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Ted, I'd really enjoy if you could talk in depth about the use of a tube frustum mask also for FCCM creation, as foreseen in the EBU TECH 3325 and IDMS publications.
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
Ted, I'd really enjoy if you could talk in depth about the use of a tube frustum mask also for FCCM creation, as foreseen in the EBU TECH 3325 and IDMS publications.
Such details are important for lab grade environment testing or during panel manufacturing testing.
 

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...or when you calibrate during daylight like me ;)
 

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Great thread Ted thanks maybe we can add some tips just like which pattern size for different TV kids maybe help to improve such as the right stimulus for creating a good meter profile
 

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Do any AVS'rs here have a Jeti, Klein K10 and an OLED TV and CM?

I was doing some more experimenting profiling the Klein with the Jeti to my A9F/A1E OLED and the xy coordinates match almost perfectly but i'm still getting a 3% red luminance error between the two. I have the Jeti at 5'9" and the Klein with the hood in contact mode so the FOV should be the same. I can verify that the Jeti profile is exact and consistend vs the i1Pro2 which works but was harder to get the same accuracy and consistency in the profile probably in part due to the difficulty aiming the i1. The Jeti laser makes this task easy.

I'm curious if someone else can replicate this finding and compare it with a profile using Chromasurf. I don't have the time right now to do this experiment but it needs to be done.
Thanks:)
 

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What do you guys think of circular test patterns instead of square windows, come to thinking about this with the laser pointer of my klein instrument,circular meassurement field,so why have square test patterns? also if we have circular patterns you could match your meter fov with the size of the circle,just hit continious reading and move meter backwards until it start to missread (hitting black) then you know the fov of the meter,cant think of any dissadvantage of circular patterns or am i missing something?

Would like to see:

* Circle pattern single adjustable in size.

* Circle patterns 2ea side by side for simultanious reading of 2 meters.

* Using circles with fov match also works as a perfect aim spot so meassurements are at same place.
 

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Yesterday I had a little time to experiment and as many have said over and over, there are so many little things that can introduce errors or inaccuracies when calibrating making the final PQ less than optimal. But i'm finding profiling is probably more important than most people might think to get an accurate picture. For example, if your meter is seeing less red than is actually there, when you calibrate you may increase red more than is really needed to get to D65. You will then notice memory colors like skin tones having a more reddish tint that there should be. I started noticing this when comparing the i1Pro2 to the Jeti. I understand the two devices are in different leagues but although the i1Pro2 works well, if I had to comment on changes using the Jeti, if you are super critical, memory colors such as skin tones look more accurate to me profiling with the Jeti. Interesting.:)
 

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For 6000$ I would kill if I’d not get better accuracy than a 1100$ probe lol
 
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Do any AVS'rs here have a Jeti, Klein K10 and an OLED TV and CM?

I was doing some more experimenting profiling the Klein with the Jeti to my A9F/A1E OLED and the xy coordinates match almost perfectly but i'm still getting a 3% red luminance error between the two. I have the Jeti at 5'9" and the Klein with the hood in contact mode so the FOV should be the same. I can verify that the Jeti profile is exact and consistend vs the i1Pro2 which works but was harder to get the same accuracy and consistency in the profile probably in part due to the difficulty aiming the i1. The Jeti laser makes this task easy.

I'm curious if someone else can replicate this finding and compare it with a profile using Chromasurf. I don't have the time right now to do this experiment but it needs to be done.
Thanks:)
Hi John,

Remember what Ted posted in the other thread.

Klein K10A FOV in contact mode:

43mm = No Attachment
48mm = Rubber Hood
55mm = Extension Tube
60mm = Extension Tube + Rubber Hood..

At 5'9" distance, the JETI actual measuring diameter is 56.08mm. That's a big difference.
 

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For the JETI, the formula for the real measuring diameter is 0.032 * distance, so...

5'9" = 1752.6 mm
1752.6 mm * 0.032 = 56.0832 mm

Move the JETI closer to the panel to reduce JETI diameter, or use the Klein extension tube + rubber hood to enlarge the Klein spot size to 60 mm.
 

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For the JETI, the formula for the real measuring diameter is 0.032 * distance, so...

5'9" = 1752.6 mm
1752.6 mm * 0.032 = 56.0832 mm

Move the JETI closer to the panel to reduce JETI diameter, or use the Klein extension tube + rubber hood to enlarge the Klein spot size to 60 mm.
Got it so the Jeti needs to be 4ft 9 inches away from the panel to match the Klein with the rubber hood in contact mode for 48 mm. For my A9F in my living room that's approximately where I had the Jeti because my couch was in the way of moving it back further and those are the scans I posted with the 3%ish red luminance errors. Something else going on because the rest of the colors and white are right on. I'll try it again with the exact FOV but it still would be good to see if anyone else can replicate the behavior. With your LCD are you using CM to profile and if so what are you seeing?
 

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Incidentally, the Bosch laser device measures from the back of the case. The case is 4" or 100 cm long. If you have it side by side with the JETI, like I do - on a rail) you must add those 4" to the distance you are measuring. Because I have my 1501 six feet from the display, I have to set the laser to read 6'4". Get it?

If you place the laser in front of the JETI to measure distance, then you don't have to add the length of the laser device.


Edit: that's a typo, the case is 100 mm long
 

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Incidentally, the Bosch laser device measures from the back of the case. The case is 4" or 100 cm long. If you have it side by side with the JETI, like I do - on a rail) you must add those 4" to the distance you are measuring. Because I have my 1501 six feet from the display, I have to set the laser to read 6'4". Get it?

If you place the laser in front of the JETI to measure distance, then you don't have to add the length of the laser device.
Yes I saw that in the instructions. I have a laser measuring device from many years ago that I use for construction projects but I like the Bosch because it's so small that it fits in my calibration pack and has a nice backlit display. Great choice.
 
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AFAIK It's an FCCM related issue affecting only OLED displays. Plasma/LCD are unaffecteds.
 
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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Got it so the Jeti needs to be 4ft 9 inches away from the panel to match the Klein with the rubber hood in contact mode for 48 mm. For my A9F in my living room that's approximately where I had the Jeti because my couch was in the way of moving it back further and those are the scans I posted with the 3%ish red luminance errors. Something else going on because the rest of the colors and white are right on. I'll try it again with the exact FOV but it still would be good to see if anyone else can replicate the behavior. With your LCD are you using CM to profile and if so what are you seeing?
Use the Sony AF9 OLED, open JETI LiVal, set manually refreshing rate (right click) 120Hz, set Average 5, display 100% White patch, click Measure, do the same for 100% Red/Green/Blue patches (100% Stimulus) and then click File -> Save.... (select the 4 measurements and save)... upload it here and I will explain to you why you have 3% error ;)

Do the same test with Sony LCD ZF9 also, and upload a second file.
 

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I don't get a big luminance error for red during profiling on my LCD. Not sure if this is what you mean.
I know your LCD shouldn't have this problem since it's an OLED behavior but after you profile, use Ted's profile verification workflow and post it so we can see your values.
 

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Use the Sony AF9 OLED, open JETI LiVal, set manually refreshing rate (right click) 120Hz, set Average 5, display 100% White patch, click Measure, do the same for 100% Red/Green/Blue patches (100% Stimulus) and then click File -> Save.... (select the 4 measurements and save)... upload it here and I will explain to you why you have 3% error ;)

Do the same test with Sony LCD ZF9 also, and upload a second file.
OK I'll do this tomorrow since i'll be calibrating.

Maybe @Pres2play can do the same for his LCD so we can compare. If not, i'll go to the store and take some measurements.

Ted thanks again!
 

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Here are my JETI values from last night. I use Ted's 4-color, 100% amplitude test patterns. The sync number is high, and rather unusual, if you're accustomed to normal refresh rates of 60, 120, etc., but the JETI is very consistent with these numbers, so I trust the readings.
 

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