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How do you get white to be "white" and not "eggshell"?

1029 Views 20 Replies 12 Participants Last post by gn2, Oct 26, 2004

CZ Eddie

Discussion Starter · Oct 25, 2004

On my Marquee, I used the etechvideo.com grayscale setup procedure and my figures are:

red - 35/62

green - 90/64

blue - 50/62

I'm very happy with blacks and shadow detail, as compared to my 15" CRT monitor. Even white level appears the same as on my 15" monitor.

The only thing I'm not happy with is the color of white. It's sort of an "egshell white" rather than white-white like on my 15" monitor.

33/77 is how my contrast/brightness is setup.

Now I understand that white will never be "true white" and blacks will never be "shiny black" like the 15" monitor, but I just don't like the drab white. So without color calibration equipment, what is the best way to get my whites to appear more white in color?

Thanks!

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1 - 20 of 21 Posts

Don Rombach

· #2 · Oct 25, 2004

Mo blue.

kschmit2

· #3 · Oct 25, 2004

Actually when you set up your PJ to 6500K, whites will have some sort of a yellowish touch.

CZ Eddie

Discussion Starter · #4 · Oct 25, 2004

Thanks. I had added more blue already and it doesn't start to resemble white until you get to a drive setting of 90. Even then, it's still not there.

I don't remembe my Marquee 8000 being this off-white, but then I never compared it to my 15" monitor. That was a mistake.

Btw, my screen is plain blackout cloth. An upgrade is due, eventually.

stefuel

· #5 · Oct 25, 2004

Check the condition of the coupling fluid. Assuming the tubes have no apparent wear patterns, tube faces should be white. Best viewed with the lenses off but can be seen with lenses on. Old yellowed fluid will throw off perfect whites as will worn tubes. I have a slight wear pattern on my p19 green tube that I did not think was that bad. I guess the nature of the LC beast shows off more imperfections than it's air coupled brothers.

Chip

Curt Palme

· #6 · Oct 25, 2004

If you have high hours on the chassis, then it's possible that one or more tubes are starting to lose light output. I had a relatively high hour 8500 here on the weekend from a customer that had a dead green tube, and he supplied a new one that I installed. the color tracking ended up being off, with the red having maybe 15% (I'm guessing) less light output than the G and B, and it seemed that the green had a bit over the blue as well. (duh, it was NEW!)

The end result was some juggling of the white balance numbers. It wasn't bad, but not as good as if all three tubes had been replaced.

Curt

Tim in Phoenix

· #7 · Oct 25, 2004

Eddie

The procedures I have detailed in Gray Scale Setup are for brightness and contrast to be set to 50/50 and left there; do not hike brightness to 77, leave it at 50 and raise G2s a bit if needed; the dynamic range you want will be preserved better. Vary the contrast from 50 if needed but leave brightness near 50.

wm

· #8 · Oct 25, 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by CZ Eddie
The only thing I'm not happy with is the color of white. It's sort of an "egshell white" rather than white-white like on my 15" monitor.

Eddie,

Chances are your 15" monitor has a very blue white, 9500K or higher. So part of your problem may be using that as a reference. D65 white looks much "yellower" in comparison.

William

CZ Eddie

Discussion Starter · #9 · Oct 25, 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by tim
Eddie

The procedures I have detailed in Gray Scale Setup are for brightness and contrast to be set to 50/50 and left there; do not hike brightness to 77, leave it at 50 and raise G2s a bit if needed; the dynamic range you want will be preserved better. Vary the contrast from 50 if needed but leave brightness near 50.

I see. Though it has no effect on the color of white, I was adjusting the contrast/brightness to 50/50 per your site recommendations, then adjusted the G2 (and drive for blue). I then used my DVE disc to adjust the contrast/brightness and in the end, used the Nokia Monitor Test application's staircase pattern to get brightness and contrast set. The result is pretty decent.

Tube hours are low at 900, but may have high standby hours (not sure of this).

Glycol is new in red/green and "looks okay" on the blue.

Thanks all!

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B.Hegelstad

· #10 · Oct 25, 2004

Calibrate the gray scale with a color analyzer is the only way to get it right

dokworm

· #11 · Oct 25, 2004

How white is your screen?

CZ Eddie

Discussion Starter · #12 · Oct 25, 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by dokworm
How white is your screen?

plain old blackout cloth white. whiter than this egshell is.

What effect does adding red and green have? I know that adding blue gives a bright white (I can't get it right now) in general. I think red gives it more of a warm white? What does green do?

In regards to wm's comment, you are right that my 15" CRT monitor must have super-white because my 17" LCD monitor here at work does not even have the superwhite, though it is still a little whiter than the Marqee. It's more like the marqee with 90 drive for the blue.

Tim in Phoenix

· #13 · Oct 26, 2004

Eddie

Check the filament voltage as described in our Tech Tip for gray scale at the bottom, over 6.50vdc for long enough could have weakened the blue tube and/or all the tubes; filaments are fully lit in standby, unfortunately.

CZ Eddie

Discussion Starter · #14 · Oct 26, 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by tim
Eddie

Check the filament voltage as described in our Tech Tip for gray scale at the bottom, over 6.50vdc for long enough could have weakened the blue tube and/or all the tubes; filaments are fully lit in standby, unfortunately.

I bought a Radio Shack 15 Range Digital Multimeter tonight. I fried my last multimeter late last week. P14 checks in at a rock solid 6.35.

Held the pins for a good 30 seconds and it didn't waver from 6.35 at all.

Also adjusted greyscale to 50/50 contrast/brightness. Adjusted each G2 color to greyscale using NTEST test pattern. Then went back and adjusted contrast to greyscale. Currently set at 35/50 contrast/brightness. White still is eggshell. This isn't bad, I'm just being picky.

kschmit2

· #15 · Oct 26, 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by wm
Eddie,

Chances are your 15" monitor has a very blue white, 9500K or higher. So part of your problem may be using that as a reference. D65 white looks much "yellower" in comparison.

William

That is most likely spot on. Most monitors are set up at 9500K.

Kai

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RoBro

· #16 · Oct 26, 2004

Just tried on my monitor to switch from 9300 to 7500...

Ugh is that yellow!!!

Roland

CZ Eddie

Discussion Starter · #17 · Oct 26, 2004

Yep, the 15" monitor is definately whiter. Whats funny is some people jump on the marquee for having orange reds. Well my marquee with red-element is putting out a red that makes the 15" monitors red look orange. hahah

Guess the monitor can't have it all, huh.

Btw, I adjusted red G2 a little higher to compensate for dimmer output due to the c-element. Not by much though. And it actually made for a brighter eggshell, uh I mean white.

I also notice that whites are whiter at the top and center of my screen than the bottom of the screen. Possibly due to ceiling mount projector?

Clarence

· #18 · Oct 26, 2004

Eddie-

I found this color chart useful when comparing my projected image to monitors.

They sell a printed reference card, but it's $65.

-Clarence

kschmit2

· #19 · Oct 26, 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by CZ Eddie
I also notice that whites are whiter at the top and center of my screen than the bottom of the screen. Possibly due to ceiling mount projector?

That wouldn't be due to ceiling mounting, but rather due to an inappropriate screen.

Either you have too high a screen gain or you use a retro-reflective screen.

Kai

CZ Eddie

Discussion Starter · #20 · Oct 26, 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by kschmit2
That wouldn't be due to ceiling mounting, but rather due to an inappropriate screen.

Either you have too high a screen gain or you use a retro-reflective screen.

Kai

It's blackout cloth, about 1.0 gain I think.

Thanks for the link, Clarence! I'll put it up tonight. My 17" LCD at work doesn't give as white a white as my 15" CRT monitor at home does. Actually kinda yellowish.

1 - 20 of 21 Posts

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