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Discussion Starter #1
I thought MS might release more CORE than Premium, but quite the opposite



http://www.xbox365.com/news.cgi?id=GGurPdLrGr08171253



"Alright I've seen a lot of xbox faithfuls suddenly turn around like they got sucker punched but I'm going to take a minute and explain some things from my MS sources.


Alright first thing first is that 85% of the Xbox360's Made will be the Premium Package that includes the HDD. The other 15% will be the core systems without the HDD.


Game developers are aware of this, with a 85% HDD attach rate from the start combined with MS's tools, makes it easy to enable disc caching and take advantage of it and also make tags to cache to RAM when the HDD is not present.


The HDD in the 360 is a 20Gb SATA 2.5" Laptop drive that weighs considerably less and is roughly 3x-5x faster than the HDD found in the original Xbox. This HDD is not a 20gb drive you can find for $15 at a flee market. It costs considerably more.


Developers are still writing games to cache to a HDD just like they always have on the Xbox. Those Xbox360's that do not have a HDD will experience 2x-3x more loading time. Also the absence of the ability to save music and save game data will be the only con of not having a HDD.


Those of you who think this idea will flop take a moment to consider that if Core Xbox360's are few in number and are not widely available like the Premium Xbox30 bundle is, which console do you think those mommys and dadys are going to buy? The one they can find almost anywhere as Christmas approaches fast or the one they dont see as often and offers less features?


When it comes to crunch time people are going to spend the extra $100 to guarantee that they will be able to give their son or daughter the gift they want.


All you hardcore faithful have not been forgotten. The HDD will still play a very important role in the Xbox360 just as it has with the original Xbox. Nothing has changed from the Developers stand point. And nothing has changed from the ammount of features available to the Hardcore gamer.


If anything has changed it's that we have a limited price choice and for some people that is what matters the most."
 

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Very nice find and I'm shocked by the author of this thread ;).

You have restored my faith. Of course this article reflects the so-called 'damage control' I have been supposedly doing since yesterday. ;)

Quote:
make tags to cache to RAM when the HDD is not present.
Good deal.
 

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I don't knowif this will necessarily be the case. Of course Microsoft is going to say that the majority of the systems available will be the premium pack. They know that's the system everyone wants.


However, when it gets released, I think it will be a different story. Somehow the premium pack availability can't keep up with demand, but there are still plenty of core systems available for those that want them.


I could be wrong in this case, and I hope I am.


Microsoft stands to lose much more money on the premium bundle than on the core one, so I have a feeling that the core one is what we'll be seeing more of.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
like I said, I'm very happy that I was wrong.... I was afraid there would have been shortages of the premium system.. if they do have shortages hopefully it would only be of the CORE system as parents, casuals whatever might not realize that the core isn't nearly as good of a deal..
 

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Discussion Starter #5
"Microsoft stands to lose much more money on the premium bundle than on the core one, so I have a feeling that the core one is what we'll be seeing more of. "


that is what I was guessing at first because it would make them more money to do so, but this indicates otherwise which is great if true.
 

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I just see this as another example of all the knee jerk reacting going on around here. I think we need a 360 FAQ stickied at the top of the forum because a lot of people are spouting things as fact when we either don't really know or we are misinformed.


I really, really believe at the root of this complaint is that people don't want to spend $399 for a console. I am in agreement with that. I think consoles should be as cheap as possible so they can succeed in the market but I am a realist too and I know the numbers need to add up.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
well, they are looking to make up for the loss on peripherals and software (as always)


I think people are more upset about the HDD not being standard. I think we all or most of us thought it would be..
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by briankmonkey
"Microsoft stands to lose much more money on the premium bundle than on the core one, so I have a feeling that the core one is what we'll be seeing more of. "


that is what I was guessing at first because it would make them more money to do so, but this indicates otherwise which is great if true.
When you look at all the stuff in that pack how could anyone in their right mind think MS was going to make money on the hardware? And they are throwing in the remote for a limited time as well.

Look at all of the components and add it up. MS is STILL going to lose money on the hardware but NOOOOOOOO (John Belushi rip-off) people still want it even cheaper. That's where the core comes in.


MS is banking on selling you all of those accessories because they really, really want you to take advantage of all the functionality with the marketplace and so on but they are also trying to appease the cost consious by releasing a base model but people are still finding ways to complain.

If I was Bill gates or anyone at MS reading this forum I think i would scrap the whole project and say Boo hoo, now you have one less choise. Later, buh bye.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
lol, that would be quite funny and would only make anti-MS people happy and feel like a victory had been had, of course we know competition is good for the gamer.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Martin
When you look at all the stuff in that pack how could anyone in their right mind think MS was going to make money on the hardware? And they are throwing in the remote for a limited time as well.

Look at all of the components and add it up. MS is STILL going to lose money on the hardware .
Exactly. With the core package they lose less money since they're not including many of the costly add ons that the premium one offers. This is why, despite what Microsoft's PR people say, that the core pack will be the pack that is most readily available this holiday season.


Even at $300, its not a bad value, its just not nearly as nice as the $400 one. Microsoft took it up the rear with the original XBOX, so I don't see them wanting to go down that road again.
 

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"Also the absence of the ability to save music and save game data will be the only con of not having a HDD"


How about the only legitimate gripe that I heard so far, additional game content/patches? Are the DVD's on the 360 going to be re-writeable and this content goes there? Where is this additional content supposed to go? I'm always amused as the only legit gripe I heard in all of this was the mismatch of Live user,s some having a level while others do not, or patches to fix cheats etc online causing even bigger issues. Hmmm....
 

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What do people with ps2s do when they need to save something? They get a damn memory card. If people want the extra stuff, they will get the hd.
 

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i would love to know why ms would bother with all this for what they seem to believe will only be 15% of the market, most of whom would likely have bought the premium version anyway had it been the only one available? this makes no sense, and it leads me to believe that CallMeJean is correct.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Martin
I really, really believe at the root of this complaint is that people don't want to spend $399 for a console. I am in agreement with that. I think consoles should be as cheap as possible so they can succeed in the market but I am a realist too and I know the numbers need to add up.
I believe that people are more upset over the core and accessories pricing than the $399 pack...oddly enough.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big John Thomas
i would love to know why ms would bother with all this for what they seem to believe will only be 15% of the market, most of whom would likely have bought the premium version anyway had it been the only one available? this makes no sense, and it leads me to believe that CallMeJean is correct.
MS wants the ability to reduce the price to very low levels (re: $99) late in the console's life span and not lose enormous amounts of $. 2 things prevent this with Xbox: 1) getting the CPU/GPU directly from Intel/Nvidia instead of producing themselves, and 2) the HDD. A HDD-less version in the future would be easier to reduce to a very low proce point.
 

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Well the only problem i see is that if it gets released so close to christmas that soccer moms will get the core one since they have a billion other gifts to buy and theyll need the extra $100 , so theyll pick the core, I mean at the moment theyll figure that "i got the main thing...later on we will get the rest of the stuff if he/she needs it"

I really hope the developers will "assume" when they look at the numbers that they majority of us will get the one with the HDD
 

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Discussion Starter #17
McKlein, that has been my guess.. I thnk MS is counting on this as it is coming out during the holiday season.. THe soccer mom doesn't realize that it will cost their household much more to by the other stuff later to get the same amount of goods for her kid..
 

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"Alright first thing first is that 85% of the Xbox360's Made will be the Premium Package that includes the HDD. The other 15% will be the core systems without the HDD."


This is from a staff editor at a webmagazine! Doesn't everybody claim they have..."sources" That's like the standard line everyone uses...my sources say this or that.


Major Nelson who has direct access to XBox team members was even caught off guard

"...as I said in another post, I am reading all the comments here and understand the gist of how folks feel. I also need to let you know that I found out the details when you did. I am still trying to absorb it all."
 

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in my opinion, it's the "soccer moms" that will be the most aware of what's available and will be the most frugal. if they sense for a second they are getting screwed, they'll go for something else like a shiny, new gameboy micro for example.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by briankmonkey
McKlein, that has been my guess.. I thnk MS is counting on this as it is coming out during the holiday season.. THe soccer mom doesn't realize that it will cost their household much more to by the other stuff later to get the same amount of goods for her kid..
Exactly soccer moms dont know anything about gaming and such, and it will take a hell of a "pleaaaaase mom i need the one with everything" in order for her to buy it.
 
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