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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
OK, I tried posting for some advice and feedback over in the PS forum, but I think those guys are too busy arguing about Little Big Planet to help with my noobie issue



I know there are only like a million threads on the subject...but that's part of the problem: there are like a million threads on the subject!!! So maybe one of my Digital Media brethren will take pity on me and I can get a quick answer.


Just got a BD drive for Xmas and I'm trying to rip and stream content to my PS3. This is my first attempt, so I haven't played around much, but I used AnyDVD HD to just do a straight rip of the .m2ts files. I see these are supposed to be native to PS3, so I figured, for this BD anyway, I was good to go.


I ripped everything over to my HP MSS; I stream from it to the PS3 using the PVConnect Media Server. First run, PS3 is able to play the biggest of the .m2ts files, which is obviously the movie file and I'm pretty happy with the process. I've done the very small sample of 2 movies so far.


Then I ran into an unexpected snag: my 3rd sample just happen to be a Pushing Daisies disc (for the wife). When I browsed the disc, I saw the same .m2ts file structure (which I wasn't sure about...are all BDs .m2ts or does different encoding mean different file type? like, mpeg-2 and mpeg-4 are .m2ts, but VC-1 is something else?), and ripped it the same way as the 2 movie BDs. However, the 3 big files...5G a piece, which obviously represent the episodes on that disc...won't stream to PS3 the way the 2 previous movies did.


Now I should mention that the 2 movies I own, and the PD disc is a rental...shhhh; is that a big, naive duh on my part? Is their like super-duper protection on rental BDs that AnyDVD HD won't break...or maybe the movies, are older (which they are), and PD is a pretty new release, and AnyDVD HD just isn't 100% on encryption yet? Or is it a case where the TV series disc maybe needs another file, rather than playing the straight .m2ts like a movie would?


Thanks,

CD
 

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Welcome to hell.


I've been going through the same thing. Some discs are pretty easy to get working, others seem to resist no matter what you do. Probably the best forum of this stuff if you care to wade through all the technical discussions is forum.doom9.org


Bottom line is ripping and streaming high def is still kind of tricky. It usually requires some kind of file manipulation, conversion, whatever.


If you really want to pull your hair out try ripping HD-DVD to a format that can be streamed to the PS3. I did it with Transformers, and that's the only one I've gotten to work so far.


As for the files, m2ts is Sony's high def format. Obviously you'll see a lot of that on Blu-ray discs. VC-1 is essentially mpeg4, it's a Microsoft format. They're more or less equivalent. Both have been used on Blu-ray.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasAg /forum/post/15529000


Can't help with the PS3, but all BD's are m2ts. It's just a container. It could contain avc, vc-1, etc.

OK, thanks.


CD
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by WallyWest /forum/post/15528771


Welcome to hell.


I've been going through the same thing. Some discs are pretty easy to get working, others seem to resist no matter what you do. Probably the best forum of this stuff if you care to wade through all the technical discussions is forum.doom9.org


Bottom line is ripping and streaming high def is still kind of tricky. It usually requires some kind of file manipulation, conversion, whatever.


If you really want to pull your hair out try ripping HD-DVD to a format that can be streamed to the PS3. I did it with Transformers, and that's the only one I've gotten to work so far.


As for the files, m2ts is Sony's high def format. Obviously you'll see a lot of that on Blu-ray discs. VC-1 is essentially mpeg4, it's a Microsoft format. They're more or less equivalent. Both have been used on Blu-ray.

Yeah, I've read plenty (remember, a million threads...lol) on the trouble with streaming BD. After getting a system in place to rip and stream literally thousands of CDs, and hundreds of DVDs, I finally decided to plunge into BDs...and I guess I'd hoped my early success was due to the fact that I wasn't trying to remux, or re-encode, or compress these files; I figure HDD is cheap (hopefully I'm on my way to 20T...and then maybe 20T worth of backup behind that), time spent ripping isn't. But I guess even just pulling .m2ts files right off the disc and streaming those isn't going to be as easy as my first couple of passes might have lead me to believe.


Guess like all those discs before them, I will just have to keep playing with BDs and see if I can hone my process. But that doesn't mean the invitation to take pity and share any precious info you may have gleaned is rescinded



CD
 

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Let me give you a summary which type of file can be streamed to ps3


- .m2ts rip from Bly ray have to be encoded in mpeg2 or h.264

- Have to be in ac3 or PCM


Ps3 can play the following as the original bluray disk but can't be stream from PC.


- VC1 - (must be reencode to mpeg2 or h.264 to stream, and this require a powerful PC, it will take a good amount of time ex. A 3.6 overclock quad core take about 5 hours for 2 hours movie, one pass)


- dts, dtshd, truehd can't be stream, have to convert to AC3 or PCM.


To solve all these issue get a NMT type streamer like popcorn hour family
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chan /forum/post/15529661


Let me give you a summary which type of file can be streamed to ps3


- .m2ts rip from Bly ray have to be encoded in mpeg2 or h.264

- Have to be in ac3 or PCM


Ps3 can play the following as the original bluray disk but can't be stream from PC.


- VC1 - (must be reencode to mpeg2 or h.264 to stream, and this require a powerful PC, it will take a good amount of time ex. A 3.6 overclock quad core take about 5 hours for 2 hours movie, one pass)


- dts, dtshd, truehd can't be stream, have to convert to AC3 or PCM.


To solve all these issue get a NMT type streamer like popcorn hour family

Thanks Chan; that answers some questions. So let me review: all BDs have a .m2ts file structure, but within that container I know BDs can have 1 of 3 types of encoding...mpeg-2, mpeg-4/h.264, and vc-1. So you're saying, doing what I'm doing now, which is just a simple, straight rip of the .m2ts using AnyDVD HD, PS3 will stream 2 of the 3...mpeg-2 and mpeg-4/h.264, just not vc-1? Hmm, if that's the case, I'm tempted to say I can live with those odds. OTOH, I imagine all the newer stuff is going to be vc-1?

So, to stream vc-1 encoded files, you need to convert them to mpeg-4/h.264? If...if I decided I wanted to go through all that, what's the process: rip the vc-1 encoded .m2ts using AnyDVD HD, then convert it with something? What's a good program for that? Does it effect PQ (maybe only if you also compress as you convert, which I guess is an option)?


I wasn't really looking to go the NMT, like PCH, route at this time. I have XBMC, which I love, for SD at a bedroom location...and a standalone player in the dedicated HT, which I wouldn't give up (for critical movie-watching, in the HT, I wouldn't want to sacrifice lossless audio, or what I assume is superior encoding with vc-1). This BD streaming was just for more casual movie-watching on the Family Room Plasma, using the existing PS3.


I'm a huge fan of the PS3 as an all-in-one, even though it still has a little way to go. I think it would be short-sighted to go the NMT route, rather than try and bend and hope for further capabilities from the PS3. Will the PS3 stream vc-1 encoded .m2ts files with a transcoder, like TVersity or TWonky? Only way I might be tempted by the PCH is if it played BD .iso; I'm a big fan of .iso, and it's how I handle all my SD. Will PCH stream BD .iso?


Thanks,

CD
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by CDLehner /forum/post/15531660


Thanks Chan; that answers some questions. So let me review: all BDs have a .m2ts file structure, but within that container I know BDs can have 1 of 3 types of encoding...mpeg-2, mpeg-4/h.264, and vc-1. So you're saying, doing what I'm doing now, which is just a simple, straight rip of the .m2ts using AnyDVD HD, PS3 will stream 2 of the 3...mpeg-2 and mpeg-4/h.264, just not vc-1? Hmm, if that's the case, I'm tempted to say I can live with those odds. OTOH, I imagine all the newer stuff is going to be vc-1?

So, to stream vc-1 encoded files, you need to convert them to mpeg-4/h.264? If...if I decided I wanted to go through all that, what's the process: rip the vc-1 encoded .m2ts using AnyDVD HD, then convert it with something? What's a good program for that? Does it effect PQ (maybe only if you also compress as you convert, which I guess is an option)?


I wasn't really looking to go the NMT, like PCH, route at this time. I have XBMC, which I love, for SD at a bedroom location...and a standalone player in the dedicated HT, which I wouldn't give up (for critical movie-watching, in the HT, I wouldn't want to sacrifice lossless audio, or what I assume is superior encoding with vc-1). This BD streaming was just for more casual movie-watching on the Family Room Plasma, using the existing PS3.


I'm a huge fan of the PS3 as an all-in-one, even though it still has a little way to go. I think it would be short-sighted to go the NMT route, rather than try and bend and hope for further capabilities from the PS3. Will the PS3 stream vc-1 encoded .m2ts files with a transcoder, like TVersity or TWonky? Only way I might be tempted by the PCH is if it played BD .iso; I'm a big fan of .iso, and it's how I handle all my SD. Will PCH stream BD .iso?


Thanks,

CD

Man...doing some research on my own, for converting vc-1 encoded files to mpeg-4/h.264 and there is some real conflicting information out there. Lots of other people are posing the same question I am...how do you get vc-1 encoded files to stream to PS3...and some are claiming "PS3 has been able to stream vc-1 for months"...and these responses are from like July of 08. Yet there are still plenty of posts after that date with people continuing to have issues. Then I read that maybe it'll stream vc-1, but not if it's encoded with multi-channel audio; huh? Aren't all BDs multi-channel audio?


I guess this really isn't ready for prime time yet?



CD
 

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Another issue you will come to for straight bluray rip is that if the audio is in DTS, DTSHD and TrueHD, you will not have sound and most bluray contain these sound format.


PS3 can only stream mpeg2 and h.264 encode with AC3 or PCM, that's it. You have to convert those lossless and dts to PCM or AC3.


I never have any success to stream VC1 to PS3 with anything, I had to re-encode to H.264 using ripbot264 and It take a long time. And quality is good to excellent depend on the bitrate. It is much better than DVD, I can say it is 95 to 99% of the original quality, but you have to deal with the sound format also.



PCH won't stream bluray .iso, only straight bluray rip .m2ts, it stream almost everything else. The time it save to not to deal with encoding, converting, remuxing, etc... is worth it to get the PCH, it also bitstream lossless like DTSMA and TrueHD.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chan /forum/post/15532328


Another issue you will come to for straight bluray rip is that if the audio is in DTS, DTSHD and TrueHD, you will not have sound and most bluray contain these sound format.


PS3 can only stream mpeg2 and h.264 encode with AC3 or PCM, that's it. You have to convert those lossless and dts to PCM or AC3.


I never have any success to stream VC1 to PS3 with anything, I had to re-encode to H.264 using ripbot264 and It take a long time. And quality is good to excellent depend on the bitrate. It is much better than DVD, I can say it is 95 to 99% of the original quality, but you have to deal with the sound format also.



PCH won't stream bluray .iso, only straight bluray rip .m2ts, it stream almost everything else. The time it save to not to deal with encoding, converting, remuxing, etc... is worth it to get the PCH, it also bitstream lossless like DTSMA and TrueHD.

Well...if I decided I wanting to stream to the dedicated HT, keeping vc-1 encoding and the lossless audio, I would consider the PCH. Do you know about how AppleTV handles BD files? It's another device that I find interesting. Just out of curiousity, does anything stream BD .iso natively?


So I guess the 2 movie files I ripped to start with must have had lossy audio? But you're saying PS3 won't stream regular DTS either...not just the lossless codecs? Hmm, I could have sworn one of the 2 movies I got to stream had DTS...at least as an option. How does that work...I mean most BDs have several audio streams to choose from. They can't be built into the main .m2ts file, can they? Otherwise, how would you be able to select between different formats? Or is it that the main .m2ts movie file has a default format, and the others are available to select...but if the main file's default is dts, or a lossless codec, it's built-in and then that main file won't stream to PS3?


OK, so to recap: vc-1 encoded won't stream to PS3 at all...you get that "corrupted data" or "unsupported file type" error? But if the main .m2ts file is mpeg-2 or mpeg-4/h.264, but has dts or lossless audio, video will stream but no sound??


Man, I held off trying to rip and stream BD for a while, because I knew in the "early days" it was really like trying to hammer a star-shaped peg into a square hole. I asked the wife for a BD drive this Xmas because I thought it must have come some way since then, but it doesn't appear to be all that much better.
Hope that gift doesn't come to collect dust.


CD
 

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Yes you can select different audio if It contain multiple track, if the file have dts or lossless (except PCM) you will have no audio.


I find many movie has dts or loss less for Multichannel, and 2 channel AC3, we don't want 2 channel right
.


Video will stream as long as in H.264 or Mpeg2, you will have audio if it is AC3 or PCM. DTS or Lossless will have no sound.


I don't know anything can stream bluray.iso, except using HTPC. PCH can stream almost everything including DVD.iso but not bluray .iso.
 

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I want to clarify, if file has multiple track you will have audio, but selecting dts or lossless will not have sound.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDLehner /forum/post/15532792


Man, I held off trying to rip and stream BD for a while, because I knew in the "early days" it was really like trying to hammer a star-shaped peg into a square hole. I asked the wife for a BD drive this Xmas because I thought it must have come some way since then, but it doesn't appear to be all that much better.
Hope that gift doesn't come to collect dust.

Same here.


The biggest issue is the audio thing. Video works fine but with most movies you have to demux, convert the audio to AC3, and then remux. And then it *might* work.


I'm probably going to get a nice HTPC case for my computer and use it as my source component for HD-DVD and Blu-ray. That's pretty straight forward.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chan /forum/post/15532972


I want to clarify, if file has multiple track you will have audio, but selecting dts or lossless will not have sound.

See, this is where you lose me a bit Chan; I'm not sure what you mean by selecting the dts or lossless audio? When I rip straight from AnyDVD HD, there is no way to pick and choose files, say like DVD Shrink (which I use for all my SD .ISOs).


Let me give you an example: one of my test rips was the 15th Anniversary edition of Reservoir Dogs. AnyDVD HD decrypts the discs and then I select 'Rip Video DVD to Harddisk'; you pick a directory and it pulls EVERYTHING.


Now, in the case of the RD BD, I get the BDMV and Certificate directories (we'll ignore the Certificate), and within BDMV the .m2ts files are in the Stream folder. There are 17 .m2ts files, with of course the biggest one being the movie; I lose everything else and that file streams to PS3 just fine.


And, FWIW, I checked the disc tonight; it has DTS HD, as well as DD available for audio. Now, as we've discussed, I would say this is kind of typical of BDs...to have both lossy and lossless (the newer releases these days) audio tracks available. I guess one of them has to be "built-in" to the .m2ts main movie file, but I would think this would almost always be the "lesser" audio track, the lossy one...one the PS3 could stream...and the "upgraded" audio track, like Dolby HD or DTS HD, would be "selectable"...contained in one of those .m2ts files I'm losing?


I'm not trying to come across as an authority; obviously I don't know squat. I'm just trying to offer up some observations and maybe clarify what is a very confusing process.


CD
 

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Try this media server. It works very well with little to NO configuration. Only transcodes what PS3 can't play. It has streamed my m2ts files ripped using anydvd without stutter at high bit rates.

http://code.google.com/p/ps3mediaserver/


The author is doing a great job of updating, fixing bugs and is open to suggestions. I can't emphasize enough what a great piece of software this is. I was totally frustrated with Tversity, Twonky etc etc. This server even plays back my vista media center hdtv dvr-ms files perfectly with no configuration required.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by snoots /forum/post/15541156


Try this media server. It works very well with little to NO configuration. Only transcodes what PS3 can't play. It has streamed my m2ts files ripped using anydvd without stutter at high bit rates.

http://code.google.com/p/ps3mediaserver/


The author is doing a great job of updating, fixing bugs and is open to suggestions. I can't emphasize enough what a great piece of software this is. I was totally frustrated with Tversity, Twonky etc etc. This server even plays back my vista media center hdtv dvr-ms files perfectly with no configuration required.

Well I have to tell ya...I'm part of that whole "no transcoder" movement; well, kind of. As I've mentioned, I stream from a server running WHS. WHS, by design, has a "built-in" media server...first via Windows Media Connect, which left a lot to be desired, and now PVConnect, which is TWonky-based and much better. I've mostly been against the idea of making things too complicated, or bending my system too much...I want to try and wring everything I can out of it, organically, before I just throw in my hand and start installing this codec, that plug-in, and yet another media server.


But this thing looks very promising: the description makes the install sound un-fussy, Snoots says he's having success with most of his .m2ts rips...it supports DVD .ISO (which is BIG for me)...it transcodes FLAC (even though I've settled on the outstanding Squeezebox for audio streaming, this would be a nice bonus)...and does thumbnail for video. Definitely sounds worth a try. How's the support Snoots? Is there an AVS thread yet?


CD
 

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It is working well for me. The only issue you will have is that the ISO DVD playback does not support the full DVD menu systems. It does playback the VOBs. I actually am using an IstarHD for DVD iso's since it allows menu functions. The PS3 I use for the other media types I stream. HDTV shows, HD TIVO mpg rips etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by snoots /forum/post/15541454


It is working well for me. The only issue you will have is that the ISO DVD playback does not support the full DVD menu systems. It does playback the VOBs. I actually am using an IstarHD for DVD iso's since it allows menu functions. The PS3 I use for the other media types I stream. HDTV shows, HD TIVO mpg rips etc.

Thanks. Non-issue with the .ISO movie menus...I only ever rip the movie file anyway. And I've never had any trouble streaming .VOBs to PS3 natively.


CD
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDLehner /forum/post/15538434


See, this is where you lose me a bit Chan; I'm not sure what you mean by selecting the dts or lossless audio? When I rip straight from AnyDVD HD, there is no way to pick and choose files, say like DVD Shrink (which I use for all my SD .ISOs).


Let me give you an example: one of my test rips was the 15th Anniversary edition of Reservoir Dogs. AnyDVD HD decrypts the discs and then I select 'Rip Video DVD to Harddisk'; you pick a directory and it pulls EVERYTHING.


Now, in the case of the RD BD, I get the BDMV and Certificate directories (we'll ignore the Certificate), and within BDMV the .m2ts files are in the Stream folder. There are 17 .m2ts files, with of course the biggest one being the movie; I lose everything else and that file streams to PS3 just fine.


And, FWIW, I checked the disc tonight; it has DTS HD, as well as DD available for audio. Now, as we've discussed, I would say this is kind of typical of BDs...to have both lossy and lossless (the newer releases these days) audio tracks available. I guess one of them has to be "built-in" to the .m2ts main movie file, but I would think this would almost always be the "lesser" audio track, the lossy one...one the PS3 could stream...and the "upgraded" audio track, like Dolby HD or DTS HD, would be "selectable"...contained in one of those .m2ts files I'm losing?


I'm not trying to come across as an authority; obviously I don't know squat. I'm just trying to offer up some observations and maybe clarify what is a very confusing process.


CD

I wasn't clear, what you say is 100% correctly, I am trying to say in those original rip .m2ts, when you selecting different audio track **on the PS3** other than AC3 or PCM will have no audio.


And there are many .m2ts only have multichannel for Lossless or DTS, and only offer AC3 for 2 channel (and we don't want 2 channel sound right?). So you will be limit to 2 channel AC3 or get no sound. If I want multichannel for these track, I am out of luck, or have to demux the lossless or DTS and convert these to AC3 or PCM.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDLehner /forum/post/15538434


And, FWIW, I checked the disc tonight; it has DTS HD, as well as DD available for audio. Now, as we've discussed, I would say this is kind of typical of BDs...to have both lossy and lossless (the newer releases these days) audio tracks available. I guess one of them has to be "built-in" to the .m2ts main movie file, but I would think this would almost always be the "lesser" audio track, the lossy one...one the PS3 could stream...and the "upgraded" audio track, like Dolby HD or DTS HD, would be "selectable"...contained in one of those .m2ts files I'm losing?

The .m2ts file will have multiple audio tracks which you can remove by remuxing the file.
 
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