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I thought you knew this already Dean.. here is one example:


ES IV will use the HDD heavily if present and the game plays smoother with it.. So if you don't have the HDD attached the game will be degraded in comparison and not run as smoothly. We'll be able to see for ourselves once the game is actually available.



Pete Hines of Bethseda "For those of you that have been wondering, just a quick word. Oblivion does not REQUIRE a hard drive to work on Xbox 360. It will work on every Xbox 360. We would recommend you get one if you have the means because we use it heavily if you have one and it makes the game play smoother, but it is in no way a requirement. "
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I heard rumors of that being a possibility but nothing in print from an MS or someone really in the know.

As far as Oblivion, the last I heard was just that it could be played with or without, not that the experience would change.
 

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I would guess that these games are also going to be reviewed primarily on the HDD connected state. I am guessing that reviewers may actually ding a game if it does not run better (faster load times) with an HD then without!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSound
I would guess that these games are also going to be reviewed primarily on the HDD connected state. I am guessing that reviewers may actually ding a game if it does not run better (faster load times) with an HD then without!
Interesting thought. Will reviewers actually take that into consideration and vocalize it? Will they take the time for that in a review?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Martin
I heard rumors of that being a possibility but nothing in print from an MS or someone really in the know.

As far as Oblivion, the last I heard was just that it could be played with or without, not that the experience would change.
I guess you forgot about the conversation we had.. here is an excerpt


Originally Posted by Dean Martin
It has to do with the fact that an HDD isn't really necessary to have good games. At least Sony doesn't think so eithe since theirs will be an option also.


briankmonkey:.... one of the points of th HDD on the xbox was that some games cached to the HDD and reduced loadings times for a better experience.


No it isn't needed but it can make the experience better.. Obviously there is a reason that developers of games for the 360 have stated they are going to cache to the HDD, they've stated that it will indeed reduce load times. The developer of ES:IV has also stated on their website that they recommend having the HDD for their game.. Reason most likely is that it will work both ways but probably be a better experiences with the HDD. That doesn't mean that without it is bad, just maybe not as great of an experience.


Dean: If that is true then it is bad. Let's hope that they can make games do different things so we can still have choices.


Brian:"For those of you that have been wondering, just a quick word. Oblivion does not REQUIRE a hard drive to work on Xbox 360. It will work on every Xbox 360. We would recommend you get one if you have the means because we use it heavily if you have one and it makes the game play smoother, but it is in no way a requirement. "


from Pete Hines of Bethesda (makes of ES:IV oblivion). go to the website for more info


Dean: Originally Posted by briankmonkey

"For those of you that have been wondering, just a quick word. Oblivion does not REQUIRE a hard drive to work on Xbox 360. It will work on every Xbox 360. We would recommend you get one if you have the means because we use it heavily if you have one and it makes the game play smoother, but it is in no way a requirement. "


from Pete Hines of Bethesda (makes of ES:IV oblivion). go to the website for more info

Another rumor SQUASHED.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSound
I would guess that these games are also going to be reviewed primarily on the HDD connected state. I am guessing that reviewers may actually ding a game if it does not run better (faster load times) with an HD then without!
most likely they will note in the review how the game runs without the HDD..
 

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I would guess it would be some simple things like.... "The game takes 10 seconds to load scene 'X' with the HD, and 30 seconds without".


And if it did not use the HD.... "Loads are the same whether you do or do not have an HD. It is a shame that 'Developer X' did not utilize the HD as other games have shown a significant improvement by caching...." etc.
 

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Apple recently ordered 40% of Samsung's flash capacity. Looks like flash ipod mini for the holidays.


Hard drives are so 1900s, flash is way faster and uses less power.
 

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I forgot to mention that the HDD is needed for backwards compatibility as well without it you can't play xbox games.


This could turn out to be a mess with the core system, when a J6P buys one,only later to find out he can't play his original xbox games without buying their $100 20gb HDD, ouch:(
 

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what about games like Blinx.. are they even possible without a HDD? I'm sure there are other examples as well.

http://xbox.ign.com/articles/367/367190p1.html


"It wasn't that people weren't expecting a game featuring a cat and his vacuum cleaner, but no one thought the Xbox hard drive would be used so creatively in terms of game design. Blinx records your game onto the hard drive as you play it. Why? Because as a guardian (or janitor) of time, Blinx can use VCR elements (record, fast forward, slow mo, pause, rewind) to affect his environment. Press rewind and the last ten or so seconds of gameplay rewind, though Blinx still move independently.



This allows for some truly amazing puzzles that require not only jumping and shooting skills, but an ability to think in terms of time. What would happen if I stood on this barrel that fell off a roof and hit rewind? Better yet, if you expect to find all of the hidden areas and items (and there are tons), you'll need to use the time-control functions in a creative way. "
 

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While not a doom-and-gloom person about the end of civilization regarding the lack of standard hard drive for the 360, I must go on the record by saying:


Major periphrials (almost) NEVER work out.

The exceptions being the Sony Network Adaptor, and the somewhat less successful Nintendo 64 memory expansion.


I'm sure this topic has been beaten to death here, but having two sku's is a really stupid idea.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrocHunter
I forgot to mention that the HDD is needed for backwards compatibility as well without it you can't play xbox games.


This could turn out to be a mess with the core system, when a J6P buys one,only later to find out he can't play his original xbox games without buying their $100 20gb HDD, ouch:(
One of the things that is clearly being sent to retailers (and I'd imagine would even be on the box or some such) is a brochure for sales staff & consumers clarifying the diff between the Core & Premium Unit.


The most obvious point made is that Core will not provide backward compat unless & until the system is upgraded to a HDD unit.


Most likely the core unit's impact won't really be felt until AFTER the early adopters have bought their units.


The thinking is that many consumers that don't know or care about the "enhanced experience" you get the with HDD WILL know and care about a $100 difference up front.
 

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Maybe we'll see another option on the back of 360 games such as

[X]HDD recommend

similar to the 720P enabled and Widescreen X'ed boxes on the back of current xbox games.
 

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Quote:
I would guess it would be some simple things like.... "The game takes 10 seconds to load scene 'X' with the HD, and 30 seconds without".


And if it did not use the HD.... "Loads are the same whether you do or do not have an HD. It is a shame that 'Developer X' did not utilize the HD as other games have shown a significant improvement by caching...." etc.
do game reviewers really do that much testing? I was thinking it more the other way.


Let's say three games


A) 10s HDD, 30s no HDD

B) 20s HDD, 20s no HDD

C) 30s HDD, 30s no HDD


a reviewer on a HDD machine will praise A for short loads compare to B and curse C while a diff3erent reviewer with out an HDD (if such a thing exits) will praise B equally compared to A and C
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyP
do game reviewers really do that much testing? I was thinking it more the other way.


Let's say three games


A) 10s HDD, 30s no HDD

B) 20s HDD, 20s no HDD

C) 30s HDD, 30s no HDD


a reviewer on a HDD machine will praise A for short loads compare to B and curse C while a diff3erent reviewer with out an HDD (if such a thing exits) will praise B equally compared to A and C
I wouldn't expect any pro reviewer to not have an HDD. Heck, I doubt that most people who would even post a review on a forum would not have an HDD.


I have certainly seen reviewers comment on load times between platforms. I would expect a quick test and comment of the game w/o a HDD to become fairly standard in reviews.
 

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but if they assume everyone that will read it will have an HDD, then why bother? I think comparing different platforms might be a bit of fun, and if you have both as a reviewer it is interesting to see the difference, but HDD vs none-HDD sounds like a useless pain, especially if you need to remove the HDD
 

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Because game enthusiasts want to know whether the game is taking advantage of the hardware, if no other reason then to complain about it when it doesn't! :)
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by briankmonkey
just like people bitching when the xbox games don't support 480p ;)
Strange they don't really complain when most games don't use the HDD for caching.
 
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