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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've about 80% talked myself into getting a PLV-60 for my home theater. I'm shooting for a pretty big picture, 120" diagonal 16:9 screen at 16' viewing distance. So I'm pretty cautious about screendoor. (For comparison, the Sharp 9000 DLP was great in this respect... I'd have one by now if it wasn't for the rainbow!)


My current thought is to get a Cygnux IMX lens to reduce the screendoor effect. I'm extremely curious if any of the forum members have had experience with this and/or other such lenses. If so... how much difference did it make? And what was your screen size vs. viewing distance?
 

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I used a Cygnus lens with a Sharp 99 LCD SVGA projector. Others have reported success using this lens but in my case I found no difference in using the lens versus slightly defocusing the projector.
 

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I have to agree. I have used the Cignus lens as well with decent results, but not much different that just defocusing the projector slightly. I would suggest that you get a smaller screen if you decide on the Sanyo PLV60 projector, unless there is a way you can get farther back from the screen. I think you would be much happier with the results.


Thanks!
 

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If you want to see what a defocused setup looks like I took some pictures for a previous post. Here is the out take. FYI the 10ht and the plv-60 use the same 16:9 LCD panels.


Screen door: Well I took a couple of pictures for you. I slightly defocus to mitigate screendoor. This does not affect sharpness at the macro level only at the pixel level


This is the best I can do with my camera it is fairly accurate in representing my screen door. This was taken using AVAI IRE 100 pattern. The color difference comes from the cameras automatic adjustments from the yellow tape measure being placed in frame.

http://home.pacbell.net/btmoore/scrndoor_ruler.jpg

With ruler

http://home.pacbell.net/btmoore/scrndoor_noruler.jpg

No Ruler


Here is a picture of the sharpness pattern focused on the more detailed bars.
http://home.pacbell.net/btmoore/sharpness.jpg


Regards,


Brian
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Not too encouraging for the IMX so far. Any users out there with more positive results, or is this typical?


Brian... thanks for the screenshots! How big is your screen, and how far back do you need to be for the pixel structure to be invisible when it's "properly defocused" like that?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by DarrenG


Brian... thanks for the screenshots! How big is your screen, and how far back do you need to be for the pixel structure to be invisible when it's "properly defocused" like that?
110" 16:9 grayhawk


1 1/2 to 2 yards at most. The last picture was taken !~ 1 1/2 yards from the screen


Regards,


Brian
 

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I've use 2 different types of the lens, and the very first modle worked best. It was a fixed panel lens, no moving parts. The second (which i retruned 3 times because of shiping damage)

wasen't uniform throughout the screen. The first i use on a Sharp 55U LCD, and it worked great. As far as it softening the picture, I don't think it did. It softened the grid pattern, which gave it the perception of a softer picture, but I dont think the picture itself looked softer. I had a 100'' screen, but was sitting 18 feet away. If you can get a hold of one of the OLD lenses from Shawn, I'll bet you'll be happy with it. Bet you can get one real cheap too.
 

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What about the D-ila Technology? No screen door or Rainbow.


William
 

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I rarely watch MLB any more, unless it's available in HD. Anyway, it's the playoffs and I'm testing my configuration. Baseball is one of very few sources that I ever notice screen door on my VT540 @ 100"ish sitting ~11' back. It's usually the outfield that causes problems because it is all the same brightish green. I have even seen this on HD baseball broadcasts. However, tonight I am viewing through my partially installed Panamorph P752. As I had seen at the Panamorph parties, it all but eliminates the screen door. From my seat, I don't see it at all where I know it used to bother me slightly. It's just a beautiful green outfield (OK, a Standard Definition Faux Network outfield, but lacking locally inserted artifacts). It's two - two optical tricks in one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by William Mapstone
What about the D-ila Technology? No screen door or Rainbow.
That's the other option I'm considering. However, a G15 + anamorphic lens costs about twice as much as PLV-60 + IMX lens. My wallet would really like to go with the PLV-60 if it's possible to make the screendoor go away.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by thaxx
I've use 2 different types of the lens, and the very first modle worked best. It was a fixed panel lens, no moving parts. The second (which i retruned 3 times because of shiping damage) wasen't uniform throughout the screen. .
Just making sure I'm clear... you were never able to get good results from the second (current) lens?
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Brian... thanks for the screenshots! How big is your screen, and how far back do you need to be for the pixel structure to be invisible when it's "properly defocused" like that?

Quote:
Originally posted by btmoore

110" 16:9 grayhawk


1 1/2 to 2 yards at most. The last picture was taken !~ 1 1/2 yards from the screen

Brian


So if you're standing 6' back from the screen, the screendoor isn't visible? Wow, sounds too good to be true! That would seem to indicate that the main issue with LCDs is easy to defeat, and the IMX lens is pointless. Am I missing something?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by DarrenG
Brian... thanks for the screenshots! How big is your screen, and how far back do you need to be for the pixel structure to be invisible when it's "properly defocused" like that?





So if you're standing 6' back from the screen, the screendoor isn't visible? Wow, sounds too good to be true! That would seem to indicate that the main issue with LCDs is easy to defeat, and the IMX lens is pointless. Am I missing something?
As you can see from the pictures at close range, the defocusing softens the screen door dramatically. The way I look at it is you are trying to focus the projector to project as film like as possible not to have a clearly focused pixel. As long as the defocusing is sub pixel all you are doing is spreading the light from the pixel over a wider area, in essence improving the perceived fill factor.


FYI the screen can make a difference on noticing screen door. I ordered my 10ht about 3 weeks before I ordered my Grayhawk. When I received my projector I was using blackout material tacked onto the wall as a temporary screen. When I was using this I had the projector tightly focused but at my seating distance the screen door was not noticeable. When I installed the grayhawk the screen door became very visible, this is when I started experimenting with defocusing. Something else interesting you will notice in the pictures, there are some points on the screen which are brighter, the grayhawk has a very muted opal like quality and up close to the screen you will notice variation in the brightness of the reflected light. This is not noticeable once you are a few feet back.


I have never used a plv-60 but I have heard good things about it. There is a lot of positive about having native 16:9, ease of use and not having to deal with masking, lenses or zooming when moving between formats is very convenient.


Good luck and Best Regards,


Brian
 

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I have the 10HT and the IMX 931. I posted a review to the forum some time ago, you can find it here.


My screen is around 98in diagonal, its a da-lite highpower. I sit about 14ft from the screen. I find its only certain scenes that are problematic - obviously you can't see individual pixels from normal viewing distances, but what I see is a larger grid effect esp. with white backgrounds. Note - this is infrequent and is generally the projectors way of telling me I'm watching crap because my eyes are wandering. This effect is greatly reduced with the IMX lens.


I think Shawn (Cygnus) offers a try before you buy program anyway.


Ian
 

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To those of you who are using the IMX do you concur with posts that state that there is no difference between slightly defocusing and using the IMX. If there is no difference what is the point of this product. Secondly is the product still available? I don't see it listed anymore on the cynus website.


Lenny Eckian
 

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I'm using a IMX lens with a Sharp XV99 projector and find that I get much better results with the lens than the defocus trick. The len's does take some time to setup and get a uniform picture but, was done correctly made a dramatic difference on this projector anyway! :)
 

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Those interested may also wish to search this forum. This topic has been discussed several times over the last two years. I seem to remember comparison photos being posted as well.
 

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What is this "panamorph" that everyone's talking about? Is it an anamorphic lens for 4:3 projectors? Also, for you 10Ht owners out there who have the Da-lite high contrast da matt.....how do you like it, and is it bright enough with cinema black on? Has anyone compared it to the greyhawk?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by brotherthx

Is it an anamorphic lens for 4:3 projectors?
Yes.
 
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