[MMistro]

I finally got around to finishing my basement and the wife has agreed to "allow" for some home theater equipment in the mixed use space. I need some help deciding with my speaker selection.

Firstly, here are some pictures of the space (sorry please cut and paste, remove the space)

https:// imgur.com/a/S3T4tbh

The speaker wires are pre-run to the projector wall. There is a channel in the ceiling behind the box (visible in the second picture) for the projector housing.
Since it's a mixed use area, it'll have to be a drop down projector towards the right side of the wall (probably the elunevision 150" audioweave, but that's a seperate topic) with the equipment probably stored in that vertical wall niche.
The seating area will (unfortunately?) be along the middle of the room, basically where the box is (And where the L shaped wall is).
There is pre-wire for ceiling speakers, visible hanging in the second picture.

I also have some pre-wire running in the ceiling area, in case i decide to do atmos (These do not run out of the drywall in the pictures).

For reference, right big window wall to small window is approx 160". Seating is about 12-14 feet away, depending on what couch we get.


The basement contractor recommended going with the following setup:
LCR - paradigm ci-pro-p65-iw
Surround - paradigm ci-pro-p65-r
Subwoofer - paradigm defiance-v12
Atmos - ???

My questions would be:
- Two subwoofers or one?

- Should I do a 5.1/5.2 setup with ceiling surrounds?
- Or Should I do a 5.1.2/5.2.2 setup using the box prewire as ceiling surrounds and then two more ceilings (in the higher part of the ceiling) as the atmos? Would it even be worth it? The space doesn't seem to allow for head level surrounds. Standing speakers are not an option with two toddlers.

- My speaker budget is fairly flexible, but I'd like to keep it around 3-4k CAD. Are there better speaker choices I could go with? (Not just for performance, but for my particular layout).

I'm not an audiophile by any stretch of the imagination, but I don't mind spending a bit more if the jump in quality seems worth it. Our listening levels will probably be slightly below "loud", and "clean" bass would be important.

Thanks in advance!

 

[MMistro]

Sorry newbie to the forums... can't seem to find the edit button (I guess I need more posts?).
Wanted to attach the pictures.

 

[m0j0]

Do a search for Polk LSiM speakers on this forum and on slickdeals. There's some good deals going on the 705's and the 704c I believe.

 

[RayGuy]

All in-ceiling speakers will be a mistake. You want all your base level speakers at near ear height. The ceiling is for the Atmos speakers exclusively.

Give this a perusal and educate yourself on the proper layout (important for the intended experience):

https://www.dolby.com/us/en/guide/speaker-setup-guides/5.1.4-overhead-speaker-setup-guide.html

Also, you will want to avoid the exact center of the room for your seating, as that will engender bass frequency response issues.

 

[MMistro]

All in-ceiling speakers will be a mistake. You want all your base level speakers at near ear height. The ceiling is for the Atmos speakers exclusively.

Give this a perusal and educate yourself on the proper layout (important for the intended experience):

Also, you will want to avoid the exact center of the room for your seating, as that will engender bass frequency response issues.

For the surround right, I could mount on the wall, but not sure where I could put the surround left in my setup. Like I mentioned, standing speaker is out of the question.

Should I just do a 3.1.2/3.2.2 instead then? Or just stick to 5.1/5.2?

 

[RayGuy]

For the surround right, I could mount on the wall, but not sure where I could put the surround left in my setup. Like I mentioned, standing speaker is out of the question.

Should I just do a 3.1.2/3.2.2 instead then? Or just stick to 5.1/5.2?

Can you re-orient the room to accommodate the speaker layout? Can you use rear surrounds instead of side surrounds (lots of folks make this compromise)? Can you incorporate the surrounds into furniture of some sort (like small speakers on a long narrow table behind the couch)? Think outside the box!

 

[MMistro]

Can you incorporate the surrounds into furniture of some sort (like small speakers on a long narrow table behind the couch)?

Thanks, this is actually an excellent idea (ie: one the wife will approve of lol). It would also push the sofa forward a bit to align to the guidelines (So maybe I can potentially use the ceiling box speakers as the rear atmos, and my forward pre-wire as the front atmos depending on the angles).

 

[RayGuy]

Thanks, this is actually an excellent idea (ie: one the wife will approve of lol). It would also push the sofa forward a bit to align to the guidelines (So maybe I can potentially use the ceiling box speakers as the rear atmos, and my forward pre-wire as the front atmos depending on the angles).

Now, that's what I'm talking about!

If your new layout isn't perfectly within Dolby guidelines for Atmos angles to your seated ears, you might consider ceiling speakers with a built-in angle, such as the RSL C34. They have a 15 degree angle, which allows you some extra flexibility if either set of speakers is a bit outside the Dolby spec. If you need more angle, the Golden Ear 7000 series has a 30 degree angle.

EDIT: I note that you were looking at Paradigm speakers. I believe they also have an angled in-ceiling speaker available.

 

[gajCA]

Thanks in advance!

Yes, ear level for the base 5 in walls for sure, no higher than 1/2 way up the wall to execute Atmos properly.

Definitely add a second sub as your current 120 watt sub needs a bit of help when the volume gets turned up which is what a second sub will give you, (approximately +6db of headroom by adding a second sub and much much better bass across multiple seating locations).

12” Driver, 120W RMS (250W Dynamic Peak), App Control, High-Velocity Low-Turbulence Ported Design, Anthem Room Correction (ARC®) Ready.

 

[MMistro]

So after revising based on comments, here is what I'm at:

5.2.4

LCR : In wall, behind screen
Rear Surround : bookshelf on table, or maybe stand
Atmos : In Ceiling

I calculated out the angles and managed to find a layout that fits the the Atmos recommended angles.

Considering that It's now 2 extra bookshelf speakers plus another sub, the budget would be 4-5k CAD (a bit flexible though)

What speakers would be good considering the the above placements, types, budget and volume?
I'm in no way committed to a particular brand; I just happened to mention paradigm since that's what my installer was suggesting and figured it was a good baseline to go up or down from.

 

[head_unit]

LCR : In wall, behind screen...Rear Surround : bookshelf on table, or maybe stand...Paradigm

Table seems better-normal people never find stands attractive is my belief. Ask your spouse-let her figure it out as a challenge! Plus, if she figures it out, she can't complain .
LCR: there are with and without back boxes. In this case, there is nothing behind that wall? So you don't have to worry about bleed-through, and can use backless. That means the "enclosure" if stuffed with fiberglass insulation is equivalent to like 3-1/2 cubic feet which is a goodly size. If possible, stick some bracing in the cavity, and anti-vibration coating cascadeaudio.com, even if you gotta open the walls back up. That will reduce the downside to in-wall, vibration of the wall panel.
Paradigm is good stuff. There are various good brands; Focal makes a nice 3-way https://www.focal.com/en/custom-integration/in-wall-in-ceiling-loudspeakers/300-series/in-wall-speakers/300iwlcr6
Even though you have 2 subs, it is good if the other speakers can go low, for better blending of the bass. Run room correction on your receiver! And even with 2 subs, 120 watts is very little power...

 

[RayGuy]

In Canada, you should look at Totem. Their Kin series in-wall speakers should be affordable, but, if you can stretch to the Tribe III (for the front 3), it would be even better. See if you can get a demo from one of their Canadian dealers, then negotiate strongly for a substantial discount. These will give you very high quality performance for both music and movies. Mixing Tribe and Kin has been done by folks here and they have highly praised the result. Kin also has small bookshelf speakers which should be perfect for your side surrounds on the long table. Save money on the Atmos speakers, as they are not nearly as important. Polk or RSL should be all you need, depending on positioning.