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Forza 2 GRAPHICS DISCUSSION

14000 Views 293 Replies 96 Participants Last post by  AST, 
H
2
No Car talk, no lap times, no "feels weird with the wheel" talk...just graphics talk



Forza 2's graphics Suck. I mean, they suck. YES, I'm basing this off the demo, YES I know its one track..but if this is any indication...hoooo-mygod...this ain't next gen in the slightest.


Lets get the obvious crap out of the way first:


Antialiasing: None...the jaggies in PGR3 didn't look anywhere near as bad as this game does...nor does this game appear any more high rez than PGR3 does (as we all know PGR3 isn't quite running at 720p). They are bad and distracting, I think its because the cars are so absurdly shiney and the lighting engine is so broken.


Anisotropic Filtering: None...NONE! Its like Trilinear filtering..go off the track onto gravel and watch as you see huge bands of filtering happening..one band..then the next..then "flat, blurry ground texture". WTF? This DESTROYS the look of the game when stuff blurs out like I'm playing the game on a videocard from 1998.


There are the two big ones.....but those aren't even the ones I have the most problem with, its THIS: Tell me..is the track I am racing on supposed to be super brightly lit?? Because on my CRT set, which is just fine for every other game, the sky looks like there should be sunlight, but everything is darkened like I'm racing on an overcast day with the sun directly above me obscured by clouds.....BUT there is BLINDING white "light reflections" off every car, like I'm racing in the middle of a California day without a cloud in the sky??? No lightbloom? No light streams? No deep shadows?? I mean the lighting in GT3 seems more correct than this map looks...?!??!?! Is it my eyes!?


Damn kids, this IS Forza 1 running upscaled with higher rez textures....


And speaking of reflections....boy did those guys go absolutely nuts with the reflection tool......thats one of the reasons, I think, the jaggies are so absurdly bad....because every edge on the car screams out like its lit-up by a spotlight.



The gameplay is fun, but thats not what this thread is about....this is just about the visuals, and I have to say I am most definately unimpressed....they really dropped the ball on this one. The cars in the menus look terribly fake and rendered (the cars in PGR3's outdoor environments practically look like photographs, sans the jaggies)......ugh, man..disappointing.
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R
Personally, I'll wait till the full version is out. Then it's quite easy.


Take the F430 at N-Ring in PGR3 and compare it directly the Forza 2 version.


If the graphics look better in Forza 2 (let's not forget 60FPS!) and clearly the gameplays/sounds/controls are heads and shoulders better, that's a winner enough for me.
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C
forza looks beautiful man that 60fps at 720p is not playing lol but yeah the jaggies are annoying and the cars look a little cartoony..still im buying the game though
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M
The graphics, especially the jaggies is my only complaint about the game/demo so far.
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KoRn
People are never happy with anything in life. Im not surprised about this out all by people. It looks awesome. The jaggies suck. But its just a demo. Retail always looks better and more polished.
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R

Quote:
Originally Posted by KoRn /forum/post/0


People are never happy with anything in life. Im not surprised about this out all by people. It looks awesome. The jaggies suck. But its just a demo. Retail always looks better and more polished.
Click to expand...


You make a very good point. I'd call this generation of consoles "the bitching years." Maybe everyone's turning emo or bought into CGI demo's too much....whatever the reason, they have some very unrealistic expectations.


If Turn10 focused primarily on the graphics and shifted the resources towards that, you'd be getting threads like


"OMG! controls suck!!!"

"it's not all about graphics, horrible gameplay!"

"that's not how cars sound!!!"

etc...etc...etc...


The term compromise doesn't seem to be in anyone's vocabulary nowadays.
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D

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadRusch /forum/post/0


Damn kids, this IS Forza 1 running upscaled with higher rez textures....
Click to expand...

You make some good points; too bad you blew it all in a wad of hyperbole.
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D

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadRusch /forum/post/0


No Car talk, no lap times, no "feels weird with the wheel" talk...just graphics talk



Forza 2's graphics Suck. I mean, they suck. YES, I'm basing this off the demo, YES I know its one track..but if this is any indication...hoooo-mygod...this ain't next gen in the slightest.


Lets get the obvious crap out of the way first:


Antialiasing: None...the jaggies in PGR3 didn't look anywhere near as bad as this game does...nor does this game appear any more high rez than PGR3 does (as we all know PGR3 isn't quite running at 720p). They are bad and distracting, I think its because the cars are so absurdly shiney and the lighting engine is so broken.


Anisotropic Filtering: None...NONE! Its like Trilinear filtering..go off the track onto gravel and watch as you see huge bands of filtering happening..one band..then the next..then "flat, blurry ground texture". WTF? This DESTROYS the look of the game when stuff blurs out like I'm playing the game on a videocard from 1998.


There are the two big ones.....but those aren't even the ones I have the most problem with, its THIS: Tell me..is the track I am racing on supposed to be super brightly lit?? Because on my CRT set, which is just fine for every other game, the sky looks like there should be sunlight, but everything is darkened like I'm racing on an overcast day with the sun directly above me obscured by clouds.....BUT there is BLINDING white "light reflections" off every car, like I'm racing in the middle of a California day without a cloud in the sky??? No lightbloom? No light streams? No deep shadows?? I mean the lighting in GT3 seems more correct than this map looks...?!??!?! Is it my eyes!?


Damn kids, this IS Forza 1 running upscaled with higher rez textures....


And speaking of reflections....boy did those guys go absolutely nuts with the reflection tool......thats one of the reasons, I think, the jaggies are so absurdly bad....because every edge on the car screams out like its lit-up by a spotlight.



The gameplay is fun, but thats not what this thread is about....this is just about the visuals, and I have to say I am most definately unimpressed....they really dropped the ball on this one. The cars in the menus look terribly fake and rendered (the cars in PGR3's outdoor environments practically look like photographs, sans the jaggies)......ugh, man..disappointing.
Click to expand...

You expect too much from titles that are planned to have 18-month releases.

Great games take a lot of time to produce.

Yet, we all know people will buy it, even if it's rushed.
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D

Quote:
Originally Posted by KoRn /forum/post/0


People are never happy with anything in life. Im not surprised about this out all by people. It looks awesome. The jaggies suck. But its just a demo. Retail always looks better and more polished.
Click to expand...

If you think it's gonna look very different in its final version, you are deluding yourself.
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D
They aimed for 60 fps thats why you have a lot of jaggies. There is almost no motion blur either. It was that or 30 fps with motion blur and probably less aliasing. But thats the way the cookie crumbles. It still looks good, not PGR3 good. But the gameplay is pretty impressive, especially if you use the wireless wheel.
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M
Jaggies aside, I think it is the most realistic driving sim around. I am glad they did not glitz up the colors. I looks realistic to me. I even like the reflections off the hood.
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J
Stop the crying you grown men.The game is awesome and it's smooth as butter
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F
I must have been the few that was underestimating the graphics a bit. I am thoroughly impressed on my set- 27" CRT HDTV 1080i (yes I see the jaggies but overall very smooth gameplay). I have GT4 on my running through component along side the 360 through my receiver and having switched back and forth many times I will say FM2 looks MUCH better (as it should). That was what I was hoping for, a step up from GT4 plus turn10 perfected the physics. All around I'm fine with the game graphically.
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L
LMAOD once again. CLASSIC, 4 stars, best comedy ever...


Jaggies, oh dear God... the jaggies

NOT next gen,

banding,

2d cartoonish crowd,

shiny cars,

model looking cars,

not as good as GT-HD,

doesnt look much better than the original,

graphics on pgr3 are better,

the track is a flat (almost cartoonish) grey,

Please please anti-alias!


there's your basic crazy "next gen" peoples reactions...


I dont see any probs. would have liked a city course too but this 1 track let me see just enough.
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L
playing on a LCD 32" Toshiba at 1080i over component. Honestly I think the graphics are great. Yes they aren't perfect but they do their job of immersing you in the game. The backgrounds are just detailed enough to add to the sense of speed with out distracting and teh reflections are smooth enough that I feel like I could use my hood as a side mirror. One think I'd liek to note is that the pavement is photo realistic. Not a single square meter is identical to one another on the demo track especially after a few laps(each races treadmarks and burnouts stay there. I do wish the crash damage on so we could feel the mayhem we're causing but the visual damages are great. It's pretty cool when you run over your own bumper that you lost on the 1st lap.
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H
I gave it some more time this evening, and I'll say a few positives now, having been so utterly unimpressed the first time through it:


The racing environments look good, that is draw-distance wise, seeing hillsides and buildings and the rolling track and fencing in the distance, that does look nice particularly because its 720p and there is some detail in farther-off objects.


The cars also look good, except that they're too damn shiney. Its not so bad on the racing cars, but for the entire first race in the starter class I thought all the cars chasing me were 2-tone, with white roofs or hoods...but it was just the never-ending white shine of the sun which can't be seen in the sky (which is that odd Is it daylight/overcast? issue I mentioned in my post above).


I noticed they implemented a form of "soft shadowing" on the ground but I don't recall seeing cars shadowing each other, just reflecting off each other...I'll have to take another look at that.


PS: I dont expect the game to look any different at all when its released, I have yet to see a game that improved in any perceivable way between demo and going gold, and I dont think Forza2 will be the exception.


Personally, I'd gladly trade 30fps for prettier graphics....60fps just isn't necessary for racing games because there isn't enough happening at any one time that would make 30fps a liability. Shooters? Sure...Fighting Games? I guess...but driving games? Not so much.


As for Hyperbole....perhaps thats a stretch, but honestly......without the whiz-bang visual effects we've grown accustomed to (AF filtering, AA...HDR lighting and blooming, etc)...this game looks like GTHD does...a resolution and texture upgrade to an existing game.


It looks...Hmmm...It looks like a PC GAME, maybe thats a better way to describe it. I mean, maybe with the sun (light source) lower on the horizon a little bit of lens-flare or something might have worked better to increase the eyecandy, some HDR light blooming as you drove around the track.


Is there any bump-mapping or normal mapping going on with the surface of the road, or is it just a flat texture...I can't recall from memory right now but for some reason I felt that those effects were missing..the textures on the ground seemed extremely "flat" to me (hurt partly by not having AF enabled too).


I'm not saying the game is bad, I'm just talking about the graphics and the eyecandy...thats all.


Oh yeah, you guys on 32" and 27" displays....the graphics break down a bit when you start getting into larger screen sizes...I'm viewing on a 65" display, where things like banding on the ground from Trilinear filtering stand out like a huge sore thumb, which may be much easier to hide when you're 4-5 feet away or more from a 32" set.
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J
I never played Forza 1. I just played this Forza 2 demo and I really don't like to be too quick to criticize as there are many factors to consider, but I will say this: The cars do seem to have a cell shaded look to them and this disappoints me. I reserve judgement on other aspects of the game.
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U
I was underwhelmed by the visuals. Not as beautiful as the stills that has been floating around the net for months. In particular, the decals on the cars look terrible. It looks like it was cut from a low resolution picture of the car and pasted on the vehicles. The jaggies are clearly noticeable on the edges of the car and the shine from the vehicles look plain.


In the end, I'm sure it will be a good game. But I was hoping for more in terms of "wow" factor. I'm not all about graphics, but I was expecting so much more.
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1
I'd say the graphics look... good. Competent is a good way to put it. I agree the cars are too shiny. Regarding the jaggies though, I think the edges of actual car geometry are pretty smooth, but the reflection mapping is low res and doesn't appear to be filtered well, resulting in an effect that looks very similar to aliased geometry. Semantics really. The end result still looks like ass. I appreciate the frame rate and the overall look of the game is pretty solid.


I've played GT-HD at my friend's house. He and I have the same model of projector, so it's a good comparison. Man, that game looks REALLY good. A real step up from the Forza 2 demo. However, GT hasn't historically had the same level of visible exterior modifications. GT also hasn't had damage modeling or really good AI. My guess is the Forza 2 developers may have the talent to get within striking distance of the GT-HD eye candy, but made some trade offs to leave enough processing headroom for other features.
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J
^^^


i dont know. IMO the RR7 demo looked better than GTHD. I thought the part where you exit the tunnel & the sun gets in your eyes was a neat feature. Gameplay wise though...
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