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Discussion Starter #101
Generally speaking, aesthetically, white screens always look better in rooms than darker gray screens just from aesthetics. That is my opinion though, I'm not a decorator, to me gray screens look ugly. If you have an aesthetics issue though, you need an electric screen. Electric screens are much much better for that.

CineGrey 5D is a decent material, I have seen it both in a showroom and had a full-sized sample at home I've used (2'x2' I got from a dealer). I also have the little mini-sample packs you get on Amazon, those aren't big enough to use though, cannot tell much. The thing I don't like about gray is the way it looks just sitting there when the projector is turned off.

You can probably still get the Elite sample pack online if you want to see the materials.

The SI 1.3 gain DIY material would be my pick. Dominic uses this, the only downside is it's always sold out and it's very fragile and easy to tear if you don't get it mounted correctly the first time.
Well, taste is a very personal thing, in my case and in my room, I also prefer a gray screen, much like my wife.

We'll see though, things and taste might change after we've seen what the fabrics can yield of an image.


By SI you mean the Silver Ticket, yes?
 

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Check that Elite will send the Designer Cut to your country, I know they don't send it to the UK and some other EU countries. I got a Cinegrey 3D from the states via an intermediary since they also did not deliver (at the time). Elite's EU/Germany store does not sell the 5D fabric.

If painting is an option great results can be achieved, but the surface that will be painted has to be smooth and white. Overall it's probably slightly more expensive then a Cinegrey 5D if you don't have a paint gun, masks, other tools, etc.
 

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Discussion Starter #104
Yah, meant ST not SI. I would have to double check, but I think the CineGray 5D is 1.0 - 1.15 gain in the middle at optimal mounting zone. On the sides, it's negative gain for those not sitting in the perfect position.

It's too dark, I don't think you want that one.
I hear you, I really do.

Exciting times, the offer on this JVC is too good to let go, I might as well order it and see for myself.

I'll hook up my Oppo and run some discs, shooting on all my samples, got white samples as well.

If brightness is an issue (considering lamp age, iris etc) I will consider the Epson.

But, before that, I'll consider mounting the JVC closer than 18.5'.

If required, I'll mount it where it needs to be, but with ALR that needs to be considered twice.

Thank you!
 

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Discussion Starter #105
Check that Elite will send the Designer Cut to your country, I know they don't send it to the UK and some other EU countries. I got a Cinegrey 3D from the states via an intermediary since they also did not deliver (at the time). Elite's EU/Germany store does not sell the 5D fabric.

If painting is an option great results can be achieved, but the surface that will be painted has to be smooth and white. Overall it's probably slightly more expensive then a Cinegrey 5D if you don't have a paint gun, masks, other tools, etc.
Yeah, already noticed, thanks for the heads up.

I have to order from the United States, via bhphotovideo.com and ship it to me in Sweden.

Germany (Elite Screens) or their UK shop did not sell to me directly, strange business.


Painting is interesting, could I achieve a 1.3 gain screen by using a white fine fabric and paiting it with some kind of special paint?

Recommendations?
 

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I hear you, I really do.

Exciting times, the offer on this JVC is too good to let go, I might as well order it and see for myself.

I'll hook up my Oppo and run some discs, shooting on all my samples, got white samples as well.

If brightness is an issue (considering lamp age, iris etc) I will consider the Epson.
Projecting onto the wall works too for a temp setup, but better with a white wall. The blackout cloth only takes 30 minutes to setup, actually you can set it up sloppier in about 5 minutes with two people and regular thumb tacks. 30 minutes to do it right. If you do the blackout cloth, the trick is to not frame it for 4-6 weeks, keep re-positioning the tacks. This lets it settle, then once it stops moving and wrinkling, you can just put Triple Black Velvet or velvet tape around it. Then you have a screen until you decide what to buy.

Frankly, I've had real expensive samples too right over the BO cloth, it barely makes a difference for me even at 8'. Yes, the Stewart is better, or the Elite Versawhite, or Carl's FLexiwhite (hate the blue tint though). However, the difference is like 10% of say what the difference would be between the NX resolution and the RS-540. The screen is the least amount of difference in the equation, as my eyes adjust and don't even see the texture. Once you get far back enough, it becomes completely invisible anyhow.

However, the BO Cloth has less texture than the Elite MaxWhite, just as an example.
 

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Yeah, already noticed, thanks for the heads up.

I have to order from the United States, via bhphotovideo.com and ship it to me in Sweden.

Germany (Elite Screens) or their UK shop did not sell to me directly, strange business.


Painting is interesting, could I achieve a 1.3 gain screen by using a white fine fabric and paiting it with some kind of special paint?

Recommendations?
With painting you can have any screen properties required, it's very customizable. There's a few paint mixes, best to create a new thread here:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/110-diy-screen-section/

Here's an example of a JVC and Cinegrey 5D in a room with white walls:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/23-screens/3126290-jvc-rs46-dila-lcos-cinegrey-5d-alr-screen-oh-god.html

It's mounted ~1.7x throw ratio and a slight/very faint hotspot (center brighter than the images) can be observed.


LE: if some sort of black out cloth is going to be used, make sure it's textureless, or relatively smooth. The ones I found were not (faint weaving grooves) and produced artifacts.
 

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Discussion Starter #108
With painting you can have any screen properties required, it's very customizable.
What would be the goal here, buy a white fine textured 1.0 fabric, and paint it to a higher gain?

Do you paint for gain purposes only, or can you add a color to it at the same time?
 

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What would be the goal here, buy a white fine textured 1.0 fabric, and paint it to a higher gain?

Do you paint for gain purposes only, or can you add a color to it at the same time?
The paint can have a negative or positive gain.

Not sure what you mean by color, but the screen can have other image improving properties, like improving black level, ALR properties. I'm not an expert, best to make a thread in the link above.
 

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Discussion Starter #110
The paint can have a negative or positive gain.

Not sure what you mean by color, but the screen can have other image improving properties, like improving black level, ALR properties. I'm not an expert, best to make a thread in the link above.
Right, thank you.
 

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Very well put, useful information for someone like me with zero previous experience with projectors.

This has actually been one of my concerns as well, ending up with a too bright of an image, unable to lower it to a comfortable 3 hour session.

On the other hand, my first concern was not having/getting enough brightness, so both these arguments are in conflict with eachother.

The most sensible way would be not going crazy on brightness as this seems to be what most people recommend.

It's quite logical as well, with a TV, you tend to light up the environment to ease the strain on the eyes.

With projectors, the opposite is most likely going to be the case, as the screen gets larger and takes up more of your vision.

I could not of put it better, well done!
My room is fully treated for reflections so basically the only light I see is coming off the screen. I know we all on here harp on about reflected light but in a normal room with only the screen as the source of light you would be surprised how much light is reflected off other surfaces which in turn reflect back towards the screen which is why maybe an ALR screen with a modest gain or at least a neutral 1.0 gain would be beneficial.

There is far more knowledgeable guys on here than I but it's always nice to hear the ordinary guy's thoughts on things and in my opinion on your suggested screen size if you want the option to be bright then moving the projector closer to the screen will give you this option, just like SDR content you can close down the iris or drop the lamp mode if you feel it's too bright but light I said I have no problem watching HDR on my screen with filter in place but even with it off your colours don't go to crap when it's been calibrated to suit.

The biggest shock to your optical system is the sheer size difference compared to a normal TV, lets face it you will be watching your 118" screen probably the same distance away as you will be watching your TV, especially if both are in the same room, it's not like you are going to move the furniture LOL so you whole vision is going to be filled by the screen and you'll be seeing a movie from a whole new perspective.

I'm not going to recommend projectors to you because such things only cause arguments between differing groups but the two you have suggested will definitely give you a very convincing HDR image.
 

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I have the cinegrey5d with the x790r and I’m very happy with the screen. Some people say it’s closer to 1.0 gain. I’ve heard it’s closer to 1.2-1.3. I find the screen very bright and holds up well with some light in the room. Screen works well with 3d too as long as you get the right glasses. I watch Jurassic park 3d the other night and it was really good.
 

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Discussion Starter #113
I know we all on here harp on about reflected light but in a normal room with only the screen as the source of light you would be surprised how much light is reflected off other surfaces which in turn reflect back towards the screen which is why maybe an ALR screen with a modest gain or at least a neutral 1.0 gain would be beneficial.

There is far more knowledgeable guys on here than I but it's always nice to hear the ordinary guy's thoughts on things and in my opinion on your suggested screen size if you want the option to be bright then moving the projector closer to the screen will give you this option, just like SDR content you can close down the iris or drop the lamp mode if you feel it's too bright but light I said I have no problem watching HDR on my screen with filter in place but even with it off your colours don't go to crap when it's been calibrated to suit.

The biggest shock to your optical system is the sheer size difference compared to a normal TV, lets face it you will be watching your 118" screen probably the same distance away as you will be watching your TV, especially if both are in the same room, it's not like you are going to move the furniture LOL so you whole vision is going to be filled by the screen and you'll be seeing a movie from a whole new perspective.

I'm not going to recommend projectors to you because such things only cause arguments between differing groups but the two you have suggested will definitely give you a very convincing HDR image.
Spot on, you put my thinking into words better than I could myself.

It'll be such a change from what I'm used to, the sheer size difference is amazing solely on its own.

If the JVC is enough for other people than me, it'll be enough for me too.

With some adjustments, either in screen material or throw range, I should be set to go.

I want to thank you for your post, very valuable thoughts, if not only for me, but for others reading this thread as well.

Thanks again!

I have the cinegrey5d with the x790r and I’m very happy with the screen. Some people say it’s closer to 1.0 gain. I’ve heard it’s closer to 1.2-1.3. I find the screen very bright and holds up well with some light in the room. Screen works well with 3d too as long as you get the right glasses. I watch Jurassic park 3d the other night and it was really good.
Well, to be brutally honest, people say lots of different things about the gain of this material.

I'm leaning more towards trusting reviewers who've measured it with the proper tools, than rumors circulating on these boards.

I would also like to think that a screen rated at 1.5 gain would not drop as low as 1.0, but hey, if it does - it does.

Changing to a different material could always solve this, or mounting the projector closer.


It's nice to have your confirmation, I don't think I'll be disappointed.
 

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Discussion Starter #114
Right, I went ahead and ordered the RS540/X790R/X7900.

Too sweet of a deal to miss out on, I'll just have to try and see for myself.


I wouldn't lose a dime returning it.

There is always the Epson!


Cheers all!
 

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Right, I went ahead and ordered the RS540/X790R/X7900.

Too sweet of a deal to miss out on, I'll just have to try and see for myself.


I wouldn't lose a dime returning it.

There is always the Epson!


Cheers all!
Nice! You won’t be disappointed.
 

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I have the cinegrey5d with the x790r and I’m very happy with the screen. Some people say it’s closer to 1.0 gain. I’ve heard it’s closer to 1.2-1.3. I find the screen very bright and holds up well with some light in the room. Screen works well with 3d too as long as you get the right glasses. I watch Jurassic park 3d the other night and it was really good.
Nope, right at 1.0 gain.
 

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Right, I went ahead and ordered the RS540/X790R/X7900.

Too sweet of a deal to miss out on, I'll just have to try and see for myself.


I wouldn't lose a dime returning it.

There is always the Epson!


Cheers all!
I don’t think you need worry about returning it, the x7900 is an exceptional machine. Depending on who you talk to it’s HDR wouldn’t quite be as good as the Epson but there’s custom curves which will get you very close and if you ever feel the need to improve things more there’s always MadVR. Only thing I might suggest is buy yourself a Panasonic UB420 Bluray Player, this works really well with the JVC and is a real bargain.

Good luck and will be watching for your photos in the near future. ;)

Here’s a wee link to my own home cinema room and my journey to where it is now, hopefully it gives you some ideas for the future, I have no doubt the bug will bite you hard within the next few weeks and months. LOL

My Modest Home Cinema Room
 

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Discussion Starter #118
I don’t think you need worry about returning it, the x7900 is an exceptional machine. Depending on who you talk to it’s HDR wouldn’t quite be as good as the Epson but there’s custom curves which will get you very close and if you ever feel the need to improve things more there’s always MadVR. Only thing I might suggest is buy yourself a Panasonic UB420 Bluray Player, this works really well with the JVC and is a real bargain.


My Modest Home Cinema Room
No, I think I will be more than satisfied with this machine.

I have seen what Javs can do with these, but really I plan more on getting the Panasonic, an easier installation.

Also hate the Spiders, worst there is, I'd rather use my X-rites for a proper calibration.

I have my hopes on a newer Panny which might bring dynamic tone mapping, then it'll blow everything else out the water in that price range.

It would bring such an improvement to every projector, one can only hope!


No wrong in the 420/820, but I'd like just a tad bit more, maybe a better build quality too.

A real shame if they didn't update the 9000 with DTM if they were to announce newer players, people would rage.

I have the Oppo right now, but it does not really deliver with the X790R, maybe for REC.709, sure.


Why did you get rid of the Sony, you hopped on the 4K-wagon?
 

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I have the cinegrey5d with the x790r and I’m very happy with the screen. Some people say it’s closer to 1.0 gain. I’ve heard it’s closer to 1.2-1.3. I find the screen very bright and holds up well with some light in the room. Screen works well with 3d too as long as you get the right glasses. I watch Jurassic park 3d the other night and it was really good.
The fabric has been measured to be 1.0, it's not an assumption:
https://www.accucalav.com/wp-content/uploads/accucal_front_projection_screen_report.pdf
 
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