AVS Forum banner

1 - 20 of 71 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
391 Posts
You can find a bunch of integrateds with pre-outs which will get the job done. However if you are looking for a sub-out with bass management the only device I know if the Outlaw 2215 Receiver. But if you don't mind sending a full signal to your mains you can use a quality integrated and use a sub to full in the bottom end with pretty good results (it is what I do). Takes time to tweak it but you can get satisfying results.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21 Posts
There is also the recently released Arcam Solo Move 2.1. Apparently it has the sound managment featues you may be looking for.


It's posted on the Arcam website.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by biznus97 /forum/post/12864380


You can find a bunch of integrateds with pre-outs which will get the job done. However if you are looking for a sub-out with bass management the only device I know if the Outlaw 2215 Receiver.

I just purchased the Outlaw RR2215. I was looking for an itegrated also but couldn't find the options I wanted. Not only does it have the bass managment but it also has a built in DAC with USB connection to hook up my MAC Mini that I use as a music server. LOVE IT!!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,886 Posts
My NAD Masters M3 integrated preap has a sub preout jack with high-pass selectable filter.


It is an amazing amp. I'm quite satisfied with it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
128 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by WestTownsend /forum/post/12867416


I just purchased the Outlaw 2215. I was looking for an itegrated also but couldn't find the options I wanted. Not only does it have the bass managment but it also has a built in DAC with USB connection to hook up my MAC Mini that I use as a music server. LOVE IT!!!

don't you guys mean the Outlaw RR2150 stereo receiver?

http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/rr2150.html
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,876 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by irwin k /forum/post/12860551


Anyone know of an Integrated Amp with a dedicated Sub Output ?

Do you mean "an integrated amp with bass management"?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenassco /forum/post/12897616


don't you guys mean the Outlaw RR2150 stereo receiver?

Maybe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,101 Posts
I was also looking for a 2ch receiver with sub out.

The problem with the NAD M3 or outlaw 2250 is that there is no way to restrict the main L&R outputs to cut off at the the desired frequency. Since I have book shelf speakers this is important.


In other words all these sub out options are not actually like AV receivers where I can set the front L&R as small. I prefer not to send full range to my book shelf speakers.


basically there isnt a 2ch receiver/amp that will let me do that. I have looked at so many sub 1k 2ch gears and none of them have the option I am looking for. basically I am looking for bass management in a 2ch receiver/amp. I just wonder why this is not available. Not everyone who uses a 2ch receiver has full range speakers.


I dont want to send full range to my book shelf speakers and drive them hard.


With all these 2ch amps that provide sub out/pre put all I can do it augment the L&R with the sub, which I dont like to do as I dont like to drive my small speakers with full range.


I have posted a million posts on this topic but so far no one has understood my requireents. Everyone keeps telling me to use a sub using the pre-outs.

Duh! I know that I can connect a powered sub to the pre outs. But that is not what I am looking for.


I hope someone from Rotel or NAD would one day read my posts and understand the need for bass management in a 2ch receiver.


You might wonder why then I am not buying an AV receiver. Well for 2ch music the mass market AV receivers arent good. May be Marantz 4002 will give me the rotel sound but I dont want to spend some $500 for features like HDMI which I dont need right now.


Now my question is this:


say I use my old AVR (yamaha RX-V795a) as a pre. and use Rotel RB-1050 amp. Then set the speakers as small on the AVR. Will this also make the L&R pre-outs as small and send only 80Hz (cut off in my AVR) and above to the

amp. If this is possible then I can keep my sub connected to the AVR and this was I get the bass management and also a good 2ch amp that will deal

only with 80Hz and above.

But if the pre.outs in the AVR are not affected but any speaker settings on the AVR, then this wont work. From what I understand the pre.outs on the AVR are affected only by the volume change on the AVR. darn!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mupi /forum/post/12900869


I was also looking for a 2ch receiver with sub out.

The problem with the NAD M3 or outlaw 2250 is that there is no way to restrict the main L&R outputs to cut off at the the desired frequency. Since I have book shelf speakers this is important.


In other words all these sub out options are not actually like AV receivers where I can set the front L&R as small. I prefer not to send full range to my book shelf speakers.

Not exactly! The Outlaw RR2250 has bass management. I can choose to cross over at 60, 80 or 100.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,886 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mupi /forum/post/0


You might wonder why then I am not buying an AV receiver. Well for 2ch music the mass market AV receivers arent good. May be Marantz 4002 will give me the rotel sound but I dont want to spend some $500 for features like HDMI which I dont need right now.

Mupi, what bookshelf speakers do you own?


I ask you this because IMO a nice stereo amplifier with a sound supposedly better than any stereo receiver's sound, deserves a good pair of floortanders!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,101 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by WestTownsend /forum/post/12901724


Not exactly! The Outlaw RR2250 has bass management. I can choose to cross over at 60, 80 or 100.

that is not base management.

Does outlaw set the L&R speakers to small when I set the cross over

in other words does it cut the left and right at the cross over and send

only above the cross over. I dont think it does
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,101 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by JorgeLopez11 /forum/post/12902246


Mupi, what bookshelf speakers do you own?


I ask you this because IMO a nice stereo amplifier with a sound supposedly better than any stereo receiver's sound, deserves a good pair of floortanders!

well I am not looking for just an amp. I am looking for a 2ch receiver that has bass management. i.e ability to set the L&R speakers as small.

in other words I dont want to send full range signal to my small speakers.

I have Klipsch RB81 which are not one of those tiny satellite speakers.

They can handle the mids and highs and go as low as 50Hz but anything below they struggle. I dont want any discussion regarding how bright Klipsch are. Suffice it to say that the new Ref. IV is a lot smoother than the Ref 3 series.



Also a 2ch amp is no way better sounding than a 2ch receiver or 2ch int. amp. On what basic you make that claim.


I have auditioned Rotel RX-1052, RA-1062, RB-1050 and RB-1070.

There is no difference in sound. One has more power than the other but there is no compromise in sound. I auditioned these with the B&W 685.

I have audiotned Rotel 1052 with Klipsch RB81 which are the same speakers I have.



Like I said I have done a lot of searching and I have come to a conclusion that a 2ch receiver/int. amp just cant do what I want.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,101 Posts
BTW those cross overs for the sub or pre. out only apply to the signal that is sent to the sub/pre.out i.e like a low pass filter. It does not affect the signal sent to the

L&R. The L&R still get full range signal and I dont like to drive my small speakers with full range signal. Unless the outlaw receiver applies a high pass to the L&R (i.e setting them small like in a AVR), the signal sent to L&R will be full range and this is not bass management in my opinion. All these receivers are just giving is an option to augment the bass using a sub woofer. This is fine but like I said I dont like the muddy bass from my small speakers mixed with with the bass from my sub.


If my above statement is wrong I would be first person to feel good about it!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
64 Posts
FWIW, I'm solving this problem by using a NuForce AVP-16 as my pre-amp, which drives a Parasound HCA-1000 2-channel amp. So, basically, I am using a surround-capable pre-pro as a 2 channel preamp. It works pretty well - the NuForce has a repuation of having good SQ for music (and this combo, with my Onix Ref1 monitors sounds great to my ears although I don't have much to compare it to). I'm able to use the NuForce's bass management to cross the mains over at whatever frequency I like.


So, no, this does not solve your problem of wanting to do this with an integrated. But the NuForce/Parasound combo cost me about $1k off Audiogon. I'm not sure I would have gone this way had I set out to do purely 2 channel to start with - I originally had hoped to do surround music, but have since changed my mind - but I am actually quite happy with the result. I probably won't switch over to a "pure" 2 channel pre until I get speakers that go deep enough such that I don't want a subwoofer anymore.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mupi /forum/post/12911205


that is not base management.

Does outlaw set the L&R speakers to small when I set the cross over

in other words does it cut the left and right at the cross over and send

only above the cross over. I dont think it does


Read the online manual (page 15) and make sure you have the facts before you type!

http://pdf.outlawaudio.com/outlaw/docs/2150manual.pdf
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,886 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mupi /forum/post/0



Also a 2ch amp is no way better sounding than a 2ch receiver or 2ch int. amp. On what basic you make that claim.

I did't claim anything. That's why I used the word "supposedly". Conversely, I thought you subscribe to that concept when you wrote this:

Quote:
You might wonder why then I am not buying an AV receiver. Well for 2ch music the mass market AV receivers arent good. May be Marantz 4002 will give me the rotel sound but I dont want to spend some $500 for features like HDMI which I dont need right now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,886 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by WestTownsend /forum/post/0



Read the online manual (page 15) and make sure you have the facts before you type!

Mupi,


Thanks to WestTownsend, I think you're done with this Outlaw:

Quote:
Subwoofers and Bass Management Settings


The RR 2150 is unique among stereo receivers in that it has built-in bass

management, a feature common, if not required, for multi-channel products,

but not found in the two-channel world. While traditional two-channel systems

have long used full-range speakers, modern audio systems - even those designed

for two-channel music - may use frequency limited bookshelf, or satellite

speakers in combination with a separate subwoofer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,876 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mupi /forum/post/12900869


......................there is no way to restrict the main L&R outputs to cut off at the the desired frequency. Since I have book shelf speakers this is important.

Why don't you just use a speaker-level connection to a subwoofer and the subwoofer's high-passed speaker-level outputs to the speakers? No, you won't have a choice over what frequency a particular sub's fixed high-pass filter is or the ability to change it, but most are in the neighborhood of 80 to 100Hz. Many people actually find the slopes of the filters in the sub and the ability to use a truly continuously variable low-pass filter setting (mistakenly called the sub's crossover) to be preferable for 2.1 music setups. With most AVR-type bass management schemes you are limited to a very rigid, single, fixed (albeit adjustable) crossover with the same high and low-pass filter values. With a subwoofer's continuously variable low-pass filter, you can create a "custom crossover" with 2 different high and low-pass filter values and this often produces better integration results, particularly for music.


And there ARE some more advanced subs that DO allow you to change the fixed high-pass filter setting that is applied to the speaker-level outputs as well as the ability to customize the slopes of both the fixed high-pass filter and the continuously variable low-pass filter.
 
1 - 20 of 71 Posts
Top