyone who heard them at CES or anywhere else. Do electrostats sound much different/better than traditional speakers? Also, is there any mnfr who sells them at sub $1k prices?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by DooDoo
Thanks for the input guys. My bad about assuming that they were a new line. I would love to hear from anyone who heard them at CES or anywhere else. Do electrostats sound much different/better than traditional speakers? Also, is there any mnfr who sells them at sub $1k prices?
DooDoo,


Electrostatic speakers are inherently di-poles - that is they radiate preferentially forward

and backward, with the back wave out of phase with the forward wave; and little radiation

to the sides.


Di-poles in general [ electrostatic, ribbon... ] are sensitive to placement and setup - but

a well setup di-pole pair can virtually "disappear" sonically - and leave you with nice

imaging of a detailed soundstage.


Electrostatics tend to have an "open" or "airy" sound.


That said - electrostatics don't have the excursion for very high sound levels. The lack

of a baffle to separate the front and back waves means deep bass is quite problematic.

Many electostatic manufacturers, e.g. Martin Logan, have gone to hybrid system where

the bass is handled by a conventional monopole driver. That has its advantages and

disadvantages, such as the crossover from the isotropically radiating woofer to the

dipolar radiation pattern of the electrostatic panel.


As with all speakers - electrostatics have their positive points and their negative points -

and YOU have to be the one who decides if the positives are worth the negatives.


Audition the Finals, Martin Logans, SoundLab or other electostatics; a Magnepan

ribbon or two - as well as some of the myriad of traditional speakers - and make the

choice yourself.


I'm afraid there's no substitute for doing your own homework.
 

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I've heard them several times, and have always been impressed. A few things I like about them:


- Central "power" box, so you're not running lots of extra wires everywhere. You connect your amps to the box, which then runs the amp power AND high voltage to the panels. No more plugging your speakers in all over the place.


- VERY clean sound when placed near a wall. Final's optimized them for near-wall placement; in fact, many of the smaller panels are designed to be hung from a wall, with a short ~4" long bracket. Helps in the midbass department, and works in many rooms a lot better, because you don't have to have the speaker 3' out into the room.


- Good integration with the subwoofer. They run the crossovers high enough (above 200 Hz) so that the panel doesn't overload. No flapping diaphragms of Mylar to deal with. The sub is also clean enough that it doesn't draw attention to itself.


DISCLOSURE: I do design and production for some parts of the Final system so I do have an economic interest in their success.


That said, I still really like the way they sound. At CEDIA and CES they had great sound with radically different booths (CEDIA was an island in the RCA dome; CES was in a mid-sized suite at the Alexis Park). If you like the sound of electrostats, these should be very high on your list.


Dan Wiggins

Adire Audio
 

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Dan,


Next time you're sharing space with Final, can you make sure I stop and talk to them!


Cheers,
 

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Heard them briefly at Alexis Park, and thought they had 'stats usual open, airy sound. Bottom end was anemic, though - I have no idea if they were running with a sub or not. Just didn't seem like good integration top to bottom, but it's always hit or miss in those hotel suites. JMHO,


John
 

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John K,


You got it...:) Going to CEDIA? We may be there with them again.


Kal,


It's a new, lower priced line they're rolling out.


John R,


Depends upon who was running the show. I know a few times they had the walls rattling, but sometimes European taste for bass is a bit leaner than our American taste...;)


Dan Wiggins

Adire Audio
 

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Quote:
Depends upon who was running the show. I know a few times they had the walls rattling, but sometimes European taste for bass is a bit leaner than our American taste...
Dan, I'm sure your'e right. Maybe it was because I just come from the McCormack Audio room, where their amp / Wilson speaker combo almost had me ready to whip out my checkbook. Damn, it sounded good :)


John
 

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Very interesting, but quite a bit of suspect info at their web site:


1) All models seem to be 86 dB sensitivity, regardless of size


2) They claim having the conductive material "deep" in the middle of the diaphragm gives better sound than if it were on the surface.


3) They claim 150 Hz extension (also for many different size models). How can this be possible with an open back, w/o headroom-killing EQ? If the back is closed...well perhaps the large diaphragm area would let it be EQ'd effectively; I think the Fb would be above 150 Hz with the large driver area and small volume.


4) How can a single sub w/150 Hz XO work?


Also the beaminess would seem to preclude good sound for a roomful of people.
 

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Noah, I'll try to answer your questions in order:


1. My understanding is that, since efficiency (sensitivity) is proportional to motor force and mass, as the diaphragm gets larger, more motor force is available (scales up as area), but there's more mass, too (which also scales up at area). Hence the same efficiency of the panel. If the transformers are the same primary impedance, then the sensitivity is the same as well.


2. Don't have a clue about that, but IMHO they are some of the better sounding 'stats out there. I'm not a bit 'stat guy, though...


3. They use EQ, like most panels. My understanding is that the EQ isn't a boost in the low end, as much as it is a cut of the high end. The actual panel is more efficient than the ratings suggest, so they burn some efficiency to gain bandwidth.


4. Quite well, if the sub is up front between the front panels. It's all a matter of placement.


That said, are 'stats for everyone? No. But for those who like the sound, Final has a pretty good implementation for them. They have a good sound, are small, look great mounted on walls, and have a broad range of options available. And for CEDIA dealers, Final has the only UL listed panels available, which can be important when considering licensed installs.


Dan Wiggins

Adire Audio
 

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What's the pricing for the Finals?
 

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Dan,


Re efficiency, seems that larger area w/same motor force/area is the same as multiple cone drivers, i.e., doubling area should increase efficiency 2X from higher radiation resistance.


It should also decrease f3, letting them cut the HF cut you mentioned, giving even higher effciency.
 
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