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Help setting up Moto6412 and JVC 40K

360 Views 7 Replies 4 Participants Last post by  DSperber
I recently completed my media room and purchased my equipment. I have Comcast cable and a JVC D-VHS. I've tried searching and have read about 1000 posts on the problems and reboot process to make this work, but no real help on how to set it up.

I connected the two boxes via the firewire. How do I check to see if I have a signal and what do I need to configure in the menu?

I have them hooked up and tried learning channels, but wasn't sure if that was just for the analog inputs or not.

I'm new to this and completely lost so any help would be greatly appreciated. The manual only refers to camcorders when talking about the firewire port.


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It looks like I just needed to stop messing with it for awhile. I went back and used the arrow up/down which I assume puts it in some sort of different mode and all of a sudded it had a banner that said 6412 and I had a picture.

If you mean you did a "channel up or down" out of the numeric analog OTA channels and into L1, then L2 (both S-VHS/composite inputs) and on into the I-1, I-2, etc. (iLink/1394/firewire input devices) then yes, that's what you needed to do. That's how you select the external 1394 input source for the 40K.

Once you've selected an I-* input, the 40K tries to handshake to be sure all protocols are satisfied. The 6412 will be shown as DCT-6412 on the OSD display bar.

Output for 1394 input (and recorded D-VHS) is via component video of the 40K. You can watch the 6412 playback (or live) through the 1394 connection to the 40K and then via the component video output of the 40K to your HDTV component video input. Of course you can also watch 6412 playback (or live) directly from the component video or DVI outputs of the 6412 to the component video or DVI inputs on your HDTV.

Note that all 6412 graphics (menu, guide, setup, ON DEMAND, etc.) are only presented on the outputs of the 6412... not through the 1394 connection to the 40K. So you'll obviously have to have BOTH the 6412 and 40K connected to your HDTV, to satisfy all configuration record/playback needs.

Finally, note that the handshake between 40K and 6412 is a bit fragile. Each time you go into playback or search on the 40K it seems to disrupt the established handshake with the 6412. And that means if you then press STOP on the 40K you have a decent chance of having lost the 1394 sync with the 6412. You will either be showing an out-of-sync garbage pattern on your HDTV out of the 40K, or you might see the "cannot decode" message box.

If this happens, you should turn both the 40K and 6412 off. Then turn the 40K on first and wait a bit. Then turn the 6412 on and pray that the 40K re-establishes sync and that you once again see the 6412 program out through the 40K to your HDTV. If you don't, and if you try this a few times and it still fails, the failsafe approach is to turn both boxes off, pull the 40K AC power plug out of the wall and let it rest a bit, then plug the 40K back into the wall and power it on. The cold start power-on reset process seems to always clear things up. Now power the 6412 on and the two boxes should once again handshake successfullyt, and you should once again be seeing 6412 program content out of the 40K onto your HDTV.

Note that if you have multiple 1394 devices which you are going to feed as input to the 40K (e.g. 6412 or 6200, Panny PV-HD1000, DV camera, etc.) each one will be given an I-* number that gets retained permanently and uniquely by the 40K. The first device will be called I-1, the second device will be called I-2, etc. Being given such an I-n designation implies a successful 1394 handshake so that this external device is an acceptable 1394 input source for the 40K. You can then successfully dub/playback from this external 1394 device to/through the 40K and onto your HDTV, subject to 5C copyprotect rules.
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Good info DSperber,

I'd add that the jvc is set to out put sd by default , even when being fed hd source, so Aaron needs to go into the jvc setup menus and set the output to 1080i/720p. I had a mild heart attack when I first saw the output of the 40000 on my hdtv.....uuuugly. Found the setting in the jvc video menus....gorgeous. Another setting is the power save mode. The jvc optical audio out will output a signal even when the unit is off and the electronics will stay warm unless power save mode is turned on in the setup menus. This was an issue for me because I'm feeding a shared audio input on my receiver that has both optical and coaxial so with optical always active the dvd player could not grab the coaxial input even with the dvhs off (in standby). Power save on fixes this.
Thanks for all the information. DSperber you are correct in that I had swithced to the I-1. It seems to be working very well and I've archived several things off of my DVR to D-VHS. The manual was less than helpful for setting this up, but as usual I can always find answers here. I was trying to figure out if there was a way to bring up the guide and I guess you anticitipated that question. :)

I've seen that you can see the broadcasts through either, but without the guide it seems easier to just watch it through the 6412.

I've heard that the handshake is pretty fragile, but I've recorded about 3 things and watched one of them back and several d-theater tapes and luckily haven't had any problems ...yet. :)

Paul thanks for the advice. I had found the hd setting previously so luckily I had that covered. Otherwise, I think I might of had a mild heart-attack as well.

Thanks for all the help,

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Originally posted by nelsonhowells
Can a 6412 be hooked to an DVD Burner ???
Sure ...all outputs are active but of course you will not be able to record hd material in hd ....just down rezzed sd....since dvd burners are sd.
Originally posted by adixon
I've seen that you can see the broadcasts through either, but without the guide it seems easier to just watch it through the 6412.
True enough. When watching DVR playback or live HDTV there really is no logical reason to be viewing through the 40K, especially if it is not being used simultaneously to record what is being emitted from the 6412. You want to see the responses from the 6412 when you use the remote to control the DVR, and viewing via the 6412 is the only way to see them.

It's only during the early stages of getting set up to record to D-VHS that I want to be sure the 40K/6412 sync is established successfully that I have need to monitor the 40K component video output. However once sync is confirmed and recording is started and I'm satisfied that all is going well, I always go back to watching the content from the 6412 on my HDTV.

Another justification for switching back to view the 40K output on your HDTV is to view the OSD display out of the 40K, for example to see the elapsed recording time duration values. In other words, when you want to view the graphics output generated by the 40K (which of course only go out to the HDTV via component video and naturally don't get recorded onto the tape) you need to be looking at its own component video output and not that of the 6412.

But yet another reason I prefer watching anything from the 6412 over the 40K when I have such a choice (i.e. when the content is coming from the 6412) is because I feel that the MPEG D/A decoders on the 40K which send output to the HDTV via component video produce a slightly more reddish coloration than the component video outputs on any of my other HDTV sources.

I've done A-B-C-D comparisons on the top-quality skin-color-heavy almost stationary often close-up image Jay Leno show (I had four comparable sources for local networks at one time that were available for such a comparison) through my Zektor switch, and this is simply my own observation. The sources for this comparison were (a) true OTA local network signal via Panny DST50, (b) Comcast-provided local network signal via 6412, and (c) D* provided local network (when I still subscribed to D* HDTV, which I no longer do) via Hughes E86. The Zektor allowed me to view all three original sources directly from their tuners and MPEG decoder component video outputs going to my HDTV, as well as from the Comcast 6412 through 1394 to the 40K and out the component video from the 40K.

In my opinion, all three original HDTV receiver sources for the same Leno content produced the identical (and "perfect") skin tone coloration out of their MPEG decoders onto the component video outputs to my HDTV. It was only the component video output of the 40K (fed by 1394 from the 6412) which had a noticeably slightly reddish skin tone.

Sure, I could probably have compensated for that on my HDTV setup, but I didn't want to. And, why were the other three sources identical and perfect (per my current HDTV setup), and only the 40K output slightly reddish? It could be my particular 40K I suppose, but for whatever explanation I believe my 40K puts out slightly reddish component video and plain and simple that's my situation and I have to deal with it.

I've got very high-end Audioquest component video cables involved for connecting all four sources to the Zektor and out of the Zektor to the HDTV, so I don't think it's a cable difference issue. I haven't tried swapping input ports on the Zektor just to be sure that the 40K's port wasn't somehow different, but honestly I don't believe it is the Zektor switch which might be at fault. I really do feel it is the MPEG decoder on the 40K.

I've also done A-B comparisons between 6412 and 40K on non-OTA premium-type channels (e.g. HBOHD, SHOHD, INHD1/2, DISCHD, ESPNHD) and have observed the same slightly reddish coloration out of the 40K. This reinforces my OTA-based feelings about the MPEG decoder on the 40K, as compared to that of other HDTV devices I own. Again, this is only my own personal experience, but again is just even more motivation for me to watch 6412-provided content from the 6412 to my HDTV rather than via 1394 to the 40K and out of the 40K to my HDTV.

I've heard that the handshake is pretty fragile
Well, I wouldn't say that it's fragile once it's been established and recording is in progress. In my experience, it's fragile only when you begin to use VCR controls on the 40K, for forward or backward or index point searching. Once other than normal mechanical motion speeds come into play there's a time period once you press PLAY (or STOP) where the MPEG synchronization from tape as well as 1394 sync from 6412 (going on all the time) must be simultaneously addressed and reestablished. This problem seems especially difficult for the 40K following reverse searches, followed by pressing PLAY.

These challenges seem to be a bit much for the 40K to handle with 100% success, hence my comments about the non-zero likelihood of just losing sync with the 6412 after a series of such VCR control actions. So I'm always very aware of and sensitive to these possibilities whenever I'm positioning tape on the 40K, and hence why I would be monitoring the 40K output on my HDTV output during this period rather than caring about a slight reddish coloration. I'm sure the HDTV digital MPEG2 data being recorded on D-VHS tape is the same exact digital data as was present on the 6412 hard drive, and that's really what's important in the end.

But for watching 6412 content directly when I could also watch via 1394 and the 40K, I myself always watch from the 6412. I only watch from the 40K when viewing D-VHS playback.

One final note on 40K care and feeding... my own policy is to only use D-VHS tapes (JVC) when making HDTV recordings. I never use my top-quality S-VHS tapes (Fuji Pro-S ST-120, 81581 stamped on the shell, bronze colored trim on packaging) for anything other than S-VHS recording. I do not try to use S-VHS tapes for D-VHS applications. Others may have different opinions, but that's just my feeling and I'm satisfied with the results no matter what the cost consequences.

Also, I follow JVC's recommendation which came with the 40K in several different and very visible printed formats about using the provided D-VHS cleaning tape on a regular basis, maybe after every 50 hours of use. I have found this (whether really necessary or not) to have produced excellent results for me in preventing recording glitches, dropouts, etc. I suspect this has beneficial results in general, even for analog S-VHS recordings.
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