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I want to upgrade from my Energy RCLCR and RC70s but to what?

2337 Views 12 Replies 8 Participants Last post by toddsdonald, Apr 29, 2022

Juiced46

Discussion Starter · Sep 10, 2019

I am running a full energy setup in my theater room and I am looking to upgrade my Front and center at the moment and will do the surrounds in the future. I currently have 2 RC70s and an RCLCR along with 4 Energy Veritas for surrounds.

My main concern is the center as I feel I need more for my setup and room size. I have been looking at the Klipsch RP504C center along with some Klipsch RP-280F fronts. These are within my budget of what I am looking to spend. I am just not sure if this is a worth while purchase or an upgrade from what I have already.

The room is about 400sqft with 2 rows of seating. Front row is about 12ft from the center. I feel the center is a bit weak for my setup, especially for the 2nd row. I have tried everything as far as moving it closer, angle adjustments, sound adjustments etc etc. I am powering everything with a Denon X4300H. I just feel my front stage is weak and not sure what I should upgrade too from here that will not destroy the bank account.

All suggestions are welcome.

Here is a picture of my current setup.

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Russdawg1

· #2 · Sep 10, 2019

The RP line has been well received and I think it would be a worth while upgrade. The 504C center is very capable.

The old RP line (RP280F) is being discounted already online but if looking at the new line (RP504C) make sure to find a dealer to discount it for you.

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VisionxOrb

· #3 · Sep 10, 2019

If you not against building, I would do something from diysoundgroup. Otherwise I would opt for the PSA mtm-210c https://www.powersoundaudio.com/collections/speakers/products/mtm-210c.

Have the energy set myself, I think most speakers are going more of a side grade for the money spent. The PSA is probably out of budget but Just do the center first.

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355F1

· #4 · Sep 10, 2019

Juiced46 said:
I am running a full energy setup in my theater room and I am looking to upgrade my Front and center at the moment and will do the surrounds in the future. I currently have 2 RC70s and an RCLCR along with 4 Energy Veritas for surrounds.

My main concern is the center as I feel I need more for my setup and room size. I have been looking at the Klipsch RP504C center along with some Klipsch RP-280F fronts. These are within my budget of what I am looking to spend. I am just not sure if this is a worth while purchase or an upgrade from what I have already.

The room is about 400sqft with 2 rows of seating. Front row is about 12ft from the center. I feel the center is a bit weak for my setup, especially for the 2nd row. I have tried everything as far as moving it closer, angle adjustments, sound adjustments etc etc. I am powering everything with a Denon X4300H. I just feel my front stage is weak and not sure what I should upgrade too from here that will not destroy the bank account.

All suggestions are welcome.

Here is a picture of my current setup.

VisionxOrb said:
If you not against building, I would do something from diysoundgroup. Otherwise I would opt for the PSA mtm-210c https://www.powersoundaudio.com/collections/speakers/products/mtm-210c.

Have the energy set myself, I think most speakers are going more of a side grade for the money spent. The PSA is probably out of budget but Just do the center first.

I am looking for 3 sets of RC-70 speakers!

if you want to sell yours let me know! 🙂

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djp2k7

· #5 · Sep 10, 2019

Juiced46 said:
I am running a full energy setup in my theater room and I am looking to upgrade my Front and center at the moment and will do the surrounds in the future. I currently have 2 RC70s and an RCLCR along with 4 Energy Veritas for surrounds.

My main concern is the center as I feel I need more for my setup and room size. I have been looking at the Klipsch RP504C center along with some Klipsch RP-280F fronts. These are within my budget of what I am looking to spend. I am just not sure if this is a worth while purchase or an upgrade from what I have already.

The room is about 400sqft with 2 rows of seating. Front row is about 12ft from the center. I feel the center is a bit weak for my setup, especially for the 2nd row. I have tried everything as far as moving it closer, angle adjustments, sound adjustments etc etc. I am powering everything with a Denon X4300H. I just feel my front stage is weak and not sure what I should upgrade too from here that will not destroy the bank account.

All suggestions are welcome.

The Energy RC speakers are no slouch. They have a great tweeter. Very smooth. Midrange a bit recessed in the RC-10's. Haven't heard your towers, but I assume they're voiced the same. I wouldn't necessarily call the Klipsch RP series an upgrade but they'll definitely give you a different sound. Much more dynamic with great transients. Percussion and brass are very live sounding. Vocals too.

Since you're on the fence I'd buy them from somewhere with cheap returns in case you don't like them better.

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afrogt

· #6 · Sep 10, 2019

Klipsch will definitely be a different sound, a little brighter than the RC-70 but I know the RP line isn't fatiguing like the older Reference series.

I've had my RC-70, RC-LCR setup for 9 years now. Not getting rid of mine any time soon. I've had a RC-10 setup in the other room even longer than that.

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Juiced46

Discussion Starter · #7 · Sep 21, 2019

VisionxOrb said:
If you not against building, I would do something from diysoundgroup. Otherwise I would opt for the PSA mtm-210c https://www.powersoundaudio.com/collections/speakers/products/mtm-210c.

Have the energy set myself, I think most speakers are going more of a side grade for the money spent. The PSA is probably out of budget but Just do the center first.

Thanks for the suggestions. I looked at these and I would have been willing to spend that $$ on them as they are within budget. However I ended up finding a dealer to give me a very good discount on the Klipsch 504C that I could not refuse. I will be setting it up and calibrating it tonight.

Does anyone have any suggestions on what to set the crossover for this center to?

Thanks for all the suggestions guys.

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gajCA

· #8 · Sep 21, 2019

Juiced46 said:
Thanks for the suggestions. I looked at these and I would have been willing to spend that $$ on them as they are within budget. However I ended up finding a dealer to give me a very good discount on the Klipsch 504C that I could not refuse. I will be setting it up and calibrating it tonight.

Does anyone have any suggestions on what to set the crossover for this center to?

Thanks for all the suggestions guys.

80hz should work fine.

I'm assuming all speakers are set to "small" and if you have a Denon or Marantz receiver you tried turning off Dynamic EQ with the old center?

Dynamic EQ messes up the performance of my center and sub when used with modern content.

It helps with old content lacking any dynamic range though.

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toddsdonald

· #9 · Apr 29, 2022

As an Energy enthusiast myself I'm curious whatever became of the shift from your RC LCR to the Klipsch center.

That setup you've got is pretty much my goal, although I've been through a myriad of variations and haven't been able to acquire the RC 70's. I've tried the Energy CF 70's and they were nice but surprisingly I had taken them out of the living room to make room for my wife's Xmas stuff and replaced them "temporarily" with a pair of RC-10's and was surprised how easily they took the place of the big towers.

After Xmas I hooked up the towers again and much to my surprise I liked the RC-10's more. They were much more full bodied, with a smoother more transparent sound and provided a deeper and quicker bass. I sold the big CF's and started using the RC-10's and that's what I'm running now, flanking the RC LCR. I've run RC-10's and RVSS for surrounds and I'm undecided to which is better for surround. I'm currently trying to acquire 2 more RC LCR's to use for front left and right, thinking they may provide even more bang for the buck than the RC 10's which is no easy feat, as those little bookshelf speakers will literally rock the house with music or movies. They sound as big as many of the better 12" and 15" 2 and 3 ways I've enjoyed in the past. I run mine from an NAD T757v2 and have them crossed over at 50hz where the Audessey detects their bottom end and they crank without any bottoming out, distortion or anything else funky. The bass is deep and tight.

The RC LCR measures at 40 hz and I've run it that low, (currently 50hz), without any complaints from it either. I've run them at 80hz, but feel it's a waste as they can go much lower and it provides a more localized sound from the appropriate areas. I know bass is supposed to be omnidirectional, so whether it's BS or what I'm hearing is roll off, either way it sounds better and definitely fuller with them set lower.

I've seen that big 4 driver plus horn center channel from Klipsch though and thought hmmmmm I wonder if I could bring myself to have a room full of Klipsch instead of Energy's... It's really too bad that API's founder passed and the torch got passed to Klipsch, because I'm thinking they bought energy for their technology and to capture the market share. I've not heard any Klipsch yet that matches the Sound Dynamics, or Energy line but to be honest I've not given their newer copper dishpan line an honest listen, but they get good reviews.

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afrogt

· #10 · Apr 29, 2022

With those two huge subs flanking your speakers I'm surprised you set the crossovers so low on the RC-10 and LCR. How did they sound when crossed at 60hz for RC-10 and LCR? Maybe 80hz is too high but 40hz and 50hz seems very low to me.

But you know what sounds best to you, so I gotta trust your settings.

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toddsdonald

· #11 · Apr 29, 2022

afrogt said:
With those two huge subs flanking your speakers I'm surprised you set the crossovers so low on the RC-10 and LCR. How did they sound when crossed at 60hz for RC-10 and LCR? Maybe 80hz is too high but 40hz and 50hz seems very low to me.

But you know what sounds best to you, so I gotta trust your settings.

I don't think that in the original post they mentioned what crossover point they used, then later on someone mentioned 80hz. Those are two huge subs they have. That's why I mentioned where I set my crossover for the RC LCR, because the center channel sounds much fuller and also louder with the crossover set nearer to it's usable range. For me, I've got a 5.1 with 4 RC-10's and RC-LCR center with an energy 12.3s sub. I've experimented with the crossover points, all the way up to 80hz, but found they sound great where Audessey sets them at 50 and 40. To make it symmetrical I just set all mine to 50hz. They handle it just fine, even with Beyonce and all the other high bpm cleaning music my wife cranks up to 0db and beyond lol. For home theater it's no problem either and the sub handles the LFE in movies and shows just fine. I'm running everything flat though through an NAD without any equalization or tone control adjustments (bass/treble), and I've got it set to direct so whatever the source is just is run through the amp without extra processing or effects.

That's worked for me, however I will say that running the same speakers from a higher end Sony resulted in much different results. Everything sounded weaker, less full, more up front clinical and didn't have anywhere near as much body, speed or dynamics.

With a gazillion different electronics and speakers available I suppose hitting on the right combo is the key. For Energy users, that usually means they're designed to be fairly neutral with a decent measurement on and off axis, but they've always sounded best to me regardless of which ones, with more amp muscle behind them and leave them play as designed without eq. To each his own though.

Going back to that setup in the photo though, it looks great and about the only thing I might try is toeing in the RC 70's a tad, tilting the center up so it's firing more in line with the left and right tweeters, and adjusting the crossover so that the subs only need to cover what the other speakers can't. Not sure what the amp section is like in the Denon, but it's probably pretty healthy. I read in the specs it has Pure Direct, which is definitely worth trying instead of running the multi eq... I never trusted the auto eqs, especially if the speakers are decent to begin with, I say let them run as designed.

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afrogt

· #12 · Apr 29, 2022

Yeah, the RC-10s are great. I have two pair in black and another pair in cherry. Currently only one pair in use at the moment as I have RC-70's in one setup and Veritas 2.1 bookshelves in the other. The Veritas are amazing and I got the two bookshelf speakers and V2.0C for $300 total a couple years ago. One of my best speaker purchases ever.

Looks like I got the pic with dual subs from the OP confused with your RC-10 setup. Seems like you did plenty of experimenting and came to the conclusion 50hz sounds best so can't argue with that.

Glad to see you enjoy your Energy RC-10 speakers so much. And yes, the CF series isn't close to the RC series in my opinion. The CF towers remind me of my old Athena towers which sounded great but a little too bright for my taste.

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toddsdonald

· #13 · Apr 29, 2022

afrogt said:
Yeah, the RC-10s are great. I have two pair in black and another pair in cherry. Currently only one pair in use at the moment as I have RC-70's in one setup and Veritas 2.1 bookshelves in the other. The Veritas are amazing and I got the two bookshelf speakers and V2.0C for $300 total a couple years ago. One of my best speaker purchases ever.

Looks like I got the pic with dual subs from the OP confused with your RC-10 setup. Seems like you did plenty of experimenting and came to the conclusion 50hz sounds best so can't argue with that.

Glad to see you enjoy your Energy RC-10 speakers so much. And yes, the CF series isn't close to the RC series in my opinion. The CF towers remind me of my old Athena towers which sounded great but a little too bright for my taste.

With the port plugs I cross then over at 60 Hz all the way around. It seems like the RC LCR has the same tweeter as the veritas, (it looks like it anyways). Not sure but they all sound fantastic. I would love to have the RC 70's. As for the CF's I've tried all the connesuers except the 5 series (CB 10, CB 20, CC 10, CF 50 and CF 70's. They sound good, but very shrill and in your face at certain frequencies. They gave decent sound stage and imaging, but not as transparent or smooth as the RC's. I also found that when pushed hard they didn't really like that too much. The RC's on the other hand are nuts and those little kevlar woofers are incredible. When my wife is cranking up the tunes I would swear the drivers are gonna fly out of the cabinets and into my lap, but they just keep playing without any hint off distortion or coloring that I could tell.

Port bungs in or out has been an experiment so has distance from the walls and corners. Overall I would say that they sound cleaner with the open cell port bungs in and at least several inches away from the walls, but with them out there definitely more low bass and a tad more transparency. Either way, they're incredible for what they are.

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I want to upgrade from my Energy RCLCR and RC70s but to what?

Juiced46

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