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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I've been looking at changing to a CIH screen and I cringe at not being able to watch Avengers on my full sized 1.78:1 screen but I wondered how many of my 590 Blu Ray/DVD titles were actually in that ratio.


Well the short answer is 30. Yes 30! and around 10 of those were animated.


According to my DVD profiler, here's the break down on how many of my titles have which aspect ratio, (I didn't include TV series, kids movies except for major animated pictures, or 1.33:1)


1.66:1 - 1


1.75:1 - 1


1.78:1 - 30


1.85:1 - 92


"16x9" movies - 124 out of 453


2.20:1 - 1


2.35:1 - 174


2.39:1 - 9 (Mostly Disney)


2.40:1 - 143


2.55:1 - 2


"Scope" movies - 329 out of 453


This really is a no brainer!


If I had more blu ray titles there would probably be more 2.40:1 titles. Many of my duplicate titles are 2.35 on DVD and 2.40 on Blu Ray.


Here's my collection for anyone who wants see what type of movies are included, http://www.invelos.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Dragon's%20Lair
 

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Jump in. The water's warm.
 

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DVDProfiler's aspect ratio specs are submitted by users, and I'm sure that almost all of them are copied from the disc packaging. As far as that goes, the distinction between 2.35:1, 2.39:1 and 2.40:1 is unlikely to be very accurate. Countless Blu-rays and DVDs are mislabeled in that respect. You can lump these three numbers together into one "scope" category. ( More detailed explanation here .)


As for "1.78:1" or "16:9" movies, no feature films are actually produced at that ratio. The theatrical standard is 1.85:1. However, Warner Bros and Paramount open the mattes on all 1.85:1 movies to 1.78:1 for home video. Some of the smaller labels do this as well, though not always as consistently. Again, the specs on the packaging are often inaccurate.


Each year, about half the feature films made are photographed at 1.85:1 and half are 2.40:1. It's been that way for decades and shows no signs of changing. Which aspect ratio dominates your personal movie collection will depend on your taste in movies. If you favor big-budget, blockbuster type movies, more of those tend to be 2.40:1. If you favor comedies and indie dramas, those are frequently 1.85:1. These are not immutable rules, however. Exceptions exist for both types (e.g. The Avengers).
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24493634


DVDProfiler's aspect ratio specs are submitted by users, and I'm sure that almost all of them are copied from the disc packaging. As far as that goes, the distinction between 2.35:1, 2.39:1 and 2.40:1 is unlikely to be very accurate. Countless Blu-rays and DVDs are mislabeled in that respect. You can lump these three numbers together into one "scope" category. ( More detailed explanation here .)

Actually many DVD profiler contributions are made by inserting the disc as well, so a lot will have the actual encoded information from the disc listed. And yes they are still all user submitted so to be taken with a grain of salt for sure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24493634


As for "1.78:1" or "16:9" movies, no feature films are actually produced at that ratio. The theatrical standard is 1.85:1. However, Warner Bros and Paramount open the mattes on all 1.85:1 movies to 1.78:1 for home video. Some of the smaller labels do this as well, though not always as consistently. Again, the specs on the packaging are often inaccurate.

Strange why the majority of projector screens and all tv's are made for that ratio.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24493634


Each year, about half the feature films made are photographed at 1.85:1 and half are 2.40:1. It's been that way for decades and shows no signs of changing. Which aspect ratio dominates your personal movie collection will depend on your taste in movies. If you favor big-budget, blockbuster type movies, more of those tend to be 2.40:1. If you favor comedies and indie dramas, those are frequently 1.85:1. These are not immutable rules, however. Exceptions exist for both types (e.g. The Avengers).

Clearly my movie tastes are dominated by action, adventure, war, western, sci-fi, and epics etc. which is also reflected by my aspect numbers, but oddly my drama's and rom com's were nearly half and half 16:9 to scope.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24493820


Actually many DVD profiler contributions are made by inserting the disc as well, so a lot will have the actual encoded information from the disc listed. And yes they are still all user submitted so to be taken with a grain of salt for sure.

There are currently no aspect ratio flags for 2.35:1 on DVD or Blu-ray. The metadata on a disc will only tell you whether a DVD is encoded as 4:3, non-anamorphic letterbox, or anamorphic 16:9. Since all Blu-rays are encoded as 16:9, you won't even get that much info about the aspect ratio.
Quote:
Strange why the majority of projector screens and all tv's are made for that ratio.

16:9 was chosen as the HDTV standard because it's halfway between the narrowest common ratio (4:3) and the widest (2.35:1). The screen is 1.78:1 rather than 1.85:1

primarily for engineering reasons. You'll notice that 16:9 is a precise square of 4:3. The was important in the early days of HDTV, when most TVs were still CRT tubes.
Quote:
Clearly my movie tastes are dominated by action, adventure, war, western, sci-fi, and epics etc. which is also reflected by my aspect numbers, but oddly my drama's and rom com's were nearly half and half 16:9 to scope.

Not uncommon. Regardless, the overall number of movies made each year is approximately 50% 1.85:1 and 50% 2.35:1.
 

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While what Josh said is true (the overall number of movies made each year is approximately 50% 1.85:1 and 50% 2.35:1), it is also true that the vast majority of the most popular films are 2.35:1 / 2.40:1. Just check the list of the top grossing movies of all time. Out of 100 films, 76 are Scope. It's pretty consistent year to year in the box office results too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
All interesting stuff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24493634


As for "1.78:1" or "16:9" movies, no feature films are actually produced at that ratio..

With the exception of Avatar and Voyage of the Dawn Treader perhaps?


What's also interesting if you watch the Iron Man deleted scenes they're in 16:9 or 1.85 which would make you think that's how the whole movie was filmed and then cropped to scope?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24496725


All interesting stuff.

With the exception of Avatar and Voyage of the Dawn Treader perhaps?

The standards for theatrical projection are 1.85:1 and 2.40:1. Those are the ratios that filmmakers compose for.


Avatar was released to theaters in multiple aspect ratios, with instructions that it should be projected at whichever ratio would be largest on the screen. As far as I'm aware, Voyage of the Dawn Treader only played at 2.40:1 theatrically. The Blu-rays for both movies are open-matte transfers, exposing more picture information than was seen in theaters.
Quote:
What's also interesting if you watch the Iron Man deleted scenes they're in 16:9 or 1.85 which would make you think that's how the whole movie was filmed and then cropped to scope?

Iron Man and Iron Man 2 were photographed on Super 35 film with the intention that they be matted down to a final aspect ratio of 2.40:1. Iron Man 3 was shot digitally, but with the same intent for matting. The "OAR" for all three movies is 2.40:1.
 

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IMAX throws a wrench in the works. IMAX screens have their own proprietary aspect ratios. The old film-based IMAX theaters have a super-tall 1.43:1 ratio. These are being phased out. The newers digital IMAX screens are 1.9:1. Most Hollywood movies that play in IMAX theaters maintain their Original Aspect Ratio and are projected letterboxed onto the screens. However, a handful of movies such as Avatar and Life of Pi were released with specially modified copies to fill the IMAX screens. Then there are the few movies like The Dark Knight that incorporate IMAX footage and have variable aspect ratios.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24496797


The standards for theatrical projection are 1.85:1 and 2.40:1. Those are the ratios that filmmakers compose for.

Geez, not to get all particular and nitpicky and all, but you should probably amend that to say "Hollywood" or "Big Budget" filmmakers. Lots and lots of independent films these days are shot 16:9. Of course, many of them don't end up in theaters, they just end up on cable, Blu-ray, VOD, or DVD (if anywhere at all). When they do end up in theaters, they just get (very slightly) cropped.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
An interesting excerpt from blu-ray.com from a James Cameron interview on Avatar,


James Cameron informed that Avatar was being shot in "a 16:9 ratio." 3D theatrical exhibition would be in 1.78:1 in the theaters that could project it at that ratio; for 2D theatrical exhibition, a cinemascope-ratio (2.39:1) picture was being extracted from the 1.78:1 frame.


Cameron explained: "I actually think that the extra screen height really works well in 3D. It really pulls you through the screen. So I'm actually going back on years of kind of eschewing the kind of 1.85 format, now saying 1.85 – or actually, it's 1.78:1 – actually works really well in 3D. But only in 3D. I still like the scope ratio compositionally for flat projection."


Ultimately, 1.78:1 is also being used for the Blu-ray (which, at least in this edition, is only 2D). Note that, as the picture was originally shot in 1.78:1, no image information is being lost; on the contrary, the 1.78:1 frame shows more information on the top and bottom than the scope-ratioed image.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Schuermann  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24498471


Geez, not to get all particular and nitpicky and all, but you should probably amend that to say "Hollywood" or "Big Budget" filmmakers. Lots and lots of independent films these days are shot 16:9. Of course, many of them don't end up in theaters, they just end up on cable, Blu-ray, VOD, or DVD (if anywhere at all). When they do end up in theaters, they just get (very slightly) cropped.

I did say that those were the standards for theatrical projection.



I'm sure that most of those indie filmmakers compose for 1.85:1 in the hopes (however futile) of getting a theatrical release. The difference beween 1.85:1 and 1.78:1 is so small that it doesn't really matter anyway.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24498544


An interesting excerpt from blu-ray.com from a James Cameron interview on Avatar,


James Cameron informed that Avatar was being shot in "a 16:9 ratio." 3D theatrical exhibition would be in 1.78:1 in the theaters that could project it at that ratio; for 2D theatrical exhibition, a cinemascope-ratio (2.39:1) picture was being extracted from the 1.78:1 frame.


Cameron explained: "I actually think that the extra screen height really works well in 3D. It really pulls you through the screen. So I'm actually going back on years of kind of eschewing the kind of 1.85 format, now saying 1.85 – or actually, it's 1.78:1 – actually works really well in 3D. But only in 3D. I still like the scope ratio compositionally for flat projection."


Ultimately, 1.78:1 is also being used for the Blu-ray (which, at least in this edition, is only 2D). Note that, as the picture was originally shot in 1.78:1, no image information is being lost; on the contrary, the 1.78:1 frame shows more information on the top and bottom than the scope-ratioed image.

There are no theaters that will project a movie at 1.78:1. The projection standard is 1.85:1. Cameron is using those terms interchangeably in the interview because the difference between the two ratios is negligible.


The native capture ratio of the cameras that Cameron used for Avatar was indeed 1.78:1, and the Blu-ray is fully open-matte. However, when the movie was released to theaters in multiple aspect ratio options, the choices were either 1.85:1, 2.40:1, 1.43:1 (for IMAX 15/70) or 1.9:1 (for IMAX digital).


As a side note, James Cameron actually composed Avatar for 2.40:1 during photography. He made the decision to open the mattes only after-the-fact during post production. The 16:9 Blu-ray is very awkwardly framed, with a little excess headroom above the actors and a whole lot of dead space at the bottom of the frame. The English subtitles for the Na'Vi dialogue are positioned way high up in the middle of the screen.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24493820


Actually many DVD profiler contributions are made by inserting the disc as well, so a lot will have the actual encoded information from the disc listed. And yes they are still all user submitted so to be taken with a grain of salt for sure.

FWIW, DVD Profiler doesn't scan the disc for information. When you insert the disc and let DVD Profiler scan it, what it's doing is looking for the Disc ID, so it can find the profile associated with that ID. All of the data in DVD Profiler (that I'm aware of) is entered/submitted by users, none is read from the disc other than the Disc ID.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by stanger89  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24503017


FWIW, DVD Profiler doesn't scan the disc for information. When you insert the disc and let DVD Profiler scan it, what it's doing is looking for the Disc ID, so it can find the profile associated with that ID. All of the data in DVD Profiler (that I'm aware of) is entered/submitted by users, none is read from the disc other than the Disc ID.

Hmm, not sure about that? I have actually submitted titles that weren't in the DVD Profiler database and the easiest way to do it is by inserting the dvd which adds all the data, UPC code, actors, directors and cover scans automatically. Unless it's pulling the data from another source but I wouldn't know how or where that would happen.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24503070


Hmm, not sure about that? I have actually submitted titles that weren't in the DVD Profiler database and the easiest way to do it is by inserting the dvd which adds all the data, UPC code, actors, directors and cover scans automatically. Unless it's pulling the data from another source but I wouldn't know how or where that would happen.

I've never seen it do that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Haven't done it for a while so I'll pay more attention on the next one to see for sure.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13  /t/1522708/how-many-movies-are-actually-16x9#post_24487153


So I've been looking at changing to a CIH screen and I cringe at not being able to watch Avengers on my full sized 1.78:1 screen but I wondered how many of my 590 Blu Ray/DVD titles were actually in that ratio.


Well the short answer is 30. Yes 30! and around 10 of those were animated.


According to my DVD profiler, here's the break down on how many of my titles have which aspect ratio, (I didn't include TV series, kids movies except for major animated pictures, or 1.33:1)


1.66:1 - 1


1.75:1 - 1


1.78:1 - 30


1.85:1 - 92


"16x9" movies - 124 out of 453


2.20:1 - 1


2.35:1 - 174


2.39:1 - 9 (Mostly Disney)


2.40:1 - 143


2.55:1 - 2


"Scope" movies - 329 out of 453


This really is a no brainer!


If I had more blu ray titles there would probably be more 2.40:1 titles. Many of my duplicate titles are 2.35 on DVD and 2.40 on Blu Ray.


Here's my collection for anyone who wants see what type of movies are included, http://www.invelos.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Dragon's%20Lair

I did a very rough estimate of my Blu-ray collection and about 55% are scope; 45% mostly 1:85 or so which are largely drama and to a lesser extent comedies. That number surprised me it was this large. However, I still decided to go scope based on my comments in the other threads.
 

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I got curious, so I did a roundup of my movies and came up with:


1.85: 1 movies - 40


2.35: 1 movies - 147


Yup, it's a no brainer going scope for me!
 
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