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Home Theater for Dummies - I need help!

5346 Views 60 Replies 33 Participants Last post by Cameron, Jan 24, 2008

johnomadison

Discussion Starter · Jan 20, 2008

My wife and I have decided to put a home theater in our basement which will include a projector. Living in Madison, WI we are limited to actually seeing projectors in action and are weary about trusting sales people who are limited to only selling a few products. We are looking to spend around $12k and use the room for watching sports in HD and movies. The room is fairly dark and we will be sitting 14-15 feet away. I received a quote from AMS in Madison which included the following:

Sony VPLVW50

Dalite Screen

Pioneer Elite 7.1 Rcvr (VSX92TXH)

Pioneer Elite Blu-Ray DVD (BDP94HD)

Def-Tech Pro Monitor 1000 -

Def-Tech Pro Center 2000 -

Gefen Cat5e / HDMI -

Def-Tech Pro Sub 1000 -

The total quote was for roughly $12,700 which included full installation and universal remote.

I have a few questions before we decide to purchase anything:

1) I have spent time on projectorcentral.com and they rate the Panasonic projectors very high (AE2000U) and the Sony's relatively low although the sony's cost more. Is there some sort of bias on the site for panasonic or against sony?

2) Is the Pearl worth the money ? What are the pros and cons of the projector?

3) Is the Panasonic AE2000U significantly better than the pearl and still cost $700-$800 less?

4) Since my wife and know very little about this stuff, is it wiser to go with someone local for issues down the road?

5) Does anyone have any experience with AMS in Madison or know of anyone around this area that is reputable? The seem to only sell Sony and Epson.

6) The sales guy was trying to tell me that the Pioneer Elite Blu-Ray DVD (BDP94HD) will play the next 3 generations of Blu-Ray discs and is worth the extra money because Blu-Ray players in the future will only be for one specific generation of discs and you will need to buy a new one every time there is an upgrade.

I would greatly appreciate any help with any of these questions. It has been an overwhelming experience so far which hopefully will simply in the next few weeks.

JohnO in Madison

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1 - 20 of 61 Posts

edved1

· #2 · Jan 20, 2008

I would advise ditching the Dalite Screen and purchasing a Carada screen instead and with the money saved, buy the current generation of the Sony projector. The Sony VPL VW60 is the better option.

my2cents.

Laserfan

· #3 · Jan 20, 2008

Hey JohnO I'll bet it's cold in Mad-town today, huh!

You'll probably get much better responses than mine but I will say the following:

If HT and AV stuff is not a hobby for you, you'd do well to get a total, local provider to install-and-service. There's an awful lot that has to be "got right" particularly positioning & aligning the PJ and matching the sources to it i.e. calibration. Many of us here revel in this stuff but if you don't, there are lots of details to pay attention to in order to get great images & sound.

All the equipment is of high quality. I will only say that I'm skeptical about the Blu-Ray player claim since BD is still a "moving target" and the future isn't here yet!

Regardless, make sure you get a player that is GREAT at upscaling Std Def DVDs since they will still dominate most folks' viewing experiences. Dunno the Pioneer--I think you need though to get a player with a Reon/HQV processing chip.

Welcome to AVSforum and good luck!

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2

frorule

· #4 · Jan 20, 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnomadison /forum/post/12873701

3) Is the Panasonic AE2000U significantly better than the pearl and still cost $700-$800 less? I got a quote from Full Compass in Middleton, WI for the AE2000U for $2568.

When it comes to digital projectors, price does not necessarily mean a better picture. Usually, it means it has more features. Some, or maybe most of these features you won't even need or use.

Since you are new to game, not unlike myself, I just thought I would make you aware that you don't have to spend an arm and a leg to get a great projector. There are excellent PJ's out there in the $800 to $1500 price range that would blow you away. Mostly 720p models, but also one 1080p that I know of. The 720p's are no slouches. I would consider checking some of them out. I only give you this advice assuming you are a complete newbie to projectors. If you already know that inexpensive 720p models are not what you're looking for. Just ignore me.

If that is the case though, at least research the Mits HC4900. Good luck and have fun!

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Cameron

· #5 · Jan 20, 2008

I don't put a lot of stock in what Projectorcentral has to say for projectors.

I would go for the Sony VW60 over the 50 for many reasons. It is a much better projector.

I agree with the above comment on the screen. Definitely check out the Carada.

Why do you need the Gefen converter?

You might want to try AVS for some prices too.

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zductive

· #6 · Jan 20, 2008

Definitely carada screen

Look at epson v. vw60 - why pay the extra money if your not a perfectionist

Look at monoprice for an hdmi switch

Forget the blu ray for now - I got an hd-a2 as an upconverting dvd - works fine

Blu ray price will fall a lot this year (I hope)

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MacDaddy29

· #7 · Jan 20, 2008

Hire a local contrator the do the room and the wiring. Buy all the equipment from companies like AVS and then hire an ISF tech to come in and install and calibrate everything and program and show you how to use the universal remote.

aachrisg

· #8 · Jan 20, 2008

1) buy a carada criterion screen. save yourself ~$1000

2) is there some special reason he wants you to spend $550 ea on hdmi/cat5e conversion? I would do something more like:

1 long hdmi cable from receiver to projector, run through ceiling or hidden in some other way. ~$50.

2. hdmi and other cables from components to receiver. ~$7 each.

Saving you on the order of $400 and getting rid of an unnecessary exotic component. Using your receiver to switch and covert everything to one hdmi output will make your system much simpler. You might not even need the fancy remote since the system will be so simple. The receiver mentioned will do that, and so will other cheaper ones. chances are he was planning to waste your money on some expensive speaker cabling too, I'd guess.

3. You need some surround speakers in there.

4. I'd probably get a better sub.

I'd find a contractor who isn't looking to make their money off of equipment markup, and buy the equipment yourself off the internet. They don't need to know anything special about home theater as long as they know how to fish wires and mount something to the ceiling and you know enough/get enough good advice to tell them what wires to fish. Thats what I did when I set up my theater, and it worked out great even though I had no experience. With the money you save, you can buy yourself some better equipment.

Once you are in control of the components and pricing, you can make much better tradeoffs. And those tradeoffs aren't all about components - you might get more per $ spent out of non-component expenditures - chairs, blinds, carpeting, x10 switches so you can turn the lights on/off from your remote, a shelf for your movies/equipment, etc.

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joerod

· #9 · Jan 20, 2008

Definitely get the VW60 and not the 50. Worse comes to worse pick up for less elsewhere.

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Tony S

· #10 · Jan 20, 2008

Greetings John.

I'm pretty much a noob myself. I took the route suggested by aachrisg.

Pj (RS-1), receiver, and speakers were purchased through AVS. Screen by Carada, sub by SVS, Tosh XA-2 through Value Electronics, cables by Bluejeans. Kept it all under 12k.

Couldn't be happier.

Tony

mark haflich

· #11 · Jan 20, 2008

Ther is so much bad advice posted here its scary. But there is a lot of good advice also. The VPL-vw50 is discontinued. Make sure you get the VPL-vw60 instead. To save money, you could get the new VPL-vw40. It isessentially a VPL-vw50 for a list of about $3500.

What absolute dribble about be sure you get an upconverting player. Your projector no matter what it is will do the upconverting. Digital projectors can display only in their native rate and must change anything fed to them not at that rate to that rate. This is not to say that one can not improve upon the stuff in the projector that does this by doing it outside in a better box. but the issue is whether the outside box does it better. A good sony Blu Ray playercan be had for $300 after rebate. The BPDS300 or whatever. It will not do superior upscaling than what the VPL-vw60 will do. Blu Ray has now one the war. Its over for HD DVD. As a marketing ploy manufacturers of Bluray and HD DVD are urging the public tobuy a machine toget the upscasling for standard dvds BUT YOUR SET WILL DO IT.

In this business, you will get a lot of do what I did. I did it and so should you. I'm not stupid so why should you be? Validate my choice by doing what I did. Pplease. PLEASE.

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buckswope

· #12 · Jan 20, 2008

Your questions are about hardware, but I'll respond to a question by asking another.

How much do you value the fact that this system will be fully installed, programmed & supported by a dealer? Do you want turnkey operation and a single phone call to make when something goes wrong?

AVS is populated by a zillion enthusiasts and a few CI's (professional custom installers) I'm a CI.

When you post a hardware list and ask hardware questions, you've come to the right place. You'll get a bunch of opinions, some excellent, many half-baked. If you really want to install and support your own hardware you can have a lot of fun picking and installing the gear. But, the downside of you installing your own system is that you likely don't have enough experience to make it a highly reliable easy to use system. You'll be the person your wife calls to say the screen is blank, or that she hears the I-Pod but sees a DVD. Do you want to handle those calls, or have someone else take care of that for you?

If you and your family really want that aforementioned turnkey system, think about looking at that custom installer or others in your area. I know of at least one (not the one you mentioned) that is highly regarded. I don't know anything about the one you have there.

It sounds like you have questions about the credibility of your salesperson. Have you checked the credentials of the company as a whole? Do they satisfy their customers, and keep them for the long term? Do they support their work after the fact, and cover it under a warranty agreement for a period of time after the install is complete? If you want to do business with a CI you need to do your due diligence.

I'll be watching this thread with great interest...

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Laserfan

· #13 · Jan 20, 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by buckswope /forum/post/12875885

If you and your family really want that aforementioned turnkey system, think about looking at that custom installer or others in your area.

A very smart home builder I know invited me to a party last year and I noticed his fancy-schmanzy surround-sound big-screen home theater system was gone, and all he had left was a (yeah still a big screen) TV and DVD player, that's all. When I asked him "what happened" he said he was tired of having people over and then having to call someone because a setting had been messed-with and he didn't know how to fix it himself.

Point is: if you aren't comfy with the technology and can't (or don't want to) learn it, a turnkey system from a here-today-here-tomorrow CI could well be worth it.

It's amazing how many people I have met who've told me about their systems that don't work, because some cable got unplugged or some button got pushed and they don't know where it is or how to fix it. It's broke, and they just learn to live with it cuz they have no one to call...

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bigpapa

· #14 · Jan 20, 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich /forum/post/12875840

Ther is so much bad advice posted here its scary.

That's absolutely right.

$12,700 installed and supported for a turnkey solution and properly set up remote is a deal.

Or spend hours and hours getting advice from Exhuberant Monkeys and DIYing it, having your wife frustrated at you, only to save $2K and have the system perform marginally. Either choice encompasses risk, but which choice increases odds of satisfaction?

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briremo

· #15 · Jan 20, 2008

"don't try this at home" comes to mind.

a cat 5 balun/hdmi is much smarter than a $50 hdmi cable, what happens when the POS hdmi fails to pass the latest version? you're stuck.

If you take on the repsonsibility of all the gear, expect some problems, I've seen it a million times. You have a great price, it meet your budget, you're going to save at best $600 and you'll cause yourself more aggravation than it'll be worth.

stonedr

· #16 · Jan 20, 2008

I am an enthusist. I help my friends get their systems working. It can be very intimidating for the novice to get everything working. I suggest the one stop shop but would agree to try for the vw-60. I am sure you could save money but it may require a good friend's help. I did it myself but this is my hobby.

lowvoltguy

· #17 · Jan 20, 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by aachrisg /forum/post/12874737

I'd find a contractor who isn't looking to make their money off of equipment markup, and buy the equipment yourself off the internet. They don't need to know anything special about home theater as long as they know how to fish wires and mount something to the ceiling and you know enough/get enough good advice to tell them what wires to fish.

This is absolutely the WORST piece of advice I've ever heard ... If you disagree with me, then you are too stupid for me to explain to you why this is HORRIBLE advice ...

Snappy

· #18 · Jan 21, 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowvoltguy /forum/post/12878092

This is absolutely the WORST piece of advice I've ever heard ... If you disagree with me, then you are too stupid for me to explain to you why this is HORRIBLE advice ...

true.........

who was it that dragged us over here again?

The what was it 12K turn key for that system.... pretty darn good deal if you ask me.

Who was the idiot that was talking about a cheap HDMI cable? That was some pretty silly advice as well......

"The bitterness of poor quality last longer than the joy of low prices....."

Have at it man....

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Cameron

· #19 · Jan 21, 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowvoltguy /forum/post/12878092

This is absolutely the WORST piece of advice I've ever heard ... If you disagree with me, then you are too stupid for me to explain to you why this is HORRIBLE advice ...

You must have read the book: "How to win friends and influence people"

I also see that you have mastered the principles in: "How to disagree without being disagreable"

Good job.

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df4801

· #20 · Jan 21, 2008

Quote:
This is absolutely the WORST piece of advice I've ever heard ... If you disagree with me, then you are too stupid for me to explain to you why this is HORRIBLE advice ...

Why?

I actually recommend doing just that.

After receiving 3 quotes from installers for a "complete" package, I then did my own research.

I ended up buying far superior components myself and paid an installer just to install. I have never had one issue with anything in over 2 years. And by the way, even though I bought superior products over what was "recommended", I saved approx $5K.

Anyone else notice how all the installers say "you should buy the whole package from an installer"

Another question, if this original installer is so good, why would he recommend the inferior VW50 instead of the newer, better 60??? Could it be he has some left over inventory he needs to dump? Naaahhhh, he probably just really believes that the 50 is a better product.

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