[mfombellida]

Hi,


A local dealer who was at Cedia is telling me that the HD2+ CR values announced by some manufacturers (4000 or 5000:1) are totally wrong and this was apparently confirmed during a press conference by the manager of the Home Cinema division of TI.


Did anybody attend this press conference and could confirm?


Michel

 

[lovingdvd]

Not sure how accurate 4000-5000:1 is, but anything in that range is likely to be pretty dim, say 100-200 lumens is my guess.

 

[Phat Phreddy]

Reports (read rumours) do state that the 5k spec quoted on the sharp seems to be a lab test result with every other picture consideration (color temp / brightness / etc) taken out...


I would treat any specs with a handful of salt these days...

 

[Michael Grant]

On another thread, Dan Miller stated that the 3800:1 number for the Marantz was arrived at in the manner you describe... that for a proper D65 calibration, the number is likely to be closer to 3000:1.

 

[car_rod]

Same goes for the HT1000 and its 3000:1


The important aren't numbers, but progress done with previous generations. This progress should be real and visible.

 

[David600]

guys, have you read Greg Rogers's review of the Z10000 ? if I remember correctly

he measured 1834:1 in high contrast mode with 16.7FTL from a 1.3 85" screen at 6500K. Absolute black level was a stunning 0.009FTL. In high power mode high brigthness, he clocked 1473:1 and 851ansi lumens.


So I expect the Z12000 to be clocked at 3000:1 on off in high contrast and not with 200ansi. Imho. This is significant progress, twice the best current HD2.

The Z9000 was clocked around 750:1. (and not the 750:1 advertised for LCD projectors). Greg measured something like 1500:1 on the NEC I think in high contrast.


Car-rod is right, the advances are significant, and not only in terms of contrast but also screendoor etc.

 

[car_rod]

I remember the Z9000 measured about 750:1 (with a CC red filter).

The Z10000 was measured at about 1800:1. Both after calibration, indeed.


But I doubt this time Sharp's HD2+ will double contrast ratio from HD2. I think we will measure the Z12000 at 2500-2800:1 at most.


But just as said, drop the numbers. Anything since the Z9000 is really enjoyable. Progress continues.

 

[mfombellida]

This would indeed be inline with Sim2 claims for their new HD2+ projectors, i.e. 2800:1.


Michel

 

[lovingdvd]

Quote:

Originally posted by car_rod I remember the Z9000 measured about 750:1 (with a CC red filter). The Z10000 was measured at about 1800:1. Both after calibration, indeed. But I doubt this time Sharp's HD2+ will double contrast ratio from HD2. I think we will measure the Z12000 at 2500-2800:1 at most. But just as said, drop the numbers. Anything since the Z9000 is really enjoyable. Progress continues.

From the spec sheet I saw it looks like for the 12000 Sharp is saying 2600:1 at 500 lumens (not bad with a decent gain screen like the FH), 1600:1 at 900 lumens (again, very good if you like or need a very bright image), and 5000:1 (that is still likely a stretch) with 300 lumen - likely too dark for my tastes but for folks that enjoy a CRT-like image with a screen size not overly large that may be quite enjoyable.


The important thing to note is that there is lots of flexibility to meet each person's individual tastes. And because its motorized I assume you can have it in the presets so Sunday football could for example be on a preset with 1600:1 at 900 lumen and nighttime movies could be on a preset for 5000:1 at 300 lumens.

 

[KBK]

Any extra lumen garnered in open iris mode are not really useful lumen, in most cases. They tend to come at the expense of overall usable, and noticeable scene-to-scene CR, and 'cloud' up the image in that sense. The extra brightness is similar to simply turning on an extra light in the room. what it tends to be is waste light coming out of the lens, at least in part.


The high contrast numbers, in calibrated mode is where the meat of things are.

 

[Michael Grant]

Good point, though I've always said that being able to select between brightness and contrast is great for those situations where you don't want to have to eliminate all ambient light. My classic example being a SuperBowl party where you want everyone to be able to see their beer and nachos. In that case it probably doesn't matter much if you lost a bit of contrast.

 

[darinp]

Quote:

Originally posted by Michael Grant My classic example being a SuperBowl party where you want everyone to be able to see their beer and nachos. In that case it probably doesn't matter much if you lost a bit of contrast.

Once you have turned any lights on the actually CR from the screen could be higher in the low contrast mode than in the high contrast mode. I'll save the math, but the denominator (black) in the CR calculation that you see is the black from the projector plus the ambient light from the room. The low contrast mode has a much bigger numerator (white level) and passes the real CR of the high contrast mode at some ambient light level.


--Darin

 

[noah katz]

"Any extra lumen garnered in open iris mode are not really useful lumen, in most cases. "


When the black level is determined not by the pj's CR but by ambient light,

there's ecerything to gain and nothing to lose by opening the iris.

 

[David600]

DLP with special nachos mode


ok, I'm out

 

[Alimental]

I saw a review of a projector that claimed 3000:1 and it was measured at about 1500:1, same as the InFocus based on the same chip. One of the reasons that I bought an InFocus is that they have not been exaggerating their specs, which probably makes me the "anti-consumer".

 

[Michael Grant]

Quote:

Once you have turned any lights on the actually CR from the screen could be higher in the low contrast mode than in the high contrast mode.

Good point. I agree.