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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Apologies right up if this not the correct sub-forum...

Considering my query relates to digital audio capture, I felt this sub-forum would be most pertinent.


As the heading suggests, I'm wanting to input DTS/DD encoded content into my HTPC, & decode it into DH or a similar format.


A user at Head-Fi mentioned that he vaguely recalls the AC3 project developing a filter which enables such functionality for cards with digi-in.

If the project's dead or non-existent....


Then I guess I'll need to look at getting a 2nd card (something from the audigy series?) that offers functionality like this.

My primary card is a Xonar Essence ST, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't have digi-in, so I'll need a 2nd card irrespective of the projects status.


Essentially I want to mimic all the functionality of these two devices:
AudioCubes.com - JVC SU-DH1 Surround Headphone Adapter - SU-DH1 -
Astro Gaming | Professional Gaming Equipment | MixAmp™


Both have their weaknesses and strengths, but I figured so long as DRM isn't a total obstacle in Win7...

Then I could end-up with a system that's just as functional, perhaps more flexible, and definitely better quality.


Has anyone tried anything like this, or heard of someone that's gotten close?

Thoughts, advice, or experiences much appreciated!
 

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I believe ffdshow has a HRTF filter as does AC3Filter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
So only the older DD/DTS formats are possible, not the newer ones as there's not enough bandwidth via S/PDIF, even w/bit-streamed right?

I don't suppose you could briefly outline the procedure & advise which card is ideal (IYO) for digital audio input?


I already have an Essence ST + H6 I'd like to use for analogue output, but it doesn't have digi-in (S/PDIF).


Have you heard of anyone successfully bit-streaming or sending multi-ch PCM to their Graphics card (or sound-card if one exists with HDMI-in); decompressing (if bit-streamed), decoding, & then doing DAC? (or 1st running through a HRTF filter in ffdshow or ac3filter)


Thank-you!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Yes I know, it's the 1% I want to know about:

Quote:
Have you heard of anyone successfully bit-streaming or sending multi-ch PCM to their Graphics card (or sound-card if one exists with HDMI-in); decompressing (if bit-streamed), decoding, & then doing DAC? (or 1st running through a HRTF filter in ffdshow or ac3filter)

And the answer to these Qns:

Quote:
So only the older DD/DTS formats are possible, not the newer ones as there's not enough bandwidth via S/PDIF, even w/bit-streamed right?

I don't suppose you could briefly outline the procedure & advise which card is ideal (IYO) for digital audio input?

Thank-you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Modz please advise if this is the wrong sub-forum, and if so can you please move to a more appropriate one?

Quote:
I don't suppose you could advise which card+sw is ideal (IYO) for S/PDIF-in and decode, & briefly outline the procedure?

I already have an Essence ST + H6 I'd like to use for analogue output, alas it doesn't have digi-in (S/PDIF)

Any advice/ideas here would be greatly appreciated!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst /forum/post/18312597


So only the older DD/DTS formats are possible, not the newer ones as there's not enough bandwidth via S/PDIF, even w/bit-streamed right?

I've since learned the answer to this is a definite "yes".

S/PDIF doesn't have enough bandwidth for HD audio, and even if it did it wouldn't be allowed.

Quote:
Have you heard of anyone successfully bit-streaming or sending multi-ch PCM to their Graphics card (or sound-card if one exists with HDMI-in); decompressing (if bit-streamed), decoding, & then doing DAC? (or 1st running through a HRTF filter in ffdshow or ac3filter)

Since learned this will not be possible.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst /forum/post/18283794


Apologies right up if this not the correct sub-forum...

Considering my query relates to digital audio capture, I felt this sub-forum would be most pertinent.


As the heading suggests, I'm wanting to input DTS/DD encoded content into my HTPC, & decode it into DH or a similar format.


A user at Head-Fi mentioned that he vaguely recalls the AC3 project developing a filter which enables such functionality for cards with digi-in.

If the project's dead or non-existent....


Then I guess I'll need to look at getting a 2nd card (something from the audigy series?) that offers functionality like this.

My primary card is a Xonar Essence ST, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't have digi-in, so I'll need a 2nd card irrespective of the projects status.


Essentially I want to mimic all the functionality of these two devices:
AudioCubes.com - JVC SU-DH1 Surround Headphone Adapter - SU-DH1 -
Astro Gaming | Professional Gaming Equipment | MixAmp


Both have their weaknesses and strengths, but I figured so long as DRM isn't a total obstacle in Win7...

Then I could end-up with a system that's just as functional, perhaps more flexible, and definitely better quality.


Has anyone tried anything like this, or heard of someone that's gotten close?

Thoughts, advice, or experiences much appreciated!

Yes I used this card http://us.store.creative.com/PCI-Exp...B0018EFGTM.htm

Only I had some Windows issues and it was driving me crazy.

Funny thing is the issue was solved by using windows update the drivers from there worked perfect.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Eiiww Creative, thanks, but no thanks!


Do you know of any cards for playing BD on ones PC (PAP compliant) that also have S/PDIF-in + DD/DTS 5.1 decode?


Would that only be the hdav1.3 and hometheatre HD?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by gooki /forum/post/18311996


I believe ffdshow has a HRTF filter as does AC3Filter.

@gooki

I don't suppose you could advise which card+sw is ideal (IYO) for S/PDIF-in and decode, & briefly outline the procedure?


I already have an Essence ST + H6 I'd like to use for analogue output, alas it doesn't have digi-in (S/PDIF)



Thank-you very much!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst /forum/post/18332209


Eiiww Creative, thanks, but no thanks!


Do you know of any cards for playing BD on ones PC (PAP compliant) that also have S/PDIF-in + DD/DTS 5.1 decode?


Would that only be the hdav1.3 and hometheatre HD?

Your saying Eiiww Creative but in your first post you say Audigy series? This card is the highest end card that they make well above the Audigy series. BTW Sound Blaster, Audigy,Creative are all the same company.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Yeah i know, only reason I suggested audigy is I have an old audigy lying around.

But I've since done a truck load of reading, and would rather not go near creative card any more.


Do you know of any cards for playing BD on ones PC (PAP compliant) that also have S/PDIF-in + DD/DTS 5.1 decode?

Would that only be the hdav1.3 and hometheatre HD?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst /forum/post/18332271


Yeah i know, only reason I suggested audigy is I have an old audigy lying around.

But I've since done a truck load of reading, and would rather not go near creative card any more.


Do you know of any cards for playing BD on ones PC (PAP compliant) that also have S/PDIF-in + DD/DTS 5.1 decode?

Would that only be the hdav1.3 and hometheatre HD?

No others that Creative does not make thats why I went with this one.

I have seen some with vaccum tubes on them for some insane prices but no optical inputs or outputs. The Creative has them all and sounds nice,

I am using my p3s for now though as the case I built this machine in needs a rack and I am converting a room for servers,
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Okay investigated further....


I've learned that there simply isn't any hardware in existence that does HDMI-in.

Primarily because the HDCP patent license forbids HDMI devices that allow access to decrypted data.


So the best I can hope to pass to my PC (via S/PDIF) is DD or DTS 5.1.

Not a big loss as I suspect many PS3 Games don't actually use HD audio*, and even more Xbox games won't.


But it's a fairly big loss for BD Movies, as they always use HD audio, so LT I may get a PAP capable card.

That's if I can't find a way to get my Essence ST to become PAP compliant (it's very similar to the HDAV1.3, which is).


There is a handful of XFi-based cards from creative and auzentech that do support S/PDIF-in (coax, optical, or both).

But I've found none that support PAP & decode on S/PDIF-in...


And aside from that I've since learned that all consumer level cards with S/PDIF-in...

Aren't designed to overcome de-synchronisation between audio and video that can occur.

They do not have an internal clock that syncs with the clock of the source...

Plus many others are adamant that despite it being possible to get s/pdif-in working on a PC.

It's always far too kludgey/flakey when switching between sources etc..


However DH adapters like the Mixamp and SU-DH1 do not suffer from these issues.

And as I'm mainly interested converting surround sound formats to stereo, it doesn't matter that they can't do mc analogue-out.


So for the time being I'm prolly just going to make do with the SU-DH1...

It's clear that LT I'll need to get an AVR (or some "separates"), a PAP-compliant card, or both if I want HD audio muxed into stereo.


*HD audio = newish DD/DTS formats like: TrueHD & DTS-MA
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I've actually realised my on-board alc889 will prolly be fine for BD playback.

I'll use mostly my Essence ST + H6 for "BD-grade" playback after 1st decrypting/transcoding.

But for the times I can't be foobared I figured a PAP-compliant card would be nice.

Ideally some hacked Essence drivers* that enable player compatibility appear, but that's very unlikely.


Another thing I want (but perhaps less critical) is S/PDIF-in DD/DTS 5.1 decode.

But if the alc889 works for BD, then I think it'll be waste of $ just to buy a card for those abilities!


Especially considering that most consumer level cards with S/PDIF-in decode suffer from a/v desync issues.

As they're typically capture devices that don't have input clocks designed to sync with the the audio source.

Whereas any device that accepts audio data from a digital input and plays it back simultaneously...

Must synchronize it's own output clock to the input's clock e.g: AVR's, SU-DH1, Mixamp etc.


I believe there are ways around it, but I'm not too familiar with the methods.....

If there's a cheap card with S/PDIF-in decode, ideally with the ability to reroute the DAC step to my Essence (prolly not do-able), then I'd buy it.

But not before I bought a SU-DH1 or similar....


Anyone know of such a card?

And of course my Corei3-530 + H57 Mobo can bit-stream when I decide to get an AVR or "separates".


*as its very similar to HDAV1.3 in many respects
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst /forum/post/18345094


Okay investigated further....


I've learned that there simply isn't any hardware in existence that does HDMI-in.

Primarily because the HDCP patent license forbids HDMI devices that allow access to decrypted data.


So the best I can hope to pass to my PC (via S/PDIF) is DD or DTS 5.1.

Not a big loss as I suspect many PS3 Games don't actually use HD audio*, and even more Xbox games won't.


But it's a fairly big loss for BD Movies, as they always use HD audio, so LT I may get a PAP capable card.

That's if I can't find a way to get my Essence ST to become PAP compliant (it's very similar to the HDAV1.3, which is).


There is a handful of XFi-based cards from creative and auzentech that do support S/PDIF-in (coax, optical, or both).

But I've found none that support PAP & decode on S/PDIF-in...


And aside from that I've since learned that all consumer level cards with S/PDIF-in...

Aren't designed to overcome de-synchronisation between audio and video that can occur.

They do not have an internal clock that syncs with the clock of the source...

Plus many others are adamant that despite it being possible to get s/pdif-in working on a PC.

It's always far too kludgey/flakey when switching between sources etc..


However DH adapters like the Mixamp and SU-DH1 do not suffer from these issues.

And as I'm mainly interested converting surround sound formats to stereo, it doesn't matter that they can't do mc analogue-out.


So for the time being I'm prolly just going to make do with the SU-DH1...

It's clear that LT I'll need to get an AVR (or some "separates"), a PAP-compliant card, or both if I want HD audio muxed into stereo.


*HD audio = newish DD/DTS formats like: TrueHD & DTS-MA

I thought you were looking for optical did not realise HDMI.

The crastive card I have does optical in and out and I can decode DTS-HD and offload it to either CPU or GPU. It can also be done on the sound card but I dont trust it. I also have dual optical on mobo but here is system config.

Asus Mobo,

Core I-7 920 @4.2GHZ

3- GTX 295s in SLI

6-GB Corsair ram kit.

1000 Watt Power supply OCZ I think I forget might be PC Power and cooling

Creative Fatailty sound card

2-80GB SSDs for boot volumes

4 1TB Drives for storage

And thats the basics in there it is kind of a work in progress beacuse work gets in the way


When I got Vista Ultimate working correctly and it took a while, I them proceeded to try Windows 7 it worked for a day and then crashed. So soon I will get back to fixing it I got got real busy and now its on the bench waiting for me. But I was working on Pushing Audio through the video cards it is possible but not easy but the HDCP HDMI ports are there and onfigurable for in and outs. if you are interested here is a link.
http://developer.nvidia.com/page/home.html
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Yes looking for S/PDIF-in again, as evidenced by most recent posts.

Must have DD/DTS 5.1 decode & mustn't suffer from de-synching with video (PS3, Xbox etc) too much, & if it does it must be correctable.


As I want an extra card only for S/PDIF-in decode, I would prefer that it's cheap.

As it will not be used for much else, even the the DAC stage (after decode) will prolly be re-routed to my Essence ST.


Any ideas? Thank-you.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst /forum/post/18355840


Yes looking for S/PDIF-in again, as evidenced by most recent posts.

Must have DD/DTS 5.1 decode & mustn't suffer from de-synching with video (PS3, Xbox etc) too much, & if it does it must be correctable.


As I want an extra card only for S/PDIF-in decode, I would prefer that it's cheap.

As it will not be used for much else, even the the DAC stage (after decode) will prolly be re-routed to my Essence ST.


Any ideas? Thank-you.
http://us.store.creative.com/EMU-101...B002OB1NKY.htm

not so cheap though.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst /forum/post/18360253


Hmm, interesting one, thanks.

No mention of DD or DTS decode though?

not sure jay looks like the card I have and it does decode optical DTS and DD just have not yet figured how to get HDMI audio through the Video cards correctly as of yet.
 
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