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Hi all,

I just finished my RF-7II + RC-64 setup and not sure if my HK AVR 1710 (100wx7ch) will be adequate for my speakers? I keep worrying what if I clip my avr and blow my speaker... Anybody has knowledge to suggest on this topic? Thank you!
 

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Hi all,

I just finished my RF-7II + RC-64 setup and not sure if my HK AVR 1710 (100wx7ch) will be adequate for my speakers? I keep worrying what if I clip my avr and blow my speaker... Anybody has knowledge to suggest on this topic? Thank you!
Are you running them full range?

If so, to get the most out of them you'll likely want more power.

That said they are pretty efficient and if you don't listen at extreme levels you should be OK until you can get more power to them.

Outlaw audio has a really good deal on their 120 watt/channel amp and pre-amp for $1000.

Amp
http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/5000.html

If your AVR has pre-outs you can hook this up and use your AVR as the pre-amp, if not you need a pre-amp or AVR that has the analog outputs to hook in an amp.

This amp rated at a true 120 watts/channel all channels driven in real world has more than double the true power of your AVR. You can't go by what HK rated that AVR at compared to a well built dedicated amp like this Outlaw.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Are you running them full range?

If so, to get the most out of them you'll likely want more power.

That said they are pretty efficient and if you don't listen at extreme levels you should be OK until you can get more power to them.

Outlaw audio has a really good deal on their 120 watt/channel amp and pre-amp for $1000.



If your AVR has pre-outs you can hook this up and use your AVR as the pre-amp, if not you need a pre-amp or AVR that has the analog outputs to hook in an amp.

This amp rated at a true 120 watts/channel all channels driven in real world has more than double the true power of your AVR. You can't go by what HK rated that AVR at compared to a well built dedicated amp like this Outlaw.

Thank you so much! I also heard good things about Emotiva XPA-5, how does this compare to Outlaw? BTW, before I upgrade my system, should I stop using my AVR 1710? I mean, I really don't want to blow my speaker when I don't even know if I am doing it. I usually run my volume at 50%, at most I will go to 60%... is this a problem here?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Are you running them full range?

If so, to get the most out of them you'll likely want more power.

That said they are pretty efficient and if you don't listen at extreme levels you should be OK until you can get more power to them.

Outlaw audio has a really good deal on their 120 watt/channel amp and pre-amp for $1000.



If your AVR has pre-outs you can hook this up and use your AVR as the pre-amp, if not you need a pre-amp or AVR that has the analog outputs to hook in an amp.

This amp rated at a true 120 watts/channel all channels driven in real world has more than double the true power of your AVR. You can't go by what HK rated that AVR at compared to a well built dedicated amp like this Outlaw.

I have a dedicated sub too, so I guess I am not running them in full range? I crossover at 80Hz...
 

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Thank you so much! I also heard good things about Emotiva XPA-5, how does this compare to Outlaw? BTW, before I upgrade my system, should I stop using my AVR 1710? I mean, I really don't want to blow my speaker when I don't even know if I am doing it. I usually run my volume at 50%, at most I will go to 60%... is this a problem here?
You're probably using less than 5 watts most of the time.

The rf7s are like 97db efficient or so. Which means they will put put 97dbs at 1 meter with 1 watt. Subtract I 6db for every doubling of the distance. So at 12 ft you would lose about 12dbs. So 1 watt would still get you about 85dbs which is pretty loud. Just increasing to 2 watts adds 3db back (I think).

Anyway at 5 or 6 watts continuous power you'd be at over 90dbs at normal listening distances. Double that for transient peaks or low bass and you're still well within your AVR's comfort zone.

As for the amp. I think the outlaw is a better deal and I think the company has better CS.
 

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You don't need an external amp for those speakers. And you can't connect an external amp to that AVR at any rate. With the 80hz crossover its doubtful you are using more than 10 watts to each speaker - a load the AVR can easily deliver.

Specs of the RF-7II from Klipsch website:

Frequency Response: 30Hz-24KHz ± 3dB SENSITIVITY: 101dB @ 2.83V / 1m POWER HANDLING: 250W RMS / 1000W Peak NOMINAL IMPEDANCE: 8 ohms compatible
These specs say you get 101db of sound from a single watt at one meter from the speakers. For each meter's distance (back) that you listen you can subtract 3db - for each doubling of power - 1 watt to 2 watts add 3db at whatever distance you are listening from. Bottom line is you'll soon go deaf if you use only 20 watts per channel.
 

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Thank you guys! For my current receiver, watching Tv is loud enough for me. But if I play some movie on Xbox One, I got much less volume... In this case, I should avoid go above 60% of my receiver's volume to protect my speakers from broken right?
 

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Your volume control isn't in terms of percentage. It's a logarithmic scale expressed in dB and can be set two ways. Check your manual page 25. If you are setup as default you should see a negative sign in front of the number and your manual recommends not exceeding 0 (although it can go to +10, this scale starts at -80). If you have no negative sign then your volume scale is set to read from 0-90. Have you run the calibration routine (EZset/EQ) so that the numbers are validated?
 

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Your volume control isn't in terms of percentage. It's a logarithmic scale expressed in dB and can be set two ways. Check your manual page 25. If you are setup as default you should see a negative sign in front of the number and your manual recommends not exceeding 0 (although it can go to +10, this scale starts at -80). If you have no negative sign then your volume scale is set to read from 0-90. Have you run the calibration routine (EZset/EQ) so that the numbers are validated?
Yes, I did a calibration by using SPL meter suggested by avs. I think I am using the default setting as I always see the negative sign on my volume control indicator. However, it is still confused me that if I need extra power. For now, 40%~50% of my volume will satisfy my needs. I wish I could have a clipping indicator on my avr so I could enjoy without worries...
thank you!
 

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There is no reason you should need more power than what you've got. I have some Klipsch speakers and my receiver provides plenty of power to rumble the room during movies and turn up louder than I ever want to. If you've got subs, you'll have an even easier time
 

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100w/ch is enough power for most people under most circumstances. But more than the amp power is the power behind the power. That is, the Power Supply, the stronger and more robust the power supply is, the stronger the amps are at any rated power.

At $550 the HK -1710 is priced for a typical consumer, but good, grade amp. Generally, Harman offers very high value, meaning you get a lot for your money.

The Klipsch are extremely Sensitive, meaning they kick out a lot of sound with very little power input.

We can do a brief analysis of the power.

101db = 1 watt @ 1 meter
104db = 2 w
107db = 4 w
110db = 8w and this is crazy loud.

But that is 1 meter away, if we move 4 meters away, then the sound will drop by 12db. In theory it drops by 6db everytime the distance doubles, so 1m to 2m = 6db, 2m to 4m = -6db more, for a total of 12db.

So, we subtract 12db from 101db and we have 89db -

89db = 1w @ 4m
92db = 2w
95db = 4w
98db = 8w
101db = 16w
104db - 32w and this is very close to Peak Reference Levels
107db = 64w and this is extremely loud.
110db = 128w and this is reaching painfully loud, and would only be on the shortest peaks.

So, in short, you will have enough power. Though in reality - in room - sound is more likely to drop by -3db every time the distance double, leaving you in even better shape.

The next question is related to the quality of power. There is not that much difference in power between a $500 AV Receiver and a $1500 AV Receiver. Certainly more power, but not 3 times the power. So, what is your money buying you if not power? Answer: Quality of power, quality of Power Supply, and the general design and build quality of the amp.

Somewhat speculation, but if you want noticeably better sound quality, you need to spend approaching or exceeding $1000 for an amp.

Short of that, be happy with what you have.

Steve/bluewizard
 

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I have a Marantz amp powering my RF-7II's, that has a power scale for each channel, and most of the time its barely peaking 10 watts. Watching movies some of the time its not even registering 1 watt. Unless you like playing at Reference level in a very large room and a ways from the Towers, you will never use 100 watts. 100 watts with those towers are very loud.
Although you may get cleaner sound from a more powerful system. It depends how much distortion your amp or AVR is putting out when you start pumping some power out. Some AVR's will advertise so many watts, but in reality, it wont provide it to all channels at once. Like someone mentioned above, if you are running a sub(s) and have your towers crossover at the common 80Hz, that will make your speaker even more efficient, since its the low FR that is the power hog.

Also, you should remember if you are making 100 watts, it will take 200 watts to get 3 more dB. And 400 watts per channel to get 6 dB, which I believe it takes 6 dB to double the loudness. So after 100 watts, it starts to get costly for more SPL. But it never hurts to have some extra headroom. But all in all, you dont need it.
 
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