[Zerovector]

Having a hard time....

After almost buying a Samsung P58B860, I have decided that I don't want to have an issue with a buzzing problem (I understand all sets buzz, but some are more audible than others). I have now turned my interest to LED LCD sets.


My primary uses will be PS3 gaming/bluray. I have narrowed it down to two choices:


Samsung B8500

LG 55LH90


The Samsung is obviously extremely attractive, but, it has a steep price. The LG also looks stunning and is more affordable.


At the end of the day, is there a compelling reason to pay significantly more for the Samsung B8500 vs the LG? Because the LG is starting to look really, really good because of it's price point.

 

[FloridaDude]

There is a review here which talks about the differences between the LG and Samsung with regard to dejudder processing and 240Hz methodology:
http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-t...rt=cnet-google


I did notice C-Net gave the 8500 their top review of all LCDs in 2009...
http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-t....html?tag=also

The 8500 remote apparently works without you having to aim it at the TV, which is kinda cool:
http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-t....html?tag=also

 

[TNG]

I would look at a Toshiba 670 or if I could still find one a Sony XBR8 personally. Neither the Samsung or the LG seem to be the best choice IMO. If it came down to it I would go with the LG though.

 

[FloridaDude]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TNG /forum/post/18249222


I would look at a Toshiba 670 or if I could still find one a Sony XBR8 personally. Neither the Samsung or the LG seem to be the best choice IMO. If it came down to it I would go with the LG though.

Thanks, I will try and check those out if I can find them..

what don't you like about the Sammy 8500, have you seen it wired to a Blu-Ray disc?

 

[marlin29311]

From what I recall the Sammy has some issues with input lag, and if you are primarilly gaming, this could cause an issue. If my memory serves me well, the LG will do much better in this department.

 

[Zerovector]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TNG /forum/post/18249222


I would look at a Toshiba 670 or if I could still find one a Sony XBR8 personally. Neither the Samsung or the LG seem to be the best choice IMO. If it came down to it I would go with the LG though.

Care to share your reasons on why this is the case?

 

[rahzel]

Each LED TV has it's strengths and weaknesses. The LH90 has the best bang for buck IMO. Low input lag, best viewing angles, greatest potential for calibration because of it's adjustability. It also has a semi-matte screen (which might be a positive or a negative depending on the person). On the negative side, it has the fewest amount of zones, slightly lighter blacks compared to the others (in lighter scenes), and you can't separate de-judder from anti-blur.


The B8500 and XBR8 are, IMHO, the best of the bunch but also the most expensive. The XBR8 has the best colors due to it's triluminos LEDs and the B8500 has the highest contrast ratio and best blacks of the bunch. Don't know how the viewing angles are on the XBR8, but the B8500's viewing angles aren't very good. The B8500 also has higher input lag (dunno about the XBR8). The XBR8 also cannot separate de-judder from anti-blur.


The SV670U is also a good value. It has slightly more zones than the LH90 (96 vs 80), and like the Samsung, you can separate de-judder from anti-blur. But as far as color accuracy, it's behind the others, and the viewing angles aren't very good either. Dunno about the input lag on the SV670U.


My ranking would go:

B8500

XBR8 (close second)

LH90

SV670U (close fourth)


Add the LG LHX and I would put it right up there with the B8500 and XBR8.

Depending on people's priorities, their rankings might be different. But really, all of them are very good and are all fairly close in performance overall IMO.

 

[KakimotoRift]

Ranking:

1./LH95 or LHX 240zones + 3360 leds / 8500 240zones + ??? leds

2./XBR8 1xx zones

3./LH90 80 zones / 960 leds


Don't have hand on experience with the Toshiba so I won't put it in the ranking.


*With LH95 or LHX you would get better Color Accuracy than the 8500 as well as better viewing angle and dark scene details or overall details and better input lag performance and awesome Gamma.


*8500 you will get better motion handling.


*Sony's Viewing Angle is always better than Samsung's even though they both use S-PVA panel. It is because they use same type of panel but "develop independtly" for their S-PVA Panels.


*XBR8 RGB LED will give you very large Gamut but it is useless on the actual content we are viewing today.


*LG has better coverage or larger coverage of the Gamut than the Samsung. Both capable of covering the whole HDTV Rec709 Space without issues.


*Adjustability, LG is definitely the one in the Highest Rank.


So between 8500 vs LH90. you definitely want to pick the 8500.


*Side Notes: Samsung CCFL HDTVs never fully cover the HDTV Rec709 ColorSpace. The Edgelit LED ones is capable.

 

[FloridaDude]



Quote:
Originally Posted by marlin29311 /forum/post/18249795


From what I recall the Sammy has some issues with input lag, and if you are primarilly gaming, this could cause an issue. If my memory serves me well, the LG will do much better in this department.

Can someone please elaborate more on the meaning of input lag as it relates to the XBox360 and the 8500, thank you...

 

[KakimotoRift]



Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaDude /forum/post/18250884


Can someone please elaborate more on the meaning of input lag as it relates to the XBox360 and the 8500, thank you...

For the most realistic experience on input lags, please try Kill Zone 2 on the Samsung. Real Experience is worth more than thousands of words.

 

[FloridaDude]



Quote:
Originally Posted by KakimotoRift /forum/post/18250895


For the most realistic experience on input lags, please try Kill Zone 2 on the Samsung. Real Experience is worth more than thousands of words.

I only play one game Halo 3 on Xbox live, and I do not have the Samsung yet, so can someone please explain input lag to me, thanks...

 

[rahzel]

It's a delay in the video signal so what you see is a few milliseconds/frames behind. For example, if you were playing rock band with a TV with 60ms of lag and the game wasn't calibrated properly, when you see a note/fill coming and you strum the guitar exactly when you see the fill, it will actually be 60ms late. Same thing for other games, the controls won't be as precise and will be a tad delayed on screen. IPS panels (what LG generally uses) are known for having lower input lag than what Samsung typically uses (SPVA panels). I've personally tested my 55LH90 and got a respectably low number of ~30ms, and that's not even using Game mode and local dimming was ON. Samsungs generally have input lag numbers upwards of 60ms (in movie/standard mode). Game mode helps reduce this number though.

 

[FloridaDude]

Thanks, and it this for a fact a problem on the 8500?

Is it limited to certain types or brands?

 

[rahzel]

I don't have any numbers on hand, but Samsung LCDs (and even their Plasmas) have had upwards of 60ms of lag in the past few years. It's more of an issue with the type of panels they use and their processing techniques. So yeah, other brands that use xxVA panels will most likely have the same issue.

 

[KakimotoRift]

The input lags is not due to the panel itself. It is due to alot of stuffs processing the images.

Samsung is well known for their bad input lag performance.


It depends on how well a company is able to reduce the input lags with high amount of processings going on.

 

[Jonathan Teller]

Personally, I cannot stand glossy screen surfaces. If I have a pitch black room, I'm going to use a front projector. So my only purpose for a flat panel is in a lit room. I prefer to be able to see my TV shows, movies and games rather than only being able to see my own reflection and the glare from my light sources, so I take a pass on any display that has a glossy screen, thank you very much!


I don't know why Samsung insists on using nothing but glossy screens. I don't know why Sony is deciding to follow them down the glossy-screen hell-hole with their 2010 displays. But whatever the reasoning, they can count me out!


I'm not the biggest fan of the LG LH90. The blooming shows up pretty easily on those displays and black bars vary in darkness a bit too much for my taste. That said, I would take an LH90 over the Samsung 8500 in a heartbeat due to that damned glossy screen!


Also, do not overlook the Vizio VF552XVT or the VF551XVT that it is replacing. Can't say much for the styling of the cabinet, but the picture quality is solid and Vizio pricing is certainly competitive to say the least!

 

[FloridaDude]

Has anyone here actually experienced the "input lag" playing the Xbox 360 on the 8500?

 

[The Big Bad]

Back to a point raised by the OP, the current street price of a 55LH90 is about $1k less than the 8500, and there's an even bigger price disparity with the 55XBR8 (although I don't see it for sale by anyone other than an Amazon vendor, and that vendor only has one left and is asking about $3500 more than the street price of a 55LH90).


So for people who are voting for these other units, are you factoring the price disparities into your thinking?

 

[rahzel]

^ I touched up on it in my first post. The LH90 has the best bang for buck and is considerably cheaper. If price is a concern, the LH90 is a very strong choice. If price is not a factor at all, the B8500 is the better TV overall. But again, it depends on the person... for some people, better viewing angles, low input lag and the semi-matte screen might be more important than slightly better overall picture. If you can find an LG LHX, I think it's the best of both worlds.


@FloridaDude,

Not everyone notices input lag so you'll have to experiment for yourself. All signs say that the B8500 will have high input lag, so it depends on whether you notice it or not. If you've owned a more recent Samsung and haven't noticed input lag, then I think you'll be ok. I don't consider myself a hardcore gamer but it's fairly important to me.

 

[AsianStyle]

This comparison is very simple and what it comes down to is how big of a factor is glossy and money. There is no doubt in anyones mind that the b8500 is far superior to the lh90.


The bottom line is:

Do you prefer matte screens? If yes buy the lh90

Is money an issue? If yes buy the lh90

else

Buy the b8500


The input lag argument is honestly one of the weakest argument I've ever heard of. I've read the forum on AVS that state all the input lag times etc... and wonder what games are these people playing? I'm an avid gamer and play games where lag is a big deal. FPS games do not equal lag intensive. If halo is the only game you are concerned about don't be. All fps games use an algorithm for their hit detection, which would discount any lag you run across anyways. I do however agree that putting the b8500 on game mode with minimal process (turn off digital NR, EE, etc...) is a must when playing games.


If you want a lag intensive game you have to look at fighting games or Rockband/Guitar Hero.


I have played fighting games at very high competitive levels and do not see the lag being an issue. There are fighting games that have moves that require to be pressed in a small window of time (couple of frames).


Rockband/Guitar Hero actually have an innate problem with their calibration process. If you do some searching you will understand that even though the games let you manually calibrate the timing it will not allow you to modify the window of time it registers a hit.