[bluer101]

I moved into a new place and after setting up my room I have a big problem with nulls. My bass does not sound that good anymore. I already tried the crawl test last night finally and with no luck it sounds better with my subs up in the fron t corners. I do not want to re-arrange my living room since I just put up all the speakers and the wife factor. So the question is, should I try other things you guys suggest or buy new subs? Does downward vs forward make a difference? I used to have carpet floors now they are tile.


BTW: My subs are Infinity BU 120's.


Here are some photos.

 

[mojomike]

I'm confused by what you said. Are you saying it sounds good with the subs in the corners or it does not? In any case, downward or forward firing will make no difference. I also don't think new subs are the answer either. You may want to try some assymetrical positioning of the subs to solve the nulls.

 

[deneb]

Sounds like you need some bass traps, those will help boost nulls as well as reduce peaks. It looks like your seating area is in the middle of the room (when the kitchen is factored in), which can be about the worst place for bass response.


Also, try what mike says above, move the subs around, experiment with the phase control on each sub as well.

 

[OvalNut]



Quote:
It looks like your seating area is in the middle of the room (when the kitchen is factored in), which can be about the worst place for bass response.

That's what I was thinking too. Repositioning at least one of the subs, and adding bass traps are about your best bets unless you change the listening position.


Tim

 

[bluer101]

They sound the best in the corners, that does not mean they sound good. I was playing around last night with the position of the subs all over the room and none helped. The couch is just to the back of the middle of the room. Hope that made sense.

 

[mojomike]

Bass traps may help some. They certainly can't hurt. Did you try placing one sub nearfield in the corner area between the two sofas? Also, sometimes changing the seating position even by just a foot or two may make a difference.

 

[DDigitalGuy05]

wife's! know what you mean. my wife hates my ugly speakers. lol

 

[sivadselim]

OT, but I think you should move your fronts in about a foot each (so that their inside edge is in line with your bookshelf) and toe them back out accordingly.

 

[bluer101]

I got home early and have been playing around abit before the wire gets home.

I adjusted my Denon reciever to LFE + Main and set my fronts to large. Thne set the phase switch to 180 on both. It sounds alot better now. Movies sound good, but my music has not much bass. 90% of the time I listen to movies anyway and use the 7 channel stereo for music which helps. I might try moving the subs around again. I also thought I might be used to really boomy bass from my old place. My couch used to be against my rear wall and the bass was very strong. Now the bass has aot of pressure you feel with good mids. Just need more time to play.

 

[Sirquack]

You don't say if you've calibrated your subs correctly using a meter? If your receiver is managing your crossover you should have your subs on bypass or turned to the max.

 

[Ethan Winer]



Quote:
Originally Posted by bluer101 /forum/post/0


I have a big problem with nulls.

Bass traps are the only viable solution. They'll also help with peaks and reduce ringing. All rooms need bass traps. Once you trap, you'll never go back. Or something like that.

--Ethan

 

[bluer101]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirquack /forum/post/0


You don't say if you've calibrated your subs correctly using a meter? If your receiver is managing your crossover you should have your subs on bypass or turned to the max.

Yes I have used my rat shack meter and the subs crossover is maxed out. I just think the room is my problem.

 

[spunky721]



Quote:
Originally Posted by bluer101 /forum/post/0


I got home early and have been playing around abit before the wire gets home.

I adjusted my Denon reciever to LFE + Main and set my fronts to large. Thne set the phase switch to 180 on both. It sounds alot better now. Movies sound good, but my music has not much bass.

Keep the Denon at LFE + Main and change the fronts to small. That might help with the music issue.

 

[cneely8]



Quote:
Originally Posted by spunky721 /forum/post/0


Keep the Denon at LFE + Main and change the fronts to small. That might help with the music issue.

On my 3805, that's impossible. LFE+Main can only be used with the mains as Large. Once you set them to small, you lose the lfe+mains option.

 

[sivadselim]



Quote:
Originally Posted by spunky721 /forum/post/0


Keep the Denon at LFE + Main and change the fronts to small.

As already stated, that's not possible. That setting is for when you have your fronts set to LARGE and you want additional bass, that wouldn't normally be sent there with LARGE fronts, sent to the sub. Without that LFE+Main setting, only LFE is sent to the sub when LARGE fronts are used.


Now, setting the speakers to SMALL will send that same bass to the sub, it just won't be redundant with what is being sent to the fronts, as when using the LFE+Main setting with LARGE fronts.

 

[sivadselim]



Quote:
Originally Posted by bluer101 /forum/post/0


I adjusted my Denon reciever to LFE + Main and set my fronts to large.

Why?


Why would you set your speakers to LARGE and use the LFE+Main setting to get rid of subwoofer nulls or to improve your subwoofers' performance?


The LFE+Main setting sends redundant bass that would normally only go to the LARGE fronts, to the subwoofers, as well. So, if you do this, exactly the same bass signal (that is, LFE + bass below your crossover setting) will be sent to your subs as would be if you simply set your speakers to SMALL.


With your setup, you should run your fronts as SMALL. They're more suited to be run as SMALL. Using the LFE+Main setting with LARGE fronts only augments, via the subwoofer(s), the bass (not LFE) that is sent to your front L+R speakers. The front speakers still receive the same information, LFE+Main or not. That setting does nothing to the LFE and the subwoofer(s) still receives the same exact information that it would receive if you ran the speakers as SMALL. So that setting only increases the amount of front L+R channel bass, not "subwoofer bass".


Make sense?


Have you tried switching your subs' and front speakers' positions so that your subs are in front of the speakers and out further into the room? Corners are usually good for subs, but they shouldn't be smushed all the way into the corners.

 

[deneb]

If it were me, I'd set the mains to small such that any bass below 80hz (music or LFE) goes to the subs. I'd also experiment with placement and phase, particularly moving one sub to nearfield as another poster suggested. It sounds like you were used to the bass in your old location when you were seated close to the wall. Seated in the middle of the room generally yields very weak bass, which is a common room issue. Bass traps will definitely help with this.


Have you considered an EQ as well, such as a Velodyne SMS-1? EQ won't do anything about a null(s), but you likely also have peaks in your response as well.