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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I've read about Epson's new LCD panels being used in the panny 500 and the Z2.


Is this true?


How does this affect picture quality in the new pjs?


Does the HS20 use these new panels from Epson?


What is new and upgraded with these LCD panels that makes picture quality so much better?
 

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i think all of the new gen of LCDs will use these panels.


I believe contrast is improved as is brightness uniformity. Other things too so hopefully someone else will give you that info.
 

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Sure would be nice if they helped the fixed-pattern-noise and scanlines, but we'll have to see. I did see some FPN on the HS20 at CEDIA. Maybe they'll add some stuff to the service menu(s) to help reduce these, though.


--Darin
 

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Sony makes their own LCD panels for the VW,HS serie and not Epson dreamV. IV (1280*720) but D4 also include 480 and 1080p res.


The chip has been made smaller from previous 720p Gen, like D2 in Tw100.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I would think that if Epson is manufacturing the heart of the LCD engine they could be more competitively priced in this HT market with their own offerings.


I wonder what's the next real big step for LCD technology? It seems that LCD has been around for a very long time, but it's only seen incremental progress throughtout the years compared to DLP technology.


It makes me wonder if there really is a future for LCD display in fp.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Also, what benefit would there be for others, such as Sony, to manufacture their own LCD technology?


What's better about Sony's panels over Epson's? Conversely, what's better about Epsons panels over Sony's? Is there any difference at all?
 

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Quote:
It seems that LCD has been around for a very long time, but it's only seen incremental progress throughtout the years compared to DLP technology
I wouldn’t say that, DLP tends to be ahead on contrast for instance, but for every step forward DLP makes, LCD has been just one step behind. Only a few years ago, DLP projectors were only something like 250:1 contrast, but better than LCD which was about 150:1. Now we have DLP up in the 2000:1 range and LCD in the 1000:1 range. Older LCD projectors had screen door that looked like someone went over your screen with a thick black marker-pen, now with MLA and “smooth-screen†it’s hardly an issue.


Sanyo and Panasonic are now (well this month) fielding projectors in the $2000 range with 1280x720 and 1300:1 contrast. The interesting thing about the way that Sanyo and Panasonic have pushed the contrast on their machines is that they both do it in completely different ways. Assuming Panasonic’s light modulation works in practice, then combining the techniques would give around 2000:1 contrast without any additional research and relatively minor development costs. In fact I am surprised that Panasonic didn’t spec the 500 with an iris since it seems to be all the rage these days and it is a fairly simple mechanical addition.


So I don’t think LCD is dead, and I don’t think we have seen the end of the “contrast wars†yet. I am also quite happy that LCD is still around because it gives us a lot more choice and keeps the prices down too.


Liam
 

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I am really skeptical about the "lamp modulation" technique used by the

new Panny. I see that yes, it will give a much higher on/off CR, 1300 in this

case, but how about with images with very bright and dark areas? This

technology is not limited to LCD's I presume. In theory, it would give DLP's

CR's in the 4000 range!
 

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Quote:
but how about with images with very bright and dark areas?
The point is that you don’t actually need much more than about 200:1 in any particular image - as soon has you have a bright image, you can’t really see the darks.

Even with something like the closing credits with white on black, you don’t actually see that the black is not black unless you force yourself not to look at the white bits at all. The scenes that really give digital projectors a problem are the ones where people are creeping about in the shadows and there just isn’t much light at all.


In fact CRT projectors produce a good image in dark scenes for exactly the same reason – they only put out the light that is needed to make the image and no more. At any particular time it is also not showing more than say 2-400:1 contrast, but that doesn’t matter because it can keep contrast in any particular scene right down to the darkest.



Liam
 

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LMJohnson,


Points well taken. I feel that another factor is that in bright scenes, there

is quite a bit of room reflections(especially with my white walls), that having

a CR above say 300 wouldn't make a difference.


I wonder if anyone is working on a DLP projector with lamp modulation.

Maybe simply putting a LCD panel in the light path to modulate the light

intensity.
 

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I have to wonder if lamp modulation -- combined with a closed iris would produce a picture that's too dark. Sure they could install a brighter bulb but wouldn't that offset the lamp modulation?


The comment was made that this APPEARS to be an obvious easy solution to gaining even higher contrast, but I suspect it's not that easy.


What if there's a patent on the iris technology that would require a royalty to be paid (by Panasonic to the iris developers)? Lamp modulation might have been another way to achieve the same result. Also, when more punch (in brighter scenes) is desired, it would be there (with lamp modulation) without opening/closing the iris.


That said, I admit I'm skeptical as well. For example, I have to wonder if there's enough lead time in the circuitry to raise and lower lamp intensity simultaneous to scene changes (vs. a moment/two AFTER the scene changes). Also, could lamp modulation make the viewer more aware of changing scenes -- distracting from the movie experience? And, what about constant changes in lamp circuit voltage/amperage: could this be detrimental to bulb life?


If Panasonic was still working on solving some of these issues when the prototype was informally presented at CEDIA, was there really enough time between then and the impending release to work out all the bugs? Where's the time allowed to THOROUGHLY test it?


I have to say I'm hoping the answers to all these questions are favorable, because the small amount of feedback on the picture quality -- from those who saw the unit -- has been nothing but stellar!
 

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Since no one replied to my thread on its own, and now we're on the same topic, does anyone know:


What panels are used in the new Panasonic PT-50LC13 rear projection TV?



If these are Epson panels, then everyone should have a preview of how they perform sitting in their local Best Buy.
 

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Quote:
I have to wonder if lamp modulation -- combined with a closed iris would produce a picture that's too dark
Sanyo are quoting something like a 20% brightness reduction with the iris closed. The lamp modulation should not really reduce the maximum brightness at all, but it may depend how they have done it. I suspect it may be easier and more controllable to add a fourth LCD shutter panel to modulate the brightness, which might reduce the maximum brightness a little also.

Quote:
What if there's a patent on the iris technology that would require a royalty to be paid
There might be some reason, but surely not a patent? Every camera lens has an iris behind the lens.

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If Panasonic was still working on solving some of these issues when the prototype was informally presented at CEDIA
Lets just hope it comes down to final tweaks in the software


Liam
 

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Here's an Espon news release I found that might be of interest to this topic.

http://www.epson.co.jp/e/news/2003/030326.htm


Odd that the 720P panel doesn't include MLA but the others do.


The 1920x1080 panel looks very promising, hopefully we will see some reasonably priced projectors based on it as well. In addition to more pixels each pixel is 1.5 times the size of the 720P chip. This should provide a high fill factor and reduce the screen door.
 
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