AVS Forum banner
1 - 20 of 57 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Greetings:


Finally I got the custom PSI HT Sub. SVC 4 ohm - 1000W RMS; 2000W Peak; Dual Spider Layer. I will post pics as soon as I pick up from USPS but the storm dont let me.


Here are the specs:


Revc = 4.01 ohms

Fms = 24.2777 Hz

Zmax = 35.4840 ohms

Xmax = 32mm

Qes = 1.0747

Qms = 8.0662

Qts = 0.9484

Le = 5.2537 mH (at 1 kHz)

Diam = 330.2000 mm ( 13.0000 in )

Sd = 85633.5536 mm^2(132.7323 in^2) Vas = 114.5520 L ( 4.0454 ft^3)

BL = 15.2125 N/A

Mms = 390.8193 g

Cms = 109.9639 uM/N

Kms = 9093.8896 N/M

Rms = 7.3908

R mechanical Efficiency = 0.1433 % Sensitivity= 83.5807 dB @1W/1m Sensitivity= 86.4081 dB @2.83Vrms/1m


I will buy the new Behringer Inuke 6000DSP Power Amp; but not sure if its too much power for the sub; Enclosure will be sealed (19x19x22). I will add a second sub by Christmas. So this amp rates 3000W @ 4ohm; and 1500W @ 8 ohm. Can I set the amp to 8 ohm and do not damaged the speaker or can I leave it @ 4ohm? Or should I get the 3000DSP; which delivers only 880W @ 4ohm which is below driver specs and maybe its not as efficient at peaks?


Thanks for the help. New Behringer Software for DSP Models can be downloaded at Behringer site for free to see all functions and also it would be good to share custom configurations to all.
 

·
Bass Enabler
Joined
·
21,719 Posts
Wow. That driver has a crazy high Qes/Qts. Eck! That thing has 'one-note boom box' written all over it.


Generally, it's okay to have more power on tap than a particular driver is 'rated' for but there are several caveats to that generality. For one, the alignment. Is this going to be a sealed box, resonant box, infinite baffle?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,901 Posts
You can always have more power provided you use two things: your brain and the volume control.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian /forum/post/0


Wow. That driver has a crazy high Qes/Qts. Eck! That thing has 'one-note boom box' written all over it.


Generally, it's okay to have more power on tap than a particular driver is 'rated' for but there are several caveats to that generality. For one, the alignment. Is this going to be a sealed box, resonant box, infinite baffle?

Its going to be a sealed box. I have to order amp soon so I can get on Sept 9th. But need your help if getting 6000 or 3000 model. It is good or bad in having high qes/qts?? Im looking in tight and punchy bass rather than boomy.
 

·
Bass Enabler
Joined
·
21,719 Posts
It depends on what you like. If those specs are accurate then I would say that those specs for Qes/Qts are bad but that's just my opinion. It will be nearly impossible to put that driver into any kind of box without some large hump in the response and it is so high that even in a large sealed box the excursion will have a peak in it as well and that will limit the amount of power you will be able to put into the driver and limit the bandwidth of the system. You may be able to EQ it out but I find that pretty pointless.


Why did you choose this driver? Was this supposed to be a 'car subwoofer'? Is this going to be a home theater subwoofer or more for music? Some people like the huge hump in response but I find that the sound gets boring and dull really quick but again that's just my opinion.


I'm willing to put that aside to get everything up and running how you want.
 

·
Bass Enabler
Joined
·
21,719 Posts
I really don't know much about either of those amp to give you a very good answer. I like the Europower series, personally. These newer digital switching amps are pretty new for me and I am still trying to educate myself on them. I'd say go with whatever you feel comfortable with. It's always better to have more power on tap than not having enough.


As for the bass cab you mentioned in the PM, it depends on the total impedence of the system and how it can be wired up. You mentioned it has 4 10's that are 8ohm. How many hookups are there for the amp? Those kinds of guitar cabs don't need that much power, really. They will go loud with very little power. I wouldn't expect loads of bass though but I don't think they're really designed for that anyway.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,901 Posts
It's obviously not been simulated then. The specs don't include Vas and I can't be bothered calcing it out, but even with a very large box (rel to Vas) then it's going to have a peak near resonance and longer settling. Still better than ported, but not great. Will need EQ to get flat no matter what.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,962 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by A9X-308 /forum/post/20858068


It's obviously not been simulated then. The specs don't include Vas and I can't be bothered calcing it out, but even with a very large box (rel to Vas) then it's going to have a peak near resonance and longer settling. Still better than ported, but not great. Will need EQ to get flat no matter what.

Sd = 85633.5536 mm^2(132.7323 in^2) Vas = 114.5520 L ( 4.0454 ft^3)


In a sealed 4 cf box it does model with a big peak around 45 Hz (+4 dB). 0 dB at 30 and 98 Hz, -3 dB at 26 Hz. Just gets worse in a smaller box, and not really any better in a ported box no matter the size or tuning frequency.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,901 Posts
Thanks for that. It's unsuited to ported and by your numbers could be made to work in 4cf+ with sufficient (and appropriate) EQ and power.

I'd also work well for IB.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,433 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by javygonx /forum/post/20857446


Finally I got the custom PSI HT Sub.

Is that the one David posted pictures of at CACO?

Quote:
Originally Posted by javygonx /forum/post/20857446


SVC 4 ohm...


Can I set the amp to 8 ohm and do not damaged the speaker or can I leave it @ 4ohm? Or should I get the 3000DSP; which delivers only 880W @ 4ohm which is below driver specs and maybe its not as efficient at peaks?

First, you can't set the amp to anything. Think of the wattage as water flowing. The lower the impedance, the larger the water hose.


If this is like other Behringer amps, then it is rated at 1K hz. The EP-4000 really puts out about 600 watts at 20hz into 4 ohms. I have 2 ohm drivers and get a little more than 800w / channel from my EP-2500.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,433 Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by javygonx /forum/post/20857962


It is good or bad in having high qes/qts?? Im looking im tight and punchy bass rather than boomy.

After installing the sub in a box, the Qtc will always be higher than the Qts. I like a Qtc of .5. Yours will be above 1.0. Here's a link that explains the Qtc in a graphical form.

http://www.carstereo.com/help/Articles.cfm?id=29
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian
It depends on what you like. If those specs are accurate then I would say that those specs for Qes/Qts are bad but that's just my opinion. It will be nearly impossible to put that driver into any kind of box without some large hump in the response and it is so high that even in a large sealed box the excursion will have a peak in it as well and that will limit the amount of power you will be able to put into the driver and limit the bandwidth of the system. You may be able to EQ it out but I find that pretty pointless.


Why did you choose this driver? Was this supposed to be a 'car subwoofer'? Is this going to be a home theater subwoofer or more for music? Some people like the huge hump in response but I find that the sound gets boring and dull really quick but again that's just my opinion.


I'm willing to put that aside to get everything up and running how you want.


I choose this sub because according to PSI they offer this PSI Platform 1 Custom sub for HT. It does not have the same specs as the PSI Platform 1 for cars. They are going to design and sell subwoofers for HT in the near future; so I assume I'm going to be one of the first customers.


I didn't knew the HT Sub specs; until I asked for them. I was also worried that QTS was pretty high!!... I expect something between 0.50-0.65 but not close to 1. Second; I wanted the eD 160v.2 driver but eD Does not have such driver; I tried Fi Q15; but they never answered my email on how to pay for it just becuase I live in Puerto Rico.


I posted if PSI are good; and according to some avs members that recones their 13" eD Subs with PSI and results were awesome.


This is for HT and Music as well (60% HT, 40% Music). Maybe is not a good driver; I dont know until I test it. TC Sounds was on my attention but bit pricey; around $500 for a 15" sub driver. Dayton Sub MKII Titanic was also on the list; but reviews are good for some; not so good for others!... The TC Epic was also on my list; but comes only in 10" and 12" but not 15".


I thought DIY will saves me some trouble between Epik Empire and Rythmik F15HP in which both are still in back order!; but after this I would choose the Empire even if I have to wait!.....


"About the 4 10's that are 8ohm. How many hookups are there for the amp?" --> It use just one 1/4 connector that goes from cabinet labeled as 8ohm and goes to the 1/4 bass amp 1/4 connector which is labeled also in 8 ohm.

I disassemble the cabinet and all 4 drivers are 8 ohm. I can't remember the wiring if parallel or serial! I just sketched wiring on a paper.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by rlj5242
After installing the sub in a box, the Qtc will always be higher than the Qts. I like a Qtc of .5. Yours will be above 1.0. Here's a link that explains the Qtc in a graphical form.

http://www.carstereo.com/help/Articles.cfm?id=29
OMG!... According to the graphic; the .5 is way better that the 1.0!!... Im screwed!.. I'm going to email PSI again and ask if they gave me the correct parameters!!.. Now Im worried!!..
Otherwise I will try to get a replace with Platfrom 2 model which has lot better parameters!...


And about the EP4000; 600W @ 20hz sounds pretty good!!... If that is correct then the 3000 model will output around 378W @ 20hz; quite low! if compared with the EP4000 then the 6000 model will output around 1300W @ 20hz which sounds pretty awesome. I believe I will get the 6000 model; has two fans this model!!.. Lets hope the fans are not too noisy.
 

·
Bass Enabler
Joined
·
21,719 Posts
It's hard to say for sure if those specs aren't accurate. You say you may be the first to get that particular sub? That just makes it even more tough to give you accurate estimates. From the specs listed in this thread, it isn't a very good HT sub imo.


There are several low cost alternatives if you feel like moving on to another driver. Let us know and good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian
It's hard to say for sure if those specs aren't accurate. You say you may be the first to get that particular sub? That just makes it even more tough to give you accurate estimates. From the specs listed in this thread, it isn't a very good HT sub imo.


There are several low cost alternatives if you feel like moving on to another driver. Let us know and good luck!
Which other 15" sub drivers you recommend on the $200-$200 range? I already emailed PSI to see if parameters are correct. Also I asked if I can returned the sub and get Platform 2 which has better parameters. Here they are for Platform 2.


Revc = 3.4 ohms

Fms = 25.8 Hz

Qes = 0.62

Qms = 2.97

Qts = 0.51

Sd = 823cm^2

Vas = 120.3 L

BL = 15.5

Mms = 290.3 g

Xmax = 56mm total

Usable Excursion = 3" total

Displacement in enclosure - .16 ft^3

Weight - 38 lbs
 

·
Bass Enabler
Joined
·
21,719 Posts
Now that's more like it. This one does pretty good in a 2.5-3cuft sealed cab with up to 2000w. You could go quite a bit larger for a naturally lower Qtc but you will reduce mechanical power handling to around 1000w or less.



Go with that one.



As for affordable HT drivers... Dayton DVC15, Ref15HF and the Titanic mk3 are all good choices for affordable 15 inchers. You can find those all on www.partsexpress.com



Here is a link to Dayton's 15's on their site: http://www.parts-express.com/wizards...omo=&srchAttr=
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,433 Posts
The platform 2 uses a motor similar to the TC-9. I was drooling at the PSI shop when I saw 1/2 pallet of them.


You can also ask for an even lower Qts like down around the Soundsplinter level http://www.soundsplinter.com/rlp15_s...formation.html . When I had them build me a custom sub I wanted it to have a low Qts (close to .3 like my TC-3000), low Fs and work in a small, sealed box while being able to handle an EP-2500. They hit all 4 requiremet. I did provide the motor (Konaki) and the basket (Eclipse Ti). It was worth the expense. I've only tested it in a car but that was with about 2,000w.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Thanks for all replies. I got the Psi sub. Im not an expert but the quality construction of this sub is top notch. Package is excellent.


The sub is pretty heavy, I assume it weights around 35 pounds. I took my 25 pounds plate and sub is heavier.


Here are some pics.




 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Here is a comparison of the PSI 15" vs BIC PL200.


And I thought my PL200 sounds pretty good!! I cant imagine how this sub will perform! Im excited!!!



The surroundings of PL200 is foam. From PSI im preety sure is not foam; is like a mix of rubber and foam. Texture is soft and thick.


Which of the connectors is the positive; blue or black?


 
1 - 20 of 57 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top