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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'd like to have a subwoofer in my room (in the future in my car when i have the money) for music. I listen to hip hop and rap and i want a sub with good sound quality but, at the same time has a decent amount of output.

I'm going to use this amp for now : Bash 500W Digital Subwoofer Amplifier from parts-express


Now i want to know which driver i should get either the Fi SSD or the Dayton Titanic and is it worth the extra 3" of cone area or should i go with the 12" versions of either.


Also i'd like to build the enclosure and have heard that sealed enclosures have better sound quality but, ported enclosures have better extension ( they go lower) and are louder.
 

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Well since no one has replied...
Attachment 192288

^^ Sealed

I input 1000w for the Fi, xmax is reached @ 19hz. 500w for the Dayton and excursion reached at 5hz...1db difference. I would go with the dayton for if you want a sealed sub.

For a vented enclosure the Dayton needs something big like 200L for it to perform well. The Fi is better suited for a higher tune of 30hz. Also, the bash amp is not good for a vented enclosure because of the boost I think.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrkazador /forum/post/19545698


Well since no one has replied...
Attachment 192288

^^ Sealed

I input 1000w for the Fi, xmax is reached @ 19hz. 500w for the Dayton and excursion reached at 5hz...1db difference. I would go with the dayton for if you want a sealed sub.

For a vented enclosure the Dayton needs something big like 200L for it to perform well. The Fi is better suited for a higher tune of 30hz. Also, the bash amp is not good for a vented enclosure because of the boost I think.
Attachment 192308


I decided on going with the Dayton in a sealed enclosure(18x18x18=2.6 ft^3) @ 500 watts since i got an output of about 110db at 30hz with only 14.5mm of its 20.5mm xmax and reached its xmax at 3.50hz.


Should i use polyfill or is polyfill only used when the driver desires a larger enclosure?
 

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the fi ssd15 has almost 3 inches of mechanical excursion, and is better built than the dayton driver is, at least in my mind. Its also a super efficient driver, so you dont NEED a ton of power to get it knocking, yet it will handle a grip o' power if you wanted it to. I am running 3600 rms to my pair of ssd's, and they seem like they are still floating along like its nothing. Even with as little as 150 watts to them, they can still pull hair tricks in my room. The sound quality is amazing as well.


I would go with the fi personally, since its about the same price.


BTW, xmax in winisd is peak, and most speakers are rated one way, so you will want to double that number when you enter your parameters.


Sealed enclosures will not play low stuff real well, compared to a ported design, but as long as the enclosure is designed and built properly, a ported enclosure can sound just as good as a sealed design will, and will get much louder due to the port gain. If you go with an SSD, I would recommend going ported, they arent really designed for sealed enclosures if you ask me.


Two things to watch for when designing a ported box are to make sure your group delay and air velocity is under 30-35 m/s for best results, but a little higher is OK too.


If you have any more questions, I am subscribed! Happy Thanksgiving.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by s_carter /forum/post/19547362


the fi ssd15 has almost 3 inches of mechanical excursion, and is better built than the dayton driver is, at least in my mind. Its also a super efficient driver, so you dont NEED a ton of power to get it knocking, yet it will handle a grip o' power if you wanted it to. I am running 3600 rms to my pair of ssd's, and they seem like they are still floating along like its nothing. Even with as little as 150 watts to them, they can still pull hair tricks in my room. The sound quality is amazing as well.


I would go with the fi personally, since its about the same price.


BTW, xmax in winisd is peak, and most speakers are rated one way, so you will want to double that number when you enter your parameters.


Sealed enclosures will not play low stuff real well, compared to a ported design, but as long as the enclosure is designed and built properly, a ported enclosure can sound just as good as a sealed design will, and will get much louder due to the port gain. If you go with an SSD, I would recommend going ported, they arent really designed for sealed enclosures if you ask me.


Two things to watch for when designing a ported box are to make sure your group delay and air velocity is under 30-35 m/s for best results, but a little higher is OK too.


If you have any more questions, I am subscribed! Happy Thanksgiving.

Thank you so much for your well detailed reply. Can you help me with the dimensions of the box? When i open up Winisd it automatically made a box with 3.731 ft^3 tuned to 28.41 hz. Is a box with external dimensions of 25 H x 18 W x 18 D fine? Also i want to make a square port but have no idea how to make it when it comes to the width/height/depth of port, air velocity, port noise etc.


Also, is 3/4 mdf fine or is 1" mdf better?
http://www.lowes.com/pd_249496-99999...7_?identifier=


Happy Thanksgiving to you too, even though it is a bit late lol
 

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To answer your earlier question, the extra 3 inches of cone area will make quite a difference, if you can spare the airspace needed for a 15" driver, about 4-6 cubes for a ported enclosure.


Here is an Enclosure Volume Calculator , it will help you determine your internal volumes, and calculate driver and port volume displacement and lots of other good stuff.


Winisd will calculate your port length and area for a square port or a slotted port of a given size. just open your project, and enter your desired enclosure volume and then go to vents, and change the shape from round, to square. then its all about playing with your port dimensions until you can match it to your design blueprints. The port length and area requirements will vary with your internal volume. 12-16 inches of port area is recommended per cubic foot of airspace. As I said before, you will want to watch your group delay and rear port velocity. Just remember that winisd does not take port and driver displacements into its measurements, so you will need to use the EVC, to figure out how much more internal volume you will need for the port.


Is the dimensions you listed your "maximum" footprint?


3/4" should do just fine for you, I would cross brace it internally on each panel to cut down on panel resonances, like so...



Also, the BASH amp's bass boost can be disabled or modified by changing a resistor. there are guides floating around online on this process somewhere. Google is your friend.
 

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nope, under specs, it says 4 feet by 12 inches. the regular 4x8 panels are close to 35-40 bucks. unless you can find something cheaper at your local lumber yard, sometimes you can, i almost never pay more than 20 bucks for a panel. ask around about damaged panels, most stores will cut the price in half for a small chip or break in the corner of a panel.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by s_carter /forum/post/19550852


Here is an Enclosure Volume Calculator , it will help you determine your internal volumes, and calculate driver and port volume displacement and lots of other good stuff.



Is the dimensions you listed your "maximum" footprint?


Also, the BASH amp's bass boost can be disabled or modified by changing a resistor. there are guides floating around online on this process somewhere. Google is your friend.

That is a magnificent website for enclosures there thank you!


Well that is the volume that Winisd gives me as soon as i make a new project with the Fi driver. Besides, on the Fi website it recomends the SSD 15 to be in a 3-4 ft^3 enclosure @ 33 hz.


Just to make sure, does the port length, width, and height give the box its tuning frequency? If not how do i tune a box to lets say 28hz for the Fi in a 3.7 ft^3 box?


What does the bass boost do, what if i never use it?


In winisd i made a square port with dimensions of 5 H x 12 W x 3.23" D

and my peak air velocity is : 19 m/s @ 68hz and group delay is : 18 m/s @ 70 hz is that fine?
 

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Your port tuning is way off there, at 3.7, a 5x12" port that is 3.23" long is tuned to 64 hertz. that will not work too well for you.


The port tuning changes with the size and length of the port. smaller and shorter raises the tuning, and larger and longer lowers it. The box size also affects the ports tuning frequency, so make sure to double check your calculations.


If you want a loud setup that has good SQ as well, I would make the box bigger. Between 5-6 cubic feet tuned to 28 hertz looks pretty damned good. A smaller box will increase sound quality to a point, but also dampen the drivers efficiency. At 6 cubes, a 4"x12" port is still below 12 inches per cubic foot(48 inches of port area), but it should be fine for you, I run a 4x12 port for each of my 18's and the port noise is unnoticeable.


A 4" tall, 12" wide, and 20 inch long port in a 6 cube box looks excellent to me, and brings your tune to 28.3 hertz... If you can spare the space for it, it will be a hair trick box for sure.


Bass boost is just that, it is a bass boost, usually about 2 or 3 db's of boost centered around 32-34 hertz, depending on the resistor configuration. with the setup above, you wont need it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by s_carter /forum/post/19553910


Your port tuning is way off there, at 3.7, a 5x12" port that is 3.23" long is tuned to 64 hertz. that will not work too well for you.


The port tuning changes with the size and length of the port. smaller and shorter raises the tuning, and larger and longer lowers it. The box size also affects the ports tuning frequency, so make sure to double check your calculations.


If you want a loud setup that has good SQ as well, I would make the box bigger. Between 5-6 cubic feet tuned to 28 hertz looks pretty damned good. A smaller box will increase sound quality to a point, but also dampen the drivers efficiency. At 6 cubes, a 4"x12" port is still below 12 inches per cubic foot(48 inches of port area), but it should be fine for you, I run a 4x12 port for each of my 18's and the port noise is unnoticeable.


A 4" tall, 12" wide, and 20 inch long port in a 6 cube box looks excellent to me, and brings your tune to 28.3 hertz... If you can spare the space for it, it will be a hair trick box for sure.


Bass boost is just that, it is a bass boost, usually about 2 or 3 db's of boost centered around 32-34 hertz, depending on the resistor configuration. with the setup above, you wont need it.

I can't go any larger than 5.2 cubes (which is more than i want) because it may not fit in my car in the future (coupe for sure).


So in a box with dimensions of 20 W x 28 H x 20 D (5.2 cubes) how can i tune the box to 28hz? I can't seem to find the correct values in Winisd without the port being extremely long (like 40") or without the air velocity and group delay being under 40 m/s please help me?


About the bass boost if i desolder the resistors will that disable the bass boost? ( confusing): http://www.parts-express.com/pdf/300-752.pdf


Remember my preference is hip-hop and rap music only.
 

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I am not sure on how to disable it, I have only changed the bass boost on one of these amps before, but I am sure there will be somebody here that can help with that more than I can. Removing the resistors would probably not work.


With those box dimensions, a 4" high by 8" wide port that is 14.5 inches long (due to box size limitations of 20 inches outside depth, and 18.5" internal from front to back, minus 4 inches for the port to back wall clearance) will be 15.25" long including the front baffle thickness. This will displace 836 inches, bringing your airspace to 4.765 ft3 after port displacement. It achieves a tune of 29.5 hertz, while both the air velocity and group delay are under 23.

That's about as close as you can get, unless you make the port smaller, or build the port with a 90 degree bend in it.


Confused yet? I probably would be if I were you. Good luck with the build! I am around to help when I can.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by s_carter
I am not sure on how to disable it, I have only changed the bass boost on one of these amps before, but I am sure there will be somebody here that can help with that more than I can. Removing the resistors would probably not work.


With those box dimensions, a 4" high by 8" wide port that is 14.5 inches long (due to box size limitations of 20 inches outside depth, and 18.5" internal from front to back, minus 4 inches for the port to back wall clearance) will be 15.25" long including the front baffle thickness. This will displace 836 inches, bringing your airspace to 4.765 ft3 after port displacement. It achieves a tune of 29.5 hertz, while both the air velocity and group delay are under 23.

That's about as close as you can get, unless you make the port smaller, or build the port with a 90 degree bend in it.


Confused yet? I probably would be if I were you. Good luck with the build! I am around to help when I can.
Thank you so much Sam Carter ( i saw your 18" subs on youtube, AMAZING!!!) for all the help you have provided. I will start on the project as soon as i have the money for the 15" Fi SSD and the materials for the enclosure.

Once again thank you very much and is there a way to like give you respect or thank you on this forum? If there is ill click on it 10 times
.
 

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I don't think there is, but you can tell everyone you know about my work, I can always use more business for designing and building enclosures. I always design my enclosures from the ground up, and are built by hand by me. Add me on facebook if you have an account. I just heard from my last customer, that a few install shops he went to the other day are very impressed with his design, and are interested in contracting me on for custom enclosures. Exciting news for my business!


My designs aren't limited to car audio either, I can also build home subs as well.
 
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