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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Watching the Indians vs. Tigers in upconverted 480p. It is not true HD but the casual tv watcher probably couldn't even tell the difference. IMO it should be a rule that all shows (especially sports) that are not in HD must be upconverted to 480p widescreen. 4:3 programming should be phased out. I think Fox does this with their So You Think You Can Dance show too. Why don't more networks do this? It can't be that expensive?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NetworkTV /forum/post/0


I say, do it in HD or do it in SD but don't confuse people out there that already have trouble figuring out what is and isn't HD.

You mean the same people who swear they are watching HD because they have a digital cable box connected to their 20 year old Sony TV through RGB? They can't EVEN see widescreen and they are already confused.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetworkTV /forum/post/0


I say, do it in HD or do it in SD but don't confuse people out there that already have trouble figuring out what is and isn't HD.


I seem to remember the uproar about Fox's comments regarding whether people could tell the difference between ED and HD....

Of course I would love to have the game done in HD, but I would much rather watch the game in 480p widescreen rather than getting 1/3 of the field cut off the picture. Sports in widescreen makes a huge difference when you can see more of what's going on.
 

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It's worth mentioning that it's not in 480p -- the games originate in component 480i and are upconverted to 720p. Everything on the FOX network is 720p, whether it be native 720p or upconverted 480i. What makes the upconverts look good is the quality of FOX's upconverter -- I don't know whose box that is, but it's the best I've seen.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NortheasternPJ /forum/post/0


Id rather have it in 480i/p widescreen than 4:3 any day.

I agree!!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg /forum/post/0


Watching the Indians vs. Tigers in upconverted 480p. It is not true HD but the casual tv watcher probably couldn't even tell the difference. IMO it should be a rule that all shows (especially sports) that are not in HD must be upconverted to 480p widescreen. 4:3 programming should be phased out. I think Fox does this with their So You Think You Can Dance show too. Why don't more networks do this? It can't be that expensive?

On one hand, I can tell the difference that it's DVD-quality and think "why not more HD?"


On the other hand, at least FOX cares enough to bring widescreen much more than the other networks. The current mentality amongst the networks feels like "widescreen HD or nothin' " IMO. FOX upconverters do a great job; even Saturday morning cartoons look better upconverted (even though it's 4:3...*ahem*).


Raises toast for SD widescreen.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by videojanitor /forum/post/0


It's worth mentioning that it's not in 480p -- the games originate in component 480i and are upconverted to 720p. Everything on the FOX network is 720p, whether it be native 720p or upconverted 480i. What makes the upconverts look good is the quality of FOX's upconverter -- I don't know whose box that is, but it's the best I've seen.

Thanks for pointing this out - it is worth re-inforcing that there is no real practical 480/60p production kit out there.


If a show is 16:9 but not HD it is almost certainly produced in 480/60i. Almost all broadcast SD cameras (which are 480/60i in the US) sold over the last 5 years (and many sold over the last 10 years) have been available in 16:9/4:3 switchable versions (as well as 4:3 only variants in some cases) Many facilities have bought the switchable versions and just have to flick a switch (or quite a few in reality) to move between 4:3 480/60i and 16:9 480/60i configurations in a facility or truck. (I've worked in 16:9 480/60i SD in the US for UK productions in the past) None of this is 480p - 480/60p cameras and production gear doesn't really exist (though HD cameras and switchers may also support 480/60p - but then if you are using HD infrastructure you'd be working in HD...)


Fox just used to upconvert 480i to 480p for transmission - they didn't shoot in 480p (though many assumed they did). (*)


(*) They did experiment with 480/60p cameras from Philips in the early days I believe - but AFAIK these trials were not used for wider production.


*** Any chance a moderator can edit the thread title to reflect that it is 480i or SD rather than 480p?***
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by videojanitor /forum/post/0


What makes the upconverts look good is the quality of FOX's upconverter -- I don't know whose box that is, but it's the best I've seen.

I think it's an Evertz 7700 series card.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sneals2000 /forum/post/0


None of this is 480p - 480/60p cameras and production gear doesn't really exist (though HD cameras and switchers may also support 480/60p - but then if you are using HD infrastructure you'd be working in HD...)

The game in question here, the Tigers and Indians, and many of these other upconvert Fox games are produced using an HD capable truck.


Todays game was produced in HD, however only SD was transmitted from the ballpark to FOX in LA for network distribution.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CycloneGT /forum/post/0


Fox widescreen has always looked just as good as HD.


As Jesus said " if the blind lead the blind will they not both end up in a ditch?"
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by homcom /forum/post/0


Not always. Last year it looked horrible when they were using component backhaul.

I think you meant composite backhaul. The component backhauls can look very good, especially with uncompressed 270Mb. So You Think You Can Dance is WS SD using 270Mb lines.
 

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actually, I think the leap from 480i 4:3 to 480 16:9 upconverted to 720p is probably greater than from WS to 720p true HD for most people (myself included).


what I don't get is: if my local channel 9 can do Dodgers and Lakers AWAY games in HD, why can't fox? cheapskates!
 
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