[Clem272]

OK HERE WE GO AGAIN, so a friend at work tells me he is going to buy a BOSE CINEMATE,

I had to stop and say something especially since another guy was speaking of BOSE as if the BOSE was the godsend of all HT speakers.


That other guy also made his point on having Monster cables for everything because it will look and sound better. LOL

, I told him nicely that he needs to do some reading and when I mentioned CNET and what they said and he just walked away. He only thinks name branded stuff they sell at BB or CC is the only way to go.


But back to helping my friend out,

His current setup is as follows:

32" Sony LCD that he is upgrading to 40 or 46 Sony LCD (model ??)

PS3

Brookstone stereo receiver

Two Brookstone speakers


He lives in an apartment as well and is trying to keep to the Cinemate budget of $500. I already told him to save a little more and get something he would be happy with for years to come. He is set on getting something very soon though.


He really likes the 5.1 sound (not his speaker system) he had once had along time ago in collage, but seems to think the BOSE CIEMATE will give him that and more. I told him about this happy place and that someone besides just me would be able to help him find a better set up for his $500. The loyal BOSE guys think I am crazy and no way can anything sound better without spending 5-10k. I am known as a BOSE basher around here I guess; Oh well can't help that.


Thanks for any help you can give, please post links to websites of recommend gear if possible.

 

[Condar]

At one time, I had a "FRIEND" that wanted to buy some Bose stuff too.

Oh... anything within budget will give better quality.

 

[nsguy]

Looks like you will need to find new friends

All kidding aside, I have come to learn quickly how much people dislike BOSE on this forum and I am a converted as well. I did think (when I was 16 or so) that BOSE was the thing to aspire until I became more educated. The best advice is to point your friend to AVS and let him come to the conclusion what people really think of BOSE.


That being said, everyone is entitled to their opinion and preference. Audio is a personal thing and no one should really chose for anyone. All you can do as a friend is make sure he has BOTH sides of the argument about Bose and let him make his own decision.


He is lucky to have a friend who is looking for his best interest though

 

[Clem272]

I did find some other info from people here who did buy the BOSE and printed it all out for him, I should have just done that first. I really thought I would have had more people posting recommendations. I have not bought anything in awhile so don't really know the market prices these days.

I understand people are going to like what they like but I would rather try and educate someone about the BOSE versus other systems when they are new to a world they have yet to experience. Especially with the BOSE CINEMATE.......

 

[RTROSE]



Quote:
Originally Posted by nsguy /forum/post/15443762


Looks like you will need to find new friends

All kidding aside, I have come to learn quickly how much people dislike BOSE on this forum and I am a converted as well. I did think (when I was 16 or so) that BOSE was the thing to aspire until I became more educated. The best advice is to point your friend to AVS and let him come to the conclusion what people really think of BOSE.


That being said, everyone is entitled to their opinion and preference. Audio is a personal thing and no one should really chose for anyone. All you can do as a friend is make sure he has BOTH sides of the argument about Bose and let him make his own decision.


He is lucky to have a friend who is looking for his best interest though

+1 I find that the populous at large has the idea that BOSE is the pinnacle of audio bliss. Due to clever marketing from BOSE to their credit they do have name recognition. Much like McDonald's most everyone had heard of BOSE and because their price point is higher than most and due to their advertising campaign it is very hard to overcome this mentality with J6P. This is especially hard to do AFTER someone has bought BOSE because they don't want to admit they paid a premium for a ho hum product.


I have more than once been to a friends or and acquaintances home who had a BOSE product and they were all too eager to show it off because of the "status" it gave them. They were a little perplexed when I was less than impressed.


It gets even more depressing when you counter with your own "name dropping" mentioning companies such as SVS, Epik, Oppo, Ascend, and Aperion, to name a few and you are met with a blank stare.

Oh well, the best thing you can do with your "friend" is to tell him to do some research on his purchases and gently guide him to this forum.


Regards,


RTROSE

 

[matty ice]

 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16882290113

 

[Pete7874]

Leave him be. Let him learn from his own mistakes. Sometimes that's the only way people will learn. Invite him over to your place at some point and let him hear what a real HT setup sounds like. And who knows, maybe he will just fall in love with his Bose setup. And if he does, who are you to try to rain on his parade?

 

[Chu Gai]

A guy who shops Brookstone has his own ideas. Let him be.

 

[schroedk]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai /forum/post/15449367


A guy who shops Brookstone has his own ideas. Let him be.

You echoed my sentiments exactly. If he bought Brookstone speakers, he deserves a Bose Cinemate.

 

[Exit9]

If you are looking for a 5.1 system for less than $500 that will thoroughly outclass Bose, then I would recommend the EMP HTP-351 system below. It is on sale for $489 at the Audioholics store and it is about 60% off retail as of 1-3-09 this post time.

EMP HTP-351 5.1 Speaker System /Onkyo 606 Receiver Review

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...ad.php?t=51036


As of 1/3/09 at the posted time this system was still available on sale at the Audioholics's store in the link below:

http://store.audioholics.com/product...speaker-system

 

[laulau]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Exit9 /forum/post/15449992


If you are looking for a 5.1 system for less than $500 that will thoroughly outclass Bose, then I would recommend the EMP HTP-351 system below. It is on sale for $489 at the Audioholics store and it is about 60% off retail as of 1-3-09 this post time.

EMP HTP-351 5.1 Speaker System /Onkyo 606 Receiver Review

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...ad.php?t=51036


As of 1/3/09 at the posted time this system was still available on sale at the Audioholics's store in the link below:

http://store.audioholics.com/product...speaker-system

+1


link to some reviews and other systems on sale:
http://www.audioholics.com/news/indu...e-blowout-sale

 

[Chu Gai]

Yes, but how will it sound with his Brookstone receiver?!

 

[Robert Cook]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem272 /forum/post/15448877


I did find some other info from people here who did buy the BOSE and printed it all out for him, I should have just done that first. I really thought I would have had more people posting recommendations.

Sorry, maybe we're a little burnt out on Bose rescue due to these threads

(read through them if you haven't already):

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1101462
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1102669

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem272 /forum/post/15448877


I have not bought anything in awhile so don't really know the market prices these days.

The following quote pretty much says it all:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Condar /forum/post/15443649


Oh... anything within budget will give better quality.

Exactly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem272 /forum/post/15448877


I understand people are going to like what they like but I would rather try and educate someone about the BOSE versus other systems when they are new to a world they have yet to experience. Especially with the BOSE CINEMATE.......

That's always a noble cause, as far as I'm concerned, even if people really deserve what they get.

OK, let's see what we can do. First, are you shooting for a 5.1 system or a 2.0/2.1 system? A 5.1 system would be somewhat problematic because of your budget and the fact that your friend will also need a 5.1 receiver. A 2.0 or 2.1 system will get you components of higher quality, especially if your friend's Brookstone stereo receiver is serviceable. Could you describe this receiver? Does it have binding posts, spring clips, or proprietary connections for the speakers? Either option would sound better than the Bose CineMate.


Most forum members would sensibly suggest going with a higher quality 2.0 system to start out with, and build from there, but I'm not sure anything less than 5.1 would be satisfactory for this specific case, as your friend expects to get the same effect magically from the CineMate. If you want to get a 5.1 system, then with a $500 budget you're pretty much looking at home-theater-in-a-box (HTIB) systems, which have their own forum on this site:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forum...prune=30&f=109


I've heard that some of the better Yamaha HTIB systems are pretty good for what they are (and undoubtedly better than any Bose system), and we may be able to do a bit better by pairing a 5.1 speaker system like the Yamaha NS-SP5800 ($250) with the Yamaha HTR-6140 receiver ($200-$250). In fact, it may be possible to do even better still for $500 total, but before I help you do all that research, let me know how you wish to proceed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RTROSE /forum/post/15449080


+1 I find that the populous at large has the idea that BOSE is the pinnacle of audio bliss. Due to clever marketing from BOSE to their credit they do have name recognition. Much like McDonald's most everyone had heard of BOSE and because their price point is higher than most and due to their advertising campaign it is very hard to overcome this mentality with J6P.

Admittedly, when I was a kid (more than 20 years ago

), long before I got into home audio, Bose was practically the only name that stuck out in my mind among speaker brands. A neighbor of mine had a pair of Bose 901s mounted to his ceiling and was so proud of owning them, although he never bothered to play them for me.

Until I became interested in home theater and audio a number of years later, I simply assumed, like just about every other newbie, that Bose was a high-quality brand. What initially changed my mind was an examination of the Acoustimass system, before I had even heard it. Those tiny cubes were just small full-range drivers in a thin plastic housing. I'm not big on external appearance, but come on, how "ghetto" could a "high-end" speaker brand get?

After listening to a demonstration, I wasn't impressed, even though it actually didn't sound quite as bad as I thought it would.

Needless to say, I've never purchased a Bose product, and I'm proud of that fact, but nevertheless I did believe at one time, due to sheer ignorance, that Bose made quality speakers--that's the power of their marketing machine. It's kind of crazy--almost a form of subliminal mass hypnosis.

 

[Clem272]

Thank for everyone's help, really I mean it!


I just wanted to open his eyes up to better possibilities and you have done it. I relize these HELP IT'S BOSE threads get old but I was kinda stuck and needed some backup. Lots of Bose fanatics running around these days who also swear by Monster Cable. Those people I leave to their happy place, and smile with them for fear of the dark.


My friend is new to this stuff and realizes that $500 budget for everything isn't enough for both speakers and a receiver unless its a HTIB. He is seeing the light and I THANK EVERYONE FOR YOUR HELP!

 

[laulau]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai /forum/post/15450848


Yes, but how will it sound with his Brookstone receiver?!

lol, good point.


Hopefully he won't be able to connect them to the Brookstone and thus will be forced to purchase something a little more adequate (i.e. Onkyo, Yammy, Pioneer, Sony, etc.).

 

[Condar]

Why, Why, Why????


Why must the common man come here to ask about the Bose????


We all know that he will be bashed for the love; deep within his heart, or the friend he claims it to be.


Shame, shame. May we all learn from "the friend" and not walk in the footstep of thee.

For the outlet mall has shown us the way of the Bose systems and we all pride against wallowing with the lazy.


HA!

 

[Robert Cook]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem272 /forum/post/15451127


Thank for everyone's help, really I mean it!


I just wanted to open his eyes up to better possibilities and you have done it.

So I guess he read this thread, then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem272 /forum/post/15451127


I relize these HELP IT'S BOSE threads get old but I was kinda stuck and needed some backup. Lots of Bose fanatics running around these days who also swear by Monster Cable. Those people I leave to their happy place, and smile with them for fear of the dark.

One time after witnessing a customer in a big chain electronics store be convinced that he needed a $70 Monster TOSLINK cable, I told him to put it back and showed him where to order a cable that works perfectly fine for less than $5 (after the salesman walked away, of course). He seemed very interested and did put back the Monster rip-off cable--success! Yes! The score may be 1 for me versus 100,000,000 for Monster, but I still feel like a winner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem272 /forum/post/15451127


My friend is new to this stuff and realizes that $500 budget for everything isn't enough for both speakers and a receiver unless its a HTIB. He is seeing the light and I THANK EVERYONE FOR YOUR HELP!

If he could stretch his budget by 50% or so, that EMP HTP-351 5.1 deal mentioned above is hard to pass up--seems like quite a bargain, if not overt theft.

The Yamaha HTR-6140 (also known as the Yamaha RX-V463 for some strange reason) receiver can be had for less than $250, and seems to be an excellent value. The Onkyo TX-SR606 costs perhaps $100 more and does just about everything (and is also 7.1 rather than 5.1), but I've never had much confidence in the amp sections of Onkyo receivers. Perhaps this is unfair of me, but I keep hearing about issues time and again--brands like Denon, Harman Kardon, and Yamaha are safer choices for receivers, in my opinion.


Generally speaking, with regard to cost and quality, $500 is at a point where every extra dollar buys more and better capability, and arguably better value. I'm not sure where the returns begin to seriously diminish, but it's not at $1000, for example.

 

[Exit9]

I posted the EMP HTP-351 5.1 Speaker System /Onkyo 606 Receiver Review in the earlier thread and this is an awesome setup for $858. I don't think it can be beat at that price range. The Audyssey sound correction feature makes a big difference in how the system sounds in your room and I think the Onkyo 606 is the entry level to get this feature set. It makes the E10s subwoofer sound so much better than you would expect for its size, power and cost. My brother bought this system and setup was a breeze. Sound was excellent for the price.


I coincidentally was asked by my other brother to troubleshoot a Bose three dual-cube with Acoustimass bass module system. (It was miswired and had an internally broken speaker wire.) I also hooked up his VCR. He was quite pleased to have it all running again. The EMP sounded so much drastically better, that when he hears my other brother's EMP system, he will be shocked and disappointed with his system. The EMP system blows the Bose system away in all categories, but even an unknowledgeable person will notice the dramitic difference in low bass from the EMP10s subwoofer. It produces the WOW effect you sometimes get from better subwoofers when auditioning at retail stores.


The Bose sound was all vocal range to my ears. There was no bass or highs. I would say the system competes with built-in TV speakers and poor clock radios in sound quality. The only advantages I see are the small hide-away speakers and multiple sound sources (which all surround systems have). You trade off a lot of sound quality to get WAF hide-away cubes. Tiny speakers like these just don't produce full range sound, even with the Acoustimass module.


To Bose diehards, go ahead and buy Bose, but don't say you weren't warned or provided with information on better systems for the price.

 

[Clem272]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Condar /forum/post/15451727


Why, Why, Why????


Why must the common man come here to ask about the Bose????


We all know that he will be bashed for the love; deep within his heart, or the friend he claims it to be.


Shame, shame. May we all learn from "the friend" and not walk in the footstep of thee.

For the outlet mall has shown us the way of the Bose systems and we all pride against wallowing with the lazy.


HA!

Seriously, you think I am posting this for myself. Or do I not understand your post? This guy I speak of is a friend at work. Sorry not everyone is or wants to be within your "Class", and "Higher Education". Maybe you could have shown a little class and educated instead of being a snob J/@$$. You speak of the COMMON MAN, you obliviously do not know who the common man is.

My setup:

Yamaha RX-V1300

Energy C-100 (center and surounds)

Energy S12.3 Sub

PS3

Sony LCD projection (table top)

Monster Power filter/ surge protection

 

[Robert Cook]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Exit9 /forum/post/15454141


The Bose sound was all vocal range to my ears. There was no bass or highs.

Hence the old adage: "No highs, no lows--must be Bose."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exit9 /forum/post/15454141


I would say the system competes with built-in TV speakers and poor clock radios in sound quality.

This makes a lot of sense because Bose uses the same cheap driver that is used in many TV and clock radio speakers. This driver sounds much better when it is used with a woofer, as it is in some or perhaps many RPTVs that have relatively large speakers, but unfortunately in the case of Bose Acoustimass systems, the only woofers are in the bass module, which itself is a weak design that has inadequate components. I bet that these systems could be sold as $50 Walmart specials and still turn a profit. "Better sound through research."

Marketing research, maybe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exit9 /forum/post/15454141


The only advantages I see are the small hide-away speakers and multiple sound sources (which all surround systems have). You trade off a lot of sound quality to get WAF hide-away cubes. Tiny speakers like these just don't produce full range sound, even with the Acoustimass module.

Energy's Take Classic 5.1 system has satellite speakers very nearly as tiny, though, and their sound quality is far superior. At least in the home audio market, Bose is low-end audio at ridiculously marked-up prices.