AVS Forum banner
1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So, just got the 85" Samsung QN90A... wow.

After the wow comes the head scratcher. It has 1 HDMI 2.1 port that is NOT eArc and it is port 4. The eArc port (HDMI 2.0) is port 3.

3157874


Now, my Onkyo NR646 ... works with the eArc fine (mostly). It's finicky but I think this is just early implementation and Samsung's CEC dicking with things.

What do I do when I upgrade to a receiver that supports 2.1 (assuming a bug free receiver is released that doesn't cost 2 arms and a leg)? If I connect to the port 1 HDMI 2.1 ... now, how do I do the eARC? The TV has the optical but that doesn't have the bandwidth for TrueHD. Atmos needs a lot of bandwidth... as I already discovered that underspec HDMI cables introduce dropouts and crackling.

Can the eArc port be connected to one of the receiver IN ports so when running apps on the TV, the sound still goes through the amp? The onkyo has a SUB port without eArc support... which I ==assume== mirrors the signal... so could the equivalent be hooked to the hdmi 2.1?

Musical instrument Musical instrument accessory Electronic instrument Audio equipment Font


The TV is so heavy and the gear tough to move around so that experimenting is tough... has anyone hit this problem? I can't be the only person this 1 port Samsung is causing issues. It doesn't make sense to bypass the receiver. I have cut the cable, and use YouTube TV with a home theatre PC that is capable of doing movies and gaming. It makes no sense to add extra latency by looping through the TV first.

Or is this what the MFG intended?

I thought this would be worthy of discussion in terms of hook up strategies in regard to eArc and VRR and such.

Thanks for any insight you have.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,294 Posts
Seems you are better off not upgrading Receiver and just running a HDMI 2.1 device directly to the TV and using eARC for sound. If get multiple 2.1 devices may need to get a 2.1 HDMI switching device.

My 900H the eARC port is also 2.1 capable (even though 2.1 is not perfect on it), odd of Samsung to do it that way.

Otherwise will need to find a Receiver that has a Dual output that has a 2.1 output and an eARC port.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,920 Posts
So, just got the 85" Samsung QN90A.
It has 1 HDMI 2.1 port that is NOT eArc and it is port 4. The eArc port (HDMI 2.0) is port 3.

What do I do when I upgrade to a receiver that supports 2.1? If I connect to the port 1 HDMI 2.1 ... now, how do I do the eARC?
Can the eArc port be connected to one of the receiver IN ports so when running apps on the TV, the sound still goes through the amp?
For eARC to work, you need to use an HDMI cable that runs from the receiver's eARC-supported HDMI Output to the display's eARC-supported HDMI input. So no, connecting to the receiver's HDMI input will not work.
When you upgrade your receiver, can't you simply run everything through the receiver, and then connect the receiver's HDMI output to the 2.1 HDMI input of the display? That includes streaming from an external device connected to the receiver instead of the display's internal apps. Then you don't need to use eARC at all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15 Posts
For eARC to work, you need to use an HDMI cable that runs from the receiver's eARC-supported HDMI Output to the display's eARC-supported HDMI input. So no, connecting to the receiver's HDMI input will not work.
When you upgrade your receiver, can't you simply run everything through the receiver, and then connect the receiver's HDMI output to the 2.1 HDMI input of the display? That includes streaming from an external device connected to the receiver instead of the display's internal apps. Then you don't need to use eARC at all.
Will this even work though? I have a PS5 and Xbox X and am struggling with picking a new TV for my new house. The decision to have 1 HDMI 2.1 port that isn't the eARC port is strange to me. If I plug both into a receiver and then output to the 2.1 port on this TV would that allow me to have all the 2.1 features, and sound run from the receiver?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,348 Posts
The eARC port should not be the 2.1 port of it's a waste of an HDMI 2.1 port. Hook your xbox or ps5 to the HDMI 2.1 port. The receiver goes into the eARC port.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
The eARC port should not be the 2.1 port of it's a waste of an HDMI 2.1 port. Hook your xbox or ps5 to the HDMI 2.1 port. The receiver goes into the eARC port.
I do not believe this to be true.

Reading this thread I am now worried that the OP has identified a critical flaw in the QN90A, I ordered one online today and was reading here to do some "due diligence" on my purchase.

My understanding of the issue.

If the eARC port on the TV is HDMI 2.1 then your receiver can be used as a port multiplier, because the eARC port is bi-directional. This is exactly what I was planning to do. My plan for the TV was:
  1. TV based 4K apps like Netflix, Prime Disney Plus etc. eARC out to receiver. (this will work normally)
  2. Multiple HDMI 2.1 devices into receiver, PC with 3080, X box X and a PS5 Plus AND
  3. some HDMI 2.0 devices Cable box and 4K blueray
    1. Herein lies the problem, the 2.1 devices will not pass through the TV's eARC port, so no 120 Hz video.
  4. BUT, if I output the receiver into the HDMI 2.1 port I cannot get audio return from the TV for the apps and tuner.
It seems the only possible work around is to output the receiver to the 2.1 port, then label one of the receiver inputs as "TV" then connecting the TV eARC port to that receiver input for TV apps and the tuner. Sounds very crude for a multi thousand dollar set up, I would be worried about latency and other problems too.


So the HDMI eARC port as 2.1 is definitely not a waste.

AND I may just cancel my Samsung order.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Most receivers have multiple hdmi out ports nowadays. With the QN90A having port 3 = hdmi 2.0 + eARC, port 4 = hdmi 2.1, things may still work out fine, given that:
  1. Receiver's hdmi out port 1 (eARC) connects to QN90A's port 3, so everything on TV will play sound through receiver.
  2. Receiver's hdmi out port 2 (hdmi 2.1) connects to QN90A's port 4, so hdmi 2.1 devices passing through the receiver will get 4k 120Hz HDR / VRR signal displayed by the TV.
  3. Receiver's got enough hdmi 2.1 in ports for your devices.
That's my speculation anyway. I've heard people saying this won't work due to that when the receiver functions on both output ports, it's usually in "Mirroring" out mode, which means that the two receiving ends must be able to support the same video format, and with the QN90A's port 3 and 4 made differently, the receiver may fallback to the slower port's limit.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Thanks for the reply, at least we know what questions to ask.
It seems like a big pain when there are other TV's out there that do it directly.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,038 Posts
For now leave the game console hooked to HDMI input 4 and hook your receiver to HDMI port 3.

When the time comes to get a 2.1 receiver disconnect the game console from port 4 and hook the new receiver to that. Run your physical devices through your new receiver. At that time also get an eARC converter like a SHARC or HDFury device and connect that to port 3. From there run the eARC converter into a standard HDMI port on the receiver. This should solve the dilemma.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
@Nillaz, sorry bud but you did not read the problem. The eARC port 3 on the TV is an HDMI 2.0 port so the eARC input will not accept 8K60Hz or 4K120Hz video streams. THAT is the problem we are trying to work around.

The Device on the 2.1 port 4 is a PC (RTX 3080) that supports full bandwidth HDMI 2.1 and is not a console. I can play games @ 4K 144 Hz 10 bit on my monitor, I want to get a close as possible on the TV for an even more immersive experience. Most consoles still struggle to get > 90 fps at full 4k.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,038 Posts
@Nillaz, sorry bud but you did not read the problem. The eARC port 3 on the TV is an HDMI 2.0 port so the eARC input will not accept 8K60Hz or 4K120Hz video streams. THAT is the problem we are trying to work around.

The Device on the 2.1 port 4 is a PC (RTX 3080) that supports full bandwidth HDMI 2.1 and is not a console. I can play games @ 4K 144 Hz 10 bit on my monitor, I want to get a close as possible on the TV for an even more immersive experience. Most consoles still struggle to get > 90 fps at full 4k.
I'm not trying to be rude, but I did read the question and I understand the problem completely. You have partially failed to understand the solution (not completely....you were on the right track with your workaround in post #7). Please reread it, I promise you it is the correct answer.

Whether it's a game console or PC is irrelevant, they are both full bandwidth HDMI 2.1 devices. The receiver MUST be connected to HDMI 4 in order to leverage 40Gbps with HDMI 2.1 devices running through it. Alternatively you could use an HDMI 2.1 switch. Currently the only one I am aware of is limited to 2 ports and requires manual switching. More automated solutions with more ports will become available eventually (the HDFury VRRoom for example will solve for this later this year), but for now it is what it is.

If you need further clarification I am happy to answer any questions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
@Nillaz It is clear to me I can use your approach, whilst foregoing the smart TV features of the QN90A.

The missing link is I want to use the TV for APPS like Netflix, Prime Video, Disney Plus etc. For these to work, they need to return audio through the eARC port into the receiver. I am getting older and intolerant of excessive remotes. Hence the need to connect the eARC port on the TV to an eARC port on the receiver and creating a potential loop.

This issue is also becoming mute, since the Samsung apps seem to be deficient in audio processing (drop outs, sequencing issues and formats), Samsung may just not be the TV vendor for me. I might return the set and move to the SONY, giving up some brightness but gaining audio seems a fair trade now.

P.S. Though the consoles declare to be full bandwidth devices (HDMI 2.1 interface) the GPUs in them cannot generate it. Unlike PCs they need to degenerate the image substantially to create the frame rates.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,038 Posts
@Nillaz It is clear to me I can use your approach, whilst foregoing the smart TV features of the QN90A.

The missing link is I want to use the TV for APPS like Netflix, Prime Video, Disney Plus etc. For these to work, they need to return audio through the eARC port into the receiver. I am getting older and intolerant of excessive remotes. Hence the need to connect the eARC port on the TV to an eARC port on the receiver and creating a potential loop.

This issue is also becoming mute, since the Samsung apps seem to be deficient in audio processing (drop outs, sequencing issues and formats), Samsung may just not be the TV vendor for me. I might return the set and move to the SONY, giving up some brightness but gaining audio seems a fair trade now.

P.S. Though the consoles declare to be full bandwidth devices (HDMI 2.1 interface) the GPUs in them cannot generate it. Unlike PCs they need to degenerate the image substantially to create the frame rates.
The purpose of the eARC converter is to allow the use of the the tv's tuner and apps while retaining full audio capabilities. All we are doing here is rerouting the audio from the tv's eARC connection to a standard HDMI input on the receiver. The difference is that the input on the receiver needs to be set to the appropriate HDMI input when using the tv tuner or apps, the same as with any other device connected to the receiver.

I wasn't suggesting that the 3080 and the new game consoles are equal. I have them all and I'm well acquainted with their capabilities. They're certainly not equivalent, but from the perpective of the tv and receiver they're using the same interface and are handled the same way.

I'm also not suggesting that you should keep the QN90A. By all means use whatever display you prefer. I was simply providing the solution to the question originally posed by the OP. I would point out however that by switching to a Sony you are simply trading a gimped eARC setup for a gimped gaming setup, at least for the time being. You're damned if you do, damned if you don't.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
lol, yes
I finally got around to hooking up the PC and I was very pleased with it.
I found the audio issue with Apple TV is the Samsung App, Apple Tv via a Fire TV box worked fine.
I also checked out the VRRoom and based on the literature it does solve the multi-device problem @ 10% if the cost of the darn TV

So I am left with ..
Samsung
  • I like the picture, the gaming interface
  • borked audio
Sony
  • Hopefully improved audio
  • Dolby Vision
  • borked gaming, not quite as good picture
<sigh>
Thanks for the help
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
@Nillaz I have decided to follow your advice and ordered an HDFury VRRoom to act as a HDMI 2.1 switch. I also like that it can provide Disney Video signals to the Samsung.

The audio problems I had with the eARC port on the TV were generated by an incompatibly between the TV and my LG RG11 sound bar. I purchased a Samsung HW-950A sound bar and it works flawlessly with the TV.

Thanks for your patience and advice.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,038 Posts
@Nillaz I have decided to follow your advice and ordered an HDFury VRRoom to act as a HDMI 2.1 switch. I also like that it can provide Disney Video signals to the Samsung.

The audio problems I had with the eARC port on the TV were generated by an incompatibly between the TV and my LG RG11 sound bar. I purchased a Samsung HW-950A sound bar and it works flawlessly with the TV.

Thanks for your patience and advice.
Always happy to help. Glad things are working out!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
166 Posts
Always happy to help. Glad things are working out!
@Nillaz I'm basically on the same boat as original poster. I have a 75" Samsung Q80T eARC and a Denon x4300h ARC (not eARC). Just bought the new Xbox Series X and I'm getting the awful Atmos audio Lip/Sync issue when connected as: Xbox Series X > Q80T (HDMI-4 4k/120hz/vrr) > x4300 (via ARC). I was contemplating buying the new x6700h with the fixed board, but apparently there are still some audio issues with 4k/120hz/vrr and eARC.

I'm trying to understand how those HDFury/VRRoom & ThenAudio/Zone-2 could be used as a workaround with my setup. Can I use any of those devices to split the Xbox Series X HDMI output into: 4k/120hz/vrr video > Q80T HDMI-4 Tv input & Bitstream audio to AVR? or Are these devices supposed to be the middle man between the eARC Tv input > Receiver ARC output?

I'm still considering the x6700h (currently out of stock) to fix this eARC issue, have HDR10+ pass-through, dialog enhancer; and 2 more CH for future expansion to 7.2.4. But maybe I can use this workaround and wait until those 4k/eARC issues are fully solved on future generations (ie x6800h/x6900h). Also AVR prices should normalize by then.

Thanks!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,038 Posts
@Nillaz I'm basically on the same boat as original poster. I have a 75" Samsung Q80T eARC and a Denon x4300h ARC (not eARC). Just bought the new Xbox Series X and I'm getting the awful Atmos audio Lip/Sync issue when connected as: Xbox Series X > Q80T (HDMI-4 4k/120hz/vrr) > x4300 (via ARC). I was contemplating buying the new x6700h with the fixed board, but apparently there are still some audio issues with 4k/120hz/vrr and eARC.

I'm trying to understand how those HDFury/VRRoom & ThenAudio/Zone-2 could be used as a workaround with my setup. Can I use any of those devices to split the Xbox Series X HDMI output into: 4k/120hz/vrr video > Q80T HDMI-4 Tv input & Bitstream audio to AVR? or Are these devices supposed to be the middle man between the eARC Tv input > Receiver ARC output?

I'm still considering the x6700h (currently out of stock) to fix this eARC issue, have HDR10+ pass-through, dialog enhancer; and 2 more CH for future expansion to 7.2.4. But maybe I can use this workaround and wait until those 4k/eARC issues are fully solved on future generations (ie x6800h/x6900h). Also AVR prices should normalize by then.

Thanks!
The 6700h is super flakey with the Xbox on Samsung TV's even with the fixed board. I hate my 6700h because of this. It works reasonably well with my OLED though.

The SHARC makes things better because the TV always "sees" it regardless of whether the receiver is turned on or off, which solves for the tv losing the eARC connection and reverting to the tv speakers and stereo. Keep in mind it's still limited to the audio formats the tv natively supports, so things like DTS:X (which I rather like for gaming on Xbox) are no bueno.

The VRROOM is most likely going to be the optimal solution as it bypasses eARC entirely. You would run the Xbox directly into the VRROOM (as well as any other HDMI 2.1 devices) and then you run separate HDMI cables for audio and video....one directly to any receiver HDMI input for audio, and one to the HDMI 2.1 connection on the TV for video. This method will get you the full experience regardless of whatever audio or video formats you choose.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
166 Posts
The VRROOM is most likely going to be the optimal solution as it bypasses eARC entirely. You would run the Xbox directly into the VRROOM (as well as any other HDMI 2.1 devices) and then you run separate HDMI cables for audio and video....one directly to any receiver HDMI input for audio, and one to the HDMI 2.1 connection on the TV for video. This method will get you the full experience regardless of whatever audio or video formats you choose.
Thank you very much for your input! Just noticed the VRROOM unit is still on pre-order with shipping starting around December 1, 2021. :cry:

The 6700h is super flakey with the Xbox on Samsung TV's even with the fixed board. I hate my 6700h because of this. It works reasonably well with my OLED though.
If the x6700h with the fixed board does not completely solve the problem then I'll wait and save the money for the next model/upgrade. Although I'd love to have the feature of pass-through HDR10+ from my OPPO 203 to the Samsung on the x6700h. Maybe the VRROOM could also be used for this as apparently there are 4 HDMI inputs.

The SHARC makes things better because the TV always "sees" it regardless of whether the receiver is turned on or off, which solves for the tv losing the eARC connection and reverting to the tv speakers and stereo. Keep in mind it's still limited to the audio formats the tv natively supports, so things like DTS:X (which I rather like for gaming on Xbox) are no bueno.
I'll search a little more about this SHARC as it's looking to be the only available solution right now. I suppose this goes between the TV eARC (HDMI-3) and the receiver, Right? But not having DTS:X, no bueno, in my book also.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nillaz

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,038 Posts
Thank you very much for your input! Just noticed the VRROOM unit is still on pre-order with shipping starting around December 1, 2021. :cry:



If the x6700h with the fixed board does not completely solve the problem then I'll wait and save the money for the next model/upgrade. Although I'd love to have the feature of pass-through HDR10+ from my OPPO 203 to the Samsung on the x6700h. Maybe the VRROOM could also be used for this as apparently there are 4 HDMI inputs.



I'll search a little more about this SHARC as it's looking to be the only available solution right now. I suppose this goes between the TV eARC (HDMI-3) and the receiver, Right? But not having DTS:X, no bueno, in my book also.
I know it's a bummer about the shipping date of the VRROOM. I proactively ordered one for myself back in May. It's getting close though! If you decide to order one I'd recommend doing it sooner rather than later. The next time HDFury updates the page the price is going to go up again.

In fairness, aside from the issues with the Xbox the 6700h is a great receiver. I'm just salty because gaming on the Xbox is a major use case for me and this is just completely broken with Samsung tv's. I hope they can fix this nonsense via firmware but I'm not holding my breath at this point. HDR10+ works perfectly on my Panny 820 going through the receiver, along with every other device and format I throw at it.

The SHARC does go between the tv and receiver, but knowing that you want DTS capabilities I would advise you to skip it. The price has gone up since I purchased mine (hasn't everything?) and at almost half the cost of the VRROOM it's value proposition has been reduced significantly.
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
Top