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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi

I just got my Dish 6000 + 8VSB after a long wait. I hooked it up to the HS10 component input and switched the 6000 to HD mode.

I am using the cable coming from the antenna on the roof of my high rise building. The cable from the wall socket is not RG6 it is whatever cable the cable company gives out. There is nothing between my building and the WTC so there should be a clear signal.


Anyway I got zero signal on DTV so I then tried to scan for analog channels. I got a signal on 13 analog channels in NYC.

Then I tried to scan for DTV channels again and again. I got zero each time.


Am I missing something or some step? If I can get a clear signal on all analog shouldn't I get something on at least a few of the digital channels?

The antenna was probably put up 10-12 years ago so I don't know what type it is or if it could be pre-digital?


Any suggestions would be helpful otherwise I just wasted a lot of money on the Dish 6000 equipment.

So far I have also had no success pointing the Dish 300 towards the 61.5. I am using 41 elevation and trying to point to 174 azimuth. I may have to resort to an installer


Thank you


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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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Try hooking the 61.5 dish cable up directly to the receiver bypassing all switches. After you tune in the signal then hook it back up through the switches and do a check switch.


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Tosh TW56X81, Onkyo TXDS777, DISH 6000 w/ota, Tosh sd3900
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I already tried pointing the dish connected directly to the receiver. However, I am confident that the installer can fix this.

The bigger issue is the OTA 8VSB tuning. Why is that not working?

I thought the rule of thumb was that if you can get analog channels clearly you will be able to catch the local DTV channels as well.




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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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Is this antenna on the high rise a common antenna? You have to keep in mind some, if not all of your digital signals may be directional, which would require you to point the antenna directly at the station's towers.


And if your entire building is using the antenna, you may need to put an amplifier on your end to pick up a steady and good digital signal.


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Michael Mullis

Director of US Operations

Next Level Gaming
http://www.nlgaming.com
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I did not know that. I will try an amplifier. Is there one you can recommend from Radio Shack?


If that doesn't work I will use an OTA antenna in my apt. Any recommendations on that? Again from Radio Shack since I can return it if it doesn't work.

Thanks


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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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What band is the antenna? (UHF, VHF, of both?) Is it possible you're trying to locate digital channels that are being broadcast in the UHF band with a VHF-only antenna?


I don't know if the analog channels also transmit from towers on the WTC, but if so, I don't see how an amplifier will help you. If you're getting the analogs, you should get the digitals, unless the digitals are broadcasting from a different direction and you're hooked up to a directional antenna.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I am beginning to wonder the same thing. I have asked the building management and they are going to find out and get back to me. Is there a way for me to find out?


How can I check which channels are transmitting in VHF or UHF?


Thanks


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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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Quote:
Is there a way for me to find out?
If the antenna is flat, then it's VHF-only. If it looks like an arrow (--> ) then it's UHF-only. Basically, if you're antenna is just flat with no horizontal reflectors, then it's probably VHF-only and you won't be able to pick up UHF channels.


If that's the case, maybe you could convince them to mount a UHF antenna that you all could connect to? Since everything transmits from the WTC, it wouldn't have to move. (rotate)
 

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Some multi-unit buildings have fairly sophisticated channel filtering, coupling, and amplification systems, which may notch-out digital channels that weren't present when the system was designed and installed. Usually such a system employs multiple antennas, each tuned for narrow bandwidth and high directivity. Although this is sophisticated, it is also common in larger urban buildings. Your building may not have such a system, but it's worth asking the question.


Also, if you have good enough LOS to be putting up dishes, you may have the ability to receive the local DTV stations with an indoor antenna. It doesn't cost much to try a RS double bowtie.


--Gerald C


[This message has been edited by Gerald C (edited 07-26-2001).]
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by ensyed:
I already tried pointing the dish connected directly to the receiver. However, I am confident that the installer can fix this.

The bigger issue is the OTA 8VSB tuning. Why is that not working?
Do you have any dish working? By what I understand, the 8VSB/analog add-in will not work without a feed from a satellite.
 

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Ding, ding, ding.. I think we have a winner. If the original poster is saying he doesnt yet have a satellite lock of any kind, thats the reason that his OTA module isnt working.


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Dan


Knowledge without experience is only information...
 

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If you read the original poster's original post, it does say that he was able to scan for 13 analog channels. If he can get the analogs, I would think he ought to be able to get the digitals.


Eram, are you getting signal from 119/110? If you're not getting any satellite signal at all, they're right. You can't get OTA without a satellite signal from Dish.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
1) I have a dish 500 working and getting signals from 119/110.

2) I think the building antenna is VHF bc I did not even get a faint signal.

3) I tried a $20 amplified RatShack antenna (AV1000) and was able to lock onto UPN and also channel 11 but the signal was flicking between 0-55 signal strength. I also saw faint signals on the other NYC channels but not strong enough to get a lock.


I think a better indoor antenna will work for me. I have to research that. I have heard of the silver sensor


My dish faces southwest and is on the side of the building in my balcony. If I place an antenna out there the building will still be between the antenna and WTC.


Any suggestions???




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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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With that building in the way, multipathing is going to be your biggest problem, even with an outdoor antenna. With 8vsb, you really need to have line-of-sight to be able to reliably lock in those signals. In fact, you'd proabably have an easier time getting signals from 30 miles away with LOS to the transmitters as opposed to being 100 yards away but with a big building between you and those transmitters.

Any chance on getting a UHF antenna mounted up higher with clear LOS? Do you have a tenants association that might be able to get this done?


Multipath is my biggest problem. Over here in Eastern PA, I can't get NYC signals because there's a big mountain between me and the WTC. I can get signal spikes up in the 60's, but because of the multipath distortion, can't lock in on any of them. It's SOOOOO frustrating to see those spikes, know the signal's there and strong enough, but just too many reflections. But only Mohammed can move a mountain (or something like that, right?)
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
The plot thickens!!!! The mgmt office told me that in fact the antenna is UHF/VHF but I don't even get a spike with the antenna cable coming from the rooftop antenna. I lvie near the top since the building is 35 fl and I am on the 32/33rd floors so I am probably not that far from the signal.


Any suggestions on any amplifiers? I was also going to try a UHF only antenna as someone suggested.


Eram


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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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Are there any analog channels in the UHF band that you could receive? (anything above 13). If there is, and you can't even get an analog UHF signal but yet you can pick up 13 VHF analog signals, there's a problem with the antenna.


If you get analog UHF but not digital UHF, then an amplifier might help you. Channel Master and Winegard both make good pre-amps. I use a CM7775 UHF-only pre-amp, and I'm picking up all but one of the Philadelphia DT's (NBC is only broadcasting at 25%) over mountaineous terrain and 45 miles away.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Do you know if Radio Shack, The Wiz or Sears sells this preamp or do you have to order it from the web?


Also what is the diff between a pre-amp and an amp?


Is a bowtie a directional antenna? I have heard people talk of omnidirectional anteannas. Do you think that might help?





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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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Try to tune one of the analog UHF channels. Then post what it looks like.


If it is weak and snowy, an amp *might* help.


If it has lots of ghosting, you are going to have a hard time.


An omnidirectional antenna is the last thing you want in an urban area. You want an extremely directional antenna to cut down on multipath.


 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I get no signal above 13. I think the UHF part of the antenna is broken.

I bought a RS bowtie by sticking the u-shaped F connector into the coax input of the 8VSB and VOILA!!! I got 3 DTV channels this way (NBC, UPN and WPIX)

I have not been able to tune any others. Also when I tried to use a F connector to coax adapter I lost the signal on all 3 channels.


Any suggestions on what I should try next?

An amp on the bowtie or a different indoor antenna?


Eram


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Eram

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TV=Sony 53HS10, DVD=Sony DVP-550D, CD=Sony CDP-C335, DSS=Dish PVR 501, Receiver=Marantz S5000, Speakers=JBL M28, JBL PSW-D110, VCR=Panasonic PV-V4620
 

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Why don't you want to try my suggestion?


That is, tune to an analog UHF channel and see whether the picture is snowy or has ghosting?


Snowy means it is too weak and you would want an antenna with more gain or an amplifier.


Ghosting means too much multipath, and you would want a more directional antenna.
 
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