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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So before any arguing starts
, let's start this thread off right by saying that both PSA and HSU has a VERY good reputation here (among other boards) for product quality and customer service. At this point in time, it's nit picking at details.


So the PSA XV15 vs HSU VTF-3 MK4 are similarly priced (less than $50 difference and that includes shipping fees).


1. Has anyone tested both and have comparison comments?


2. Based on publicly posted info (charts etc...), can anyone hazard a guess as to how these subs compare? Extension, SPL etc...


It's almost time to make a purchase and I need some help here. Any info would be greatly appreciated.
 

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I think you could use data-bass.com's measurements of the Outlaw LFM-1 EX to get a rough idea of how the VTF3 would compare to the XV15. The VTF3 and LFM-1 EX have a lot in common, however the VTF3 has a bit better deep bass performance due to its larger ports. The XV15 has an advantage, but not a big one, and it depends on what mode you run the LFM in. For instance, if you run the LFM in max extension mode, it basically equals the XV15's deep bass performance, but the XV15 has a bit more output from 30 to 50 hz, topping out with a 4 dB lead at 50 hz. If you run the LFM with two ports open, it mostly erases that mid bass advantage, but gives up a lot of 16 hz output. To sum it up, the XV15 can match the LFM's output in either mode. The VTF3 ought to perform similarly, but perhaps with slightly superior deep bass output than either, and given its cone diameter vs port diameter, I would guess it's less at risk of chuffing than either at high volume playback as well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23196513


I think you could use data-bass.com's measurements of the Outlaw LFM-1 EX to get a rough idea of how the VTF3 would compare to the XV15. The VTF3 and LFM-1 EX have a lot in common, however the VTF3 has a bit better deep bass performance due to its larger ports. The XV15 has an advantage, but not a big one, and it depends on what mode you run the LFM in. For instance, if you run the LFM in max extension mode, it basically equals the XV15's deep bass performance, but the XV15 has a bit more output from 30 to 50 hz, topping out with a 4 dB lead at 50 hz. If you run the LFM with two ports open, it mostly erases that mid bass advantage, but gives up a lot of 16 hz output. To sum it up, the XV15 can match the LFM's output in either mode. The VTF3 ought to perform similarly, but perhaps with slightly superior deep bass output than either, and given its cone diameter vs port diameter, I would guess it's less at risk of chuffing than either at high volume playback as well.

Hey great insight. I knew I would be able to get some useful info from this thread. At this point, the HSU may give better tweaking (ports) while the XV15 may have a slight advanatge on SPL. Would that be fair to say?


Add on: I cannot assume my room will add any benefit bass extensions. If this is so, wouldn't the HSU dig deeper than the XV15? Not sure I got this right so had to ask.


HOLD THE PHONE: Just noticed the LFM-1 EX is $629 shipped right now. That is $150-$170 cheaper in price than the PSA or HSU. Pretty sure no other sub for $629 can come close to the LFM-1 EX?


Any more insight?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bowmah  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23196530


At this point, the HSU may give better tweaking (ports) while the XV15 may have a slight advanatge on SPL. Would that be fair to say?
I think so, yes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowmah  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23196530


Add on: I cannot assume my room will add any benefit bass extensions. If this is so, wouldn't the HSU dig deeper than the XV15? Not sure I got this right so had to ask.
They both have the same tuning point, I don't think the VTF3 would dig deeper. I think there's a possibility it could play the deep frequencies cleaner, but that is speculation on my part.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowmah  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23196530


HOLD THE PHONE: Just noticed the LFM-1 EX is $629 shipped right now. That is $150-$170 cheaper in price than the PSA or HSU. Pretty sure no other sub for $629 can come close to the LFM-1 EX?
Correct.
 

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Keep in mind that when the measurements for the XV15 we taken that Josh made a comment in the Audioholics actual thread from the review that he didn't really have time to take the base plate off, turn the XV15 on its side and fire the sub directly at the mic. He makes mention that if he had done this the numbers across the board for the XV15 would have been 1 to 1.5dB higher. So for example at 25hz that would give the XV15 almost 3db advantage over the LFM-1 EX when factoring that in.
 

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I've owned both (well the VTF3 MK3) and in comparison, I would say 1 XV-15 would extend a little deeper than a VTF3/3.

Also has cleaner output do to one 4" port. But....the HSU would have more output due to the two 4" ports on the back,

if left open. Just my experience.


But I have a lot of respect for the Outlaw, and do to final price, it would probably (at this time) be my choice. Is the sale on

with the free shipping? Never mind, I check that out by myself (of coarse).


You can plug one of the four inch ports on the HSU....so Shady, what do you think of the above?

(I know you are gonna chime in, and I respect your opinion).


vardo
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by vardo  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23197364


I've owned both (well the VTF3 MK3) and in comparison, I would say 1 XV-15 would extend a little deeper than a VTF3/3.

Also has cleaner output do to one 4" port. But....the HSU would have more output due to the two 4" ports on the back,

if left open. Just my experience.


But I have a lot of respect for the Outlaw, and do to final price, it would probably (at this time) be my choice. Is the sale on

with the free shipping? Never mind, I check that out by myself (of coarse).


You can plug one of the four inch ports on the HSU....so Shady, what do you think of the above?

(I know you are gonna chime in, and I respect your opinion).


vardo

1. So you have owned both the MK3 and XV15 and you are now moving to the Outlaw?


2. Outlaw page "$629 WITH FREE SHIPPING FOR A LIMITED TIME ONLY!"
 

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bowmah


No I'm not moving to the "Outlaw". I just think it's a very capable sub (from what I've read)...and had a free

shipping price, but don't know if that applies (has expired). That is what I'd get for the price if it

had free shipping. I donno, maybe that has expired, but apparantly not according to you. That's saving some pretty good cash for the OP.


I have 3 PSA XV-15's (currently) so of course I would recommend PSA over HSU. Fanboy

of PSA.....that's only natural. And I do think the PSA is a better sub. I've owned over 5 HSU

subs in the past, their subs are excellent, and customer service is great.


vardo
 

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I think ... you wont go wrong with any of the 3 choices so far. I went with HSU . Main reason was the lack of used units for sale. Didn't seem like many owners were willing to part with theirs', and even a check of 'completed sales', via FleaBay, showed they retained value very well. PSA is a newer company, although founded by 'industry greats', they don't have the 'time in business' or 'track record' of others, like HSU and Outlaw, or Rythmik, or SVS, for that matter, but that is not a slight on their current offerings, at all. Please don't take it as my being negative at all to any of them. I'm not.


You said it yourself in your 1st post... it's nit-picky for the last ounce of performance from either. I thought the same, so I looked at what I could find for sale used, and HSU came out on top in that category. there were none for sale. I gave that weight. Do your own research, and check the "I'll Demo My Subwoofer..." thread (in the stickies
) in case someone local can give you an audition.


everything I've posted is IMO, and of course, YMMV

Joseph
 

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For me it came down to the varible tuning on the HSU. You can get more or less boom depending on the tuning. You can get the tightest bass by running in a low 3.0 Q or looser bass (7.0 Q) great for body slam PUNCH like when watching wrestling "feel the ring ropes vibrate sensitivity"! Or you can choose the best of both worlds and go with a Q of 5.0.. Tight or loose...YOU choose!


I have the VTF-15 and it is really nice to have the flexibility of tuning a sub tight, medium tight or loose. I usually run mine 5.0 great for movies plenty of taticle feel and boom for movies...and i usually leave it their for music too (ROCK/TECNO) unless i listen to classical and then i plug one port and run 3.0 Q for a quieter tighter bass.


Oh yes, correct me if i am wrong..the new VTF MK4 can also do two sealed ports just like the VTF-15...so you can also choose a sealed sub option!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by matrixj3  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23197855


For me it came down to the varible tuning on the HSU. You can get more or less boom depending on the tuning. You can get the tightest bass by running in a low 3.0 Q or looser bass (7.0 Q) great for body slam PUNCH like when watching wrestling "feel the ring ropes vibrate sensitivity"! Or you can choose the best of both worlds and go with a Q of 5.0.. Tight or loose...YOU choose!


I have the VTF-15 and it is really nice to have the flexibility of tuning a sub tight, medium tight or loose. I usually run mine 5.0 great for movies plenty of taticle feel and boom for movies...and i usually leave it their for music too (ROCK/TECNO) unless i listen to classical and then i plug one port and run 3.0 Q for a quieter tighter bass.


Oh yes, correct me if i am wrong..the new VTF MK4 can also do two sealed ports just like the VTF-15...so you can also choose a sealed sub option!

variable tuning is kind of a marketing thing if you ask me...you even proved that theroy by picking a general setting of 5.0 and leaving it there for all types of content. the psa xv15 is already balanced for music and movies, i see no reason to change

how its tuned for different content. its tight, rolls off quick, and has deep extension. also no 12" sub will ever sound like a 15", there is no replacement for displacement...thats why alot of guys with big home theatre rooms are using multiple 15"- 18" drivers.



I will say the lfm1-ex is a smoking deal at 629.00 shipped but its not going to perform like a 15", it might be close, but close never won any races.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
ok, let me put in my thoughts on the 3dB difference issue. 10 dB is twice as loud volume wise. 3dB is roughly 1.23 times as loud. But in the real world, would / should the XV15 be "taken apart" and fired sideways like the HSU? I am asking a genuine question. If not, then the 3dB really only mean 1.5-2 dB difference. If so, then we should also talk about this.


Besides from the HSU vs PSA sub, are we all in agreement that the Outlaw LFM-1 EX at $629 shipped blows the doors out of any sub out there that is =
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bowmah  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23198190


ok, let me put in my thoughts on the 3dB difference issue. 10 dB is twice as loud volume wise. 3dB is roughly 1.23 times as loud. But in the real world, would / should the XV15 be "taken apart" and fired sideways like the HSU? I am asking a genuine question. If not, then the 3dB really only mean 1.5-2 dB difference. If so, then we should also talk about this.


Besides from the HSU vs PSA sub, are we all in agreement that the Outlaw LFM-1 EX at $629 shipped blows the doors out of any sub out there that is =


with bass and subwoofers 5-6db is twice as loud, so 3db is a noticeable difference. thats why its nice to have measuring equipment...the other day when i was using my spl meter walking around my room with heavy bass content playing, any place that had a 3db gain was very noticeable acording to my ears. im not knocking the outlaw i almost went with 2 of them but i knew they would not sound like 15's. in car audio or home audio 12" woofers dont sound as deep as a 15". even if they have comparable spl...



again i am not disputing the outlaw being a great sub...its a beast for 629.00 shipped.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bowmah  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23198190


ok, let me put in my thoughts on the 3dB difference issue. 10 dB is twice as loud volume wise. 3dB is roughly 1.23 times as loud. But in the real world, would / should the XV15 be "taken apart" and fired sideways like the HSU? I am asking a genuine question. If not, then the 3dB really only mean 1.5-2 dB difference. If so, then we should also talk about this.


Besides from the HSU vs PSA sub, are we all in agreement that the Outlaw LFM-1 EX at $629 shipped blows the doors out of any sub out there that is =


The reason I made the comment about the sub not being tested with the bottom plate taken off was because the Outlaw sub was tested on its side with the sub firing towards to mic. So in the real world with both subs firing downwards the XV15 would still have a 3db advantage. 3dB is still a good amount of an output advantage. To put that into perspective if you were running dual subs one in each front corner of your room you only gain 4dB overall.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15  /t/1467970/honest-discussion-psa-xv15-vs-hsu-vtf-3-mk4#post_23198208


The reason I made the comment about the sub not being tested with the bottom plate taken off was because the Outlaw sub was tested on its side with the sub firing towards to mic. So in the real world with both subs firing downwards the XV15 would still have a 3db advantage. 3dB is still a good amount of an output advantage. To put that into perspective if you were running dual subs one in each front corner of your room you only gain 4dB overall.

thats another reason why you can not put 100% stock in measurements posted...why would one test the outlaw on its side with the driver firing into the mic, then test the xv15 normally and actually post the results??
 
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