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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well I made topics before which have received a fair bit of response regarding using overlay! Finally I decided to try nvidia decoder, doing direct comparison I enjoyed it a slight bit more then dscaler. I still stand by dscaler and overlay, colors look more vibrant, but the vmr 9 and nvidia combination beat anything else. It just seemed to have a bit better color saturation, and also people and things looked a bit more 3 dimensional if that makes sense. Watching shrek 2 it just seemed shrek popped out at you more with the nivida vmr 9 decoder. Just thought I would share my findings based on direct comparison.
 

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Curious as to what display you are using for the comparison?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Display do you mean my projector? I am running a benq 8700+, my comparisons were not side by side, but switching back and forth and I could see the difference.


Dscaler in vmr9 I will do more tests but colors are not as vibrant for some reason in vmr9 as with overlay. I was doing direct comparisons of shrek 2 and once switching to overlay colors popped out more. Comparing nvidia/vmr9, to dscaler/overlay, nvidia picture just seemed to jump out at me, and looked more 3d.



I love dscaler but I felt nvidia was even a bit better when I tried it, and I think the majority of the forum agrees that nvidia decoders are the best, although some will stand behind dscaler, which is also great.


Surprisingly enough vmr9, ati 9800, p3 3.0, with nvidia decoders I thought I might have some problems with tearing and what not, but everything runs smooth.
 

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Me too. But then again he's using an ATI card, so of course he's got a problem there. ATI's VMR9 isn't that good... I went from a 9800 to an nVIDIA 6800, and even my wife saw the difference at once, and she's by no means an expert or particularly picky.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mastiff
Me too. But then again he's using an ATI card, so of course he's got a problem there. ATI's VMR9 isn't that good...
I have both an ATI 9600 (in my HTPC) and an nVidia 6800 (in my office PC). I can't really say I see too much difference in PQ to be honest.


(I run ZP / Dscaler / VMR Renderless on the ATI card and it looks fantastic.)


Chip
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chippy99
I have both an ATI 9600 (in my HTPC) and an nVidia 6800 (in my office PC). I can't really say I see too much difference in PQ to be honest.


(I run ZP / Dscaler / VMR Renderless on the ATI card and it looks fantastic.)


Chip
They do require different callibrations but between my 9600 and 6600 no difference once calibrated.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mastiff
ATI's VMR9 isn't that good... I went from a 9800 to an nVIDIA 6800, and even my wife saw the difference at once, and she's by no means an expert or particularly picky.
Nvidia's VMR9 performance is bad, so much that you're foreced to use FS (exclusive) renderless to have stutter/tear free playback.


Now, if you're talking of PQ then it's PUREVIDEO (NVDVD on a Geforce 6 or 7 GPU), not VMR9, that should make a difference.


I myself haven't seen much difference in PQ with ZP /Dscaler/ffdshow with film stuff (which is what I use it for) between a 6600GT and a x800 PRO.
 

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That's kind of strange that you haven't seen the difference. Are you by any chance using DVI output? I use regular VGA to a CRT projector, and the difference is very clear, even without Purevideo. I like dScaler 5 (tweaked to close to perfection with FFDShow) better than NVDVD with Purevideo.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulli
Nvidia's VMR9 performance is bad, so much that you're foreced to use FS (exclusive) renderless to have stutter/tear free playback.
Only with DVI (maybe component) at high, interlaced resolutions.
 

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OK, that's probably a totally different ballgame than 1152x864 VGA resolution.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murilo
I love dscaler but I felt nvidia was even a bit better when I tried it, and I think the majority of the forum agrees that nvidia decoders are the best, although some will stand behind dscaler, which is also great.


Surprisingly enough vmr9, ati 9800, p3 3.0, with nvidia decoders I thought I might have some problems with tearing and what not, but everything runs smooth.
You have to calibrate your display from overlay to VMR9. VMR9 is softer and brighter than overlay. W/ a little sharpening w/ ffdshow, you should get that film like image.

I too love dscaler. It has better saturation and a tad less noise than nvidia's codec. Downside is no deinterlacer-yet.


XP3000+/Soundstorm/9800pro256/ZP/ffdshow/nvidia;Dscaler codecs/output

1080i/Mits 65"TV
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by miketech
You have to calibrate your display from overlay to VMR9. VMR9 is softer and brighter than overlay. W/ a little sharpening w/ ffdshow, you should get that film like image.

I too love dscaler. It has better saturation and a tad less noise than nvidia's codec. Downside is no deinterlacer-yet.
Its all down to personal preference I guess. Personally I don't like too much sharpening. I think it makes the picture look rather artificial. Without extra sharpening, all the detail is still there (you never *gain* any detail with sharpening, of course), and I think it looks best like that. Of course you do have to adjust the black levels, that is true.


I just use "Video Essentials" to calibrate my plasma and I'm all set.


And regarding de-interlacing, I only watch film-based DVD's (no video sources), so the 3:2 pulldown works just fine and I don't need any deinterlacing.


I am really impressed with just how good the picture is. My HTPC replaces my Tag McLaren DVD32R (which cost me £4,000) and the HTPC picture is significantly better than that of the Tag!


(Staggeringly, it (the HTPC) also sounds better... but that's another story.)



Chip
 

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Plasma? Then it's no wonder you don't see the difference between an ATI and an nVIDIA card! ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I have seen both and have not noticed a difference either once they were properly calibrated, theres about 4 people on this thread saying the same thing. Honhestly you are the first person I have heard say they notice a difference between ati vmr 9, and nvidia. Infact I see more people having trouble with vmr9 with nvidia cards. Even as this thread explains.


About dscaler having tad better saturation and less noise, I found the exact opposite on a 106 inch screen using my benq 8700+, I was using shrek 2 again and noticed a bit more noise in the castle using dscaler, compared to nvidia.


I am very surprised there is not more nvidia supporters on this thread, it seems most of the forum perfers nvidia, with dscaler a close second.


Also with comments regarding sharpening I also find people using way to much artifical sharpening, adding noise into the picture.


I like luma sharpen at .30 the best. Bit sharper with no added noise.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by stanger89
Only with DVI (maybe component) at high, interlaced resolutions.
I had come to that conclusion myself, but look here .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mastiff
Plasma? Then it's no wonder you don't see the difference between an ATI and an nVIDIA card!
I use component and don't see the difference either when using - READ WELL, ATI-HATER :mad: - Dscaler + ffdshow for film stuff. Now you tell me what is the graphic card exactly doing here to make so apparent a difference for you. With colors well calibrated and no resizing and no deinterlacing by the card I don't see why there should be any difference at all.


Now, with video and HD stuff I do prefer my 6600GT. And I would add that the Theatertek / NVDVD with FS Renderless is a terrific combo, giving me a really excellent PQ, even though I still prefer Dscaler / ffdshow for film.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mastiff
Plasma? Then it's no wonder you don't see the difference between an ATI and an nVIDIA card! ;)
Clearly you haven't looked at a plasma for several years ;-)


Chip
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murilo
I have seen both and have not noticed a difference either once they were properly calibrated, theres about 4 people on this thread saying the same thing. Honhestly you are the first person I have heard say they notice a difference between ati vmr 9, and nvidia.
Vern Dias has posted screenshots showing the difference between nVidia and ATI VMR9.
 

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I looked at rather expensive plasma (15 000 dollars) in June, but decided that the technology is far from good enough even for my regular living room TV, and using it in the HT is totally out of the question. Plasma/LCD/DLP and all that is design, space saving and ease of use. CRT is still the king if you don't want to spend more than 30 000 dollars, which is the price I have found an (to me) acceptable DLP projector for in Norway.


As for artificial sharpening I can understand (and I have seen myself) that it looks really bad on digital display devices, but a good CRT device will usually benefit from a little of the stuff. There's always too much, though.
 
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