[Mike_Stuewe]

Hello everyone, I've read as much of this forum as I can over the last few days, but am thoroughly confused and would just like to get some expert opinion.


Building a theater in the basement. I do not so much care about sound transmission from the basement to the upstairs, but more so about voices, tv, and footsteps being heard downstairs from the living room and kitchen above.


It seems like the obvious answer around here is...Drywall. More specifically - R19 Pink Batt, Resilient Channel, Drywall, Green Glue, Drywall.


HOWEVER. I am super paranoid about running wires, or something going wrong above the ceiling. I have water pipers, duct work, electrical run up there. Plus more importantly I have wires running up there to various spots on the first floor for video, audio, and networking, in addition to more wires running to the patio for video, audio, electrical, networking, and speakers.


So as you can guess, I would LOVE to do ceiling tile. But ceiling tile, even acoustical ceiling tile, is a big dropoff on sound transmission.


So what I was thinking was this, please give me your thoughts.


R19 Pink Batt
Fake Ceiling

Air Gap

Drop Ceiling


The air gap between the drop ceiling and the fake ceiling gives me room to run wires, put up lights, mount projectors, etc etc etc.


The fake ceiling, would actually be cut into 2x2 panels. This way, if I need to get access to anything above, electrical wires, water pipes, duct work, I can.


So the first question is, "is this dumb?"


The second question is, "what do I make the fake ceiling out of?" Remember I will want to slice it into 2x2 panels so I can have access above. Thoughts so far include MLV or Resilient Channel with Double Drywall and Green Glue. The benefit to MLV is that it is thin. The benefit to the drywall option is the price. MLV can be overlapped on the edges, Drywall I will need to seal somehow. Might there be other options?


It'd be nice if someone could just tell me what to do and never to worry about things going on above the ceiling

 

[BIGmouthinDC]

If you have a two story home, ask yourself where is all the wiring, plumbing, and duct work for the second floor? You should be equally worried for those runs.


A direct answer to your question is you should read about triple leaf construction, which is a bad thing, at soundproofingcompany.com

 

[Mike_Stuewe]



Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC /forum/post/18171787


If you have a two story home, ask yourself where is all the wiring, plumbing, and duct work for the second floor? You should be equally worried for those runs.

Sadly, I am equally worried about those runs. I have no idea how I would add cat5e or coax to any of the upstairs bedrooms. It definitely wasnt a home designed with me in mind.

 

[Mike_Stuewe]

after reviewing the site, i dont see how its a triple leaf. i see 2 large air cavities in my scenarios.


but im also a noob with this stuff.

 

[adammb]

It may create a triple leaf so I say scratch that. Why not run conduit for the areas that you think may need future wiring and then drywall. I fear the same thing but you have to pick what is most important. Believe me when I tell you you definitely want to keep sound from going upstairs. You may think you dont now but think about when you want to watch something at night when others are sleeping.

 

[Drew_V]

I'm pretty paranoid as well. I also have tons of access points that I need to make for my ceiling. Duct dampers, gas shutoffs, water pipe access points, drain cleanouts, etc. I'm going to make access panels for the shutoffs and cleanouts, and just drywall right over the rest. The way I figure it, if I ever need to get to the other stuff, I'll just have to cut holes in my ceiling and patch them up later. No big deal. It's just drywall.


You can't worry about every wire, cable, pipe, or duct in your walls. I must admit that I've only had to access the duct dampers ONCE in the 15 years I've been living here. And that's only because we closed off some rooms upstairs so they don't need the heat.


When I run all power wires, cables, etc. up in the ceiling, then I'm just going to make sure everything works before I put up the drywall. I figure if they all work the first time, they'll continue to work after the drywall is up, so I shouldn't need access to them anyways.


And I completely agree with the earlier post that recommends running conduit. If I were as paranoid as you, I'd run as many cables and speaker wiring inside conduit as possible, as well as putting up a couple of runs of EMPTY conduit for later use.

 

[Ted White]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_Stuewe /forum/post/18171858


after reviewing the site, i dont see how its a triple leaf. i see 2 large air cavities in my scenarios.

2 air cavities is the classic definition of a triple leaf:
http://www.soundproofingcompany.com/...e_leaf_effect/


I would also caution you with the use of resilient channel. Very problematic and highly variable performance.

 

[Kensmith48]

The only wiring I would worry about is the lighting that uses ballasts such as the kitchen counter wiring. I moved this to an accessible part of my basement. I had one water pipe going to the outside. It didn't leak and still doesn't, so no need to worry about it. All of the wiring was good so I left it alone.

I used one sheet of 5/8" drywall on the ceiling and 2 sheets of 5/8" drywall on the walls without GG and used fiberglass insulation and the sound really isn't as bad as some would have you believe.

 

[Ted White]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Kensmith48 /forum/post/18172592


I used one sheet of 5/8" drywall on the ceiling and 2 sheets of 5/8" drywall on the walls without GG and used fiberglass insulation and the sound really isn't as bad as some would have you believe.

Significant sound isolation isn't a goal of everyone, certainly. I think most would agree that IF it was a goal, or MIGHT be a goal at some point, then this is the time to do it. Much harder to go back and retrofit.

 

[Mike_Stuewe]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted White /forum/post/18172308


2 air cavities is the classic definition of a triple leaf:
http://www.soundproofingcompany.com/...e_leaf_effect/


I would also caution you with the use of resilient channel. Very problematic and highly variable performance.

I'll read up on resilient channel then. But as far as the triple leaf, wouldnt this be a triple leaf with large cavities? Thats listed as being "fair", not "bad."

 

[Mike_Stuewe]

I'll just post some pictures and my cad drawings and let you guys decide what i should do. you can spend my money.


but when something leaks you have to promise to listen to me ***** about it.

 

[Ted White]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_Stuewe /forum/post/18173350


Thats listed as being "fair", not "bad."

That's a lot of work just to get a grade of "fair"

 

[Ted White]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_Stuewe /forum/post/18173354


but when something leaks you have to promise to listen to me ***** about it.

That's mighty funny!!!

 

[Mike_Stuewe]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted White /forum/post/18173497


That's a lot of work just to get a grade of "fair"

so if i understand the triple leaf correctly, are you saying that pink batt and acoustical drop ceiling would be BETTER for isolation than inserting a ceiling of double drywall and green glue in between?

 

[Ted White]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_Stuewe /forum/post/18176578


so if i understand the triple leaf correctly, are you saying that pink batt and acoustical drop ceiling would be BETTER for isolation than inserting a ceiling of double drywall and green glue in between?

No. I'm saying it would be maybe a shame to possibly de-rate the double drywall with the dropped ceiling.


There are a few other issues with dropped ceilings you might want to be aware of. Many theater designs plan for a highly reflective ceiling (drywall), rather than absorptive (tile). Also, dropped ceilings are notorious for rattling. People weigh them down with drywall or MLV, further establishing the triple leaf in your instance.

 

[Mike_Stuewe]

Ok that makes more sense.


I'll have pics, measurements, and drawings up by Tuesday hopefully.

 

[Mike_Stuewe]

ok 1 last question til I have the rest up.

If I did this design, but with drop ceiling instead of the drywall ceiling, that would eliminate the triple leaf, correct?


at some point my wife wants to redo the floors upstairs. i could then add rubber isolation padding as well.

 

[Ted White]

You would elimate the triple leaf, yes. However, my advice would be to not spend the time and energy doing these isolation efforts if you need a drop ceiling.

 

[Pakee]

Sorry to derail the thread, but Ted, do you mean that installing for example whisperclips and double drywall with greenglue to a concrete ceiling wouldn't help with soundproofing?

 

[Ted White]

Pakee, not sure where that question is coming from. I don't think we're talking about a concrete ceiling.