AVS Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys,


I noticed something last night while watching the TS160 through DVI into my HLN617W. Does anyone else have fairly large alignment issues with regards to the "INFO" about a currently playing channel? Here's what I mean. Pick a channel, any channel. Now hit the INFO button on your remote. When the overlay window pops up with the program information is there a fairly sizeable difference in the overlay being parallel to the top of the screen? I don't have exact distances, but the right side of the menu appears to be maybe an inch to two inches LOWER than the left side. I also notice this with regards to things like the ticker on CNN or the ESPN channels. Anyone else see this? I didn't happen to see this in my cursory glance at the huge TS160 problem/issue thread over in the HD Hardware forum.


Thanks,

Jeff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
89 Posts
Ice,


Using the same setup my info banner measures 5/8" from top of screen on the left and 7/8" on the right. Been this way from the beginning. Another geometry issue that concerns me is the pincushion I have when watching 4X3.


Stan
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by sbuckler
Ice,


Using the same setup my info banner measures 5/8" from top of screen on the left and 7/8" on the right. Been this way from the beginning. Another geometry issue that concerns me is the pincushion I have when watching 4X3.


Stan
Stan,


From what I could gather over on the HDTV Hardware forum, it seems as if this STB has a known pincushioning issue. I do exactly recall what "pincushioning" is as compared to other geometry issues. Can you explain what this is? Is that the hourglass picture shape?


I will get ACCURATE measurements in terms of the heights of the left and right side of the "INFO" menu tonight or this weekend and let you know. My guess is that I overstated how bad the offset was. Also, have you checked other video sources and inputs on the 617 to make sure it was the STB and not the TV causing the issue?


Thanks,

Jeff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
250 Posts
I wonder if its time that Samsung did the right thing took ALL these units back???


Seems there is a TON of problems with this unit.


Was going to get one but now I will wait!!!


Geoffrey
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by gels
I wonder if its time that Samsung did the right thing took ALL these units back???


Seems there is a TON of problems with this unit.


Was going to get one but now I will wait!!!


Geoffrey
Geoffrey,


Well, I'm not ready to ship the sucker back yet. I still need to investigate if the cause is the STB, the TV, both or neither. One thing that has me scared as heck is this comment from Frank Lee over in the other forum:


"I have had 3 HLM/N617Ws and all of them have the same exact geometry issues. The geometry is all out of whack on the 617. "


Check out this link for Frank's further thoughts. Very scary.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...hreadid=254444


Hoping and praying that his experience is not mine.

:(


Later,

Jeff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,688 Posts
IceBlade,


Does your TV image dip down on the top right-hand side? To measure, put an image up that has black bars going all around it. On all of my TVs, the top right-hand side has been the worst. It is real easy to see when you are running Windows XP via a HTPC. Open up a window fullscreen and look at the borders.


Frank
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by ftlee
IceBlade,


Does your TV image dip down on the top right-hand side? To measure, put an image up that has black bars going all around it. On all of my TVs, the top right-hand side has been the worst. It is real easy to see when you are running Windows XP via a HTPC. Open up a window fullscreen and look at the borders.


Frank
Frank,


I attached this pic of the Avia circle geometry pattern in 4:3 mode displayed on the TV. Look familiar? I am NOT happy right now.



Later,

Jeff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by ftlee
IceBlade,


Does your TV image dip down on the top right-hand side? To measure, put an image up that has black bars going all around it. On all of my TVs, the top right-hand side has been the worst. It is real easy to see when you are running Windows XP via a HTPC. Open up a window fullscreen and look at the borders.


Frank
Yes, Frank. It's pretty bad. From my cursory measurements this evening using the "INFO" overlay from the TS160 I measure a 9/16" difference from the left side of the overlay compared to the right side of the overlay. As you know the INFO overlay doesn't span across the whole screen, so my guess is that if I went from far left to far right, the difference would be even bigger. Man, talk about making me an unhappy camper this evening/morning. :(


Crap!!!!!!


Later,

Jeff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
89 Posts
Quote:
From what I could gather over on the HDTV Hardware forum, it seems as if this STB has a known pincushioning issue. I do exactly recall what "pincushioning" is as compared to other geometry issues. Can you explain what this is? Is that the hourglass picture shape?
Yes it's the hourglass shape. It's definitely the TV as it happens to mine with DTC-100 connected to PC input, TS160 connected to DVI input or my HTPC using MyHD connected to Component 2 input.


Another issue I haven't mentioned is a severe internal reflection in the lower right of my screen.


Anyone have any firm news on discrete codes?


Stan
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by sbuckler
Yes it's the hourglass shape. It's definitely the TV as it happens to mine with DTC-100 connected to PC input, TS160 connected to DVI input or my HTPC using MyHD connected to Component 2 input.


Another issue I haven't mentioned is a severe internal reflection in the lower right of my screen.


Anyone have any firm news on discrete codes?


Stan
Stan, thanks for the clarification on the pincushioning. Is there a specific test pattern I can run to determine how bad it is on my set?


Secondly, the internal reflections. Is there a specific way to determine if this is going on in my set? I use a bias light behind my set and currently it is sitting right behind the semi-open access door on the back of the set where you can see light spill from the lamp inside. I assume that internal reflections would be even worse with that bias light there, but I guess I am not certain what to look for.


Thanks,

Jeff


PS - Do you have the God-awful geometry issues other than pincushioning? In other words, does my attached pic above pretty much look like what you are seeing?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,598 Posts
On my HLM617W with TS160 via DVI, my info bar is perfectly aligned, 3/4" from top of screen on both sides.


I do have pincushioning on 4:3 material, but setting the sidebars to gray instead of black makes it less noticable. I doesn't really bother me most of the time, and seems to vary with different sources.


I guess I've been lucky. I'm quite happy with my 617 and have no major complaints. The biggest annoyance is lack of discrete video input codes.


Dean
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by dwette
On my HLM617W with TS160 via DVI, my info bar is perfectly aligned, 3/4" from top of screen on both sides.


I do have pincushioning on 4:3 material, but setting the sidebars to gray instead of black makes it less noticable. I doesn't really bother me most of the time, and seems to vary with different sources.


I guess I've been lucky. I'm quite happy with my 617 and have no major complaints. The biggest annoyance is lack of discrete video input codes.


Dean
Well, from the sounds of it here and on some other forums I think you are one of the lucky ones. Congrats!


The more I dig into trying to get a good picture with just two sources on this sucker, the more I regret pulling the trigger on this thing. :(


When you watch stuff through the S-Vid inputs from your TS-160 does the INFO overlay start at the top of the screen? It does on mine, and because of the geometry weirdness I actually don't see the top 1/4 of the text on the left hand side. So it looks like not only is the right side drooping, but the left side may be a little high. :(


Any idea why the overlay is placed differently for DVI than S-Vid? DVI INFO overlay is placed as I indicated in my post above... the one with the 9/16" difference from left to right.


Thanks,

Jeff
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,688 Posts
IceBlade,


I looked at your image and noticed two things.


One, the image dipping down on the top right-hand side of the screen was present to some degree on all three of my sets. It looks just like what you posted. I would venture to say that some people see it and are bothered by it and some don't and are not. Example: My wife could care less and it drives me crazy. I always stretch my 4:3 material so that it is hidden most of the time. I would rather watch the stretched content than look at the poor geometry.


Two, it looks like your your image is slightly tilted as a whole. A tech can come out and adjust the tilt but, it will not fix the geometry issues. Example: When my Sr. Tech came out, he adjusted the tilt. It is perfectly even now across the bottom. There is still a 1/4" difference between the top lefthand side of the image and the top righthand side.


P.S. Did you see how flexible the cabinet is?


Frank T. Lee
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by ftlee
IceBlade,


I looked at your image and noticed two things.


One, the image dipping down on the top right-hand side of the screen was present to some degree on all three of my sets. It looks just like what you posted. I would venture to say that some people see it and are bothered by it and some don't and are not. Example: My wife could care less and it drives me crazy. I always stretch my 4:3 material so that it is hidden most of the time. I would rather watch the stretched content than look at the poor geometry.


Two, it looks like your your image is slightly tilted as a whole. A tech can come out and adjust the tilt but, it will not fix the geometry issues. Example: When my Sr. Tech came out, he adjusted the tilt. It is perfectly even now across the bottom. There is still a 1/4" difference between the top lefthand side of the image and the top righthand side.


P.S. Did you see how flexible the cabinet is?


Frank T. Lee


DOH! I forgot to check for the flexibility thing. I will do that tonight.


Two... can you explan the difference between picture tilt vs. geometry issues? How can I tell one from the other and is there a particular test pattern that will give me quantitative results in terms of measurement of these two things?


Thanks,

Jeff


PS - So what are you doing in regards to this set since you have already been through 3? Are you holding your breath and waiting for number 4 to arrive? Have you had the HLN variety yet?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,688 Posts
dwette,


I would like to see a 617W with perfect geometry. Do you have the Avia DVD? If so, can you fill up your entire screen with a cross-hatch (I think that is what the white squares are called) pattern, take a picture, and post it?


Thanks,


Frank T. Lee
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,598 Posts
Quote:
Originally posted by ftlee
I would like to see a 617W with perfect geometry. Do you have the Avia DVD? If so, can you fill up your entire screen with a cross-hatch (I think that is what the white squares are called) pattern, take a picture, and post it?
I have Avia. When I get a chance I'll do that, but not sure when that'll be. This weekend I'll be busy working, but I'm also borrowing an Arcam DV88 Plus DVD player for evaluation, so what chance I'll have to watch TV will be playing actual DVDs.


Dean
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Hi guys...


I too have a pretty severe internal refelction in the lower right hand corner....most noticeable when the program info bar is on screen ... it appears to be a reflection of the upper left.


My HLN50 arrived 4 days ago...no sign of pincushioning yet.


I did adjust my gamma down to 0 and it seems to have helped with some of the clayface effect i was seeing on over the air HD via 160 w DVI.


Any idea on a correction for the internal reflections ? Is this a physical issue with the set ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,598 Posts
I also see the lower-right reflection, but only when the Info bar is up. In two months of use, I've never been able to spot it otherwise, even when trying. For example, tune to a channel with no content. Bring up the Info bar - reflection is there, Dismiss Info bar - reflection is gone.


It doesn't bother me.


And the rainbows never bother me either, because I can only see them in peripheral vision when glancing away from the screen quickly.


I just keep likning this set better and better. The Vegas and Miami aerial shots on CSI are incredible.


Dean
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Do the HLN50x models have geometry issues too, or is this just a problem with the 61x models?


I'm really close to pulling the trigger on a 50", but I don't want to have to deal with pincushioning and other geometry issues on a $4K TV, particularly because I'm one of the cursed types who can't ignore these types of issues.


Thanks in advance.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,974 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Yep, I have the internal reflection issue as well in the lower right corner... thus far it hasn't bugged me anywhere near close to the other issues I am having.


Later,

Jeff
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top