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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've been playing around with the TH tool in the HornResponse program for awhile and I think I'm going to give a moderate sized TH a shot this spring and get my feet wet. I want to see what all the fuss is about and gauge the relative difficulty of getting one right. Plus it'll be fun to compare one to sealed and ported subs. I'll probably use a cheap, moderate power 10 or 12.


Has anybody built one, or thought about it? Anybody using HR, or Akabak to model them?
 

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I built one with a double fold last summer, using hornsrep to model the design.


Pics and details are at DIYaudio

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showt...&pagenumber=95


I think the sound quality is fantastic particularly in the sub bass (15-25hz).


However the output is a little bit over hyped if your going to use it for home theater. Most of the suitable drivers are x-max limited and so the output at low frequency is compromised.


If you going to build one that diggs deep, go for a 12" driver at min with 8+ mm of xmax.


But then again you mention building a little one so maybe my advise doesn't apply
.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yeah I've read that entire 100+ page monstrosity of a thread.
and all of the others. I think I'm going to do something medium or small sized just to try it out. Maybe something with just a good 30hz extension for music with a 10". Something inexpensive as I have too many drivers already but none of them are going to be useful in a TH.


From what I gather it gains you some sensitivity and output over a regular ported or sealed alignment but not as much as a front loaded or other true horn would. Basically it splits the difference and keeps the size down a bit. Tom has said that it can net up to 10db though, so perhaps us DIYer's designs just aren't fully refined yet.
 

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Sounds good... I'd imagine a 10 or 12 tuned to 30hz would make a nice sub for music.


If hornsrep shows a lot of HF hash above your crossover frequency, you'll want to either center the sub between your speakers or better yet, use some sort of DSP to minimize it.


Also you'll need some way to time delay your mains to take into account the path length of the tapped horn. I should add that this is just my experience, some other don't agree.

Quote:
From what I gather it gains you some sensitivity and output over a regular ported or sealed alignment but not as much as a front loaded or other true horn would. Basically it splits the difference and keeps the size down a bit. Tom has said that it can net up to 10db though, so perhaps us DIYer's designs just aren't fully refined yet.

Yup, that pretty much describes the situation. I have an 80hz front loaded horn and it's almost the same size as my tapped horn.


Be sure and post up your build and HR data.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I will. I need to start modeling different drivers and see if I can get something that looks decent in HR. It'd be nice if I can get a driver that also does well in standard ported and sealed boxes.


So far what I've got on what to look for in a driver are moderately high FS, slightly higher than the intended TH cut-off. This will put me in the 30-40hz area. Start with the throat around SD/1.5, mouth 2 to 3 times SD and go from there.
 

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I'm very interested in TH's as well.


There's a thread in the main Subwoofer forums that is currently discussing the "sound" of TH's versus Folded Horns. Tom Danley chimes in at the bottom of page 3 if you're interested.


I'm still on the fence between a TH and Folded Horn. I'm caught between a simple TH and more complicated Bill FitzMaurice Tuba.


As I mentioned in that thread. I've got the ultra low frequencies covered by a 13 cu foot LLT. What the LLT really lacks is great mid-subbass (40 - 90hz) which I believe a higher tuned horn would be perfect for.
 

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i had an idea about a hybrid 2-way regular/tapped horn


two different drivers in 2 different locations in the same horn being fed two different signals


the problem would be with keeping the driver at the end from getting ripped to shreds by the air pressure there. towards that end you can set up a helmholtz resonator ( tuned port ) there tuned to same frequency as the horn to provide back pressure behind the cones to cancel out the pressure in front.


well ... to really know if it would work somebody has to build it ... i can't model the interaction between the drivers too accurately in my head
 

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"Something inexpensive as I have too many drivers already but none of them are going to be useful in a TH. "


Perhaps more than you want, but how about the 12" Eminence for TD's LAB sub.
 

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Hey Ricci,


So what's the latest on this? Have you made any progress on a TH project?


After reading the positive reviews of the TH50 in the GTG thread I've started reading up on tapped horns (I'm only up to page 20 of ~160 of the "Collaborative Tapped horn project"). A quick search here brought up this thread so I thought I'd check if there's any news or if you just dropped the project.
 

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While not a tapped horn, you can also vent the rear chamber on a conventional horn to get a bit more oomph below where the horn rolls off. Or you can eq it a bit, adding some boost on a basshorn with a sealed rear chamber for the driver.


Just other things to think about. For a really small tapped horn, the tangband midbass underhung driver they are selling at PE models well according to Mike Bentz.
 

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I'm also interested in your progress. I really like the long narrow subs JLH has. I've been toying with building one with the two AE 12s I have here. Then putting it behind the couch pointing into a corner to see how it does. But I have just begun reading on a folded horn. I'm not even sure if my plan will work or how to use hornresp yet
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I haven't given up. Actually hearing the TH50 has renewed my interest in this project. I'm still in the planning stage at this point but I will get to this. I may do something a bit more "ambitious" than originally planned. Don't wait for me, cut up some wood and see what happens.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci /forum/post/16361568


I haven't given up. Actually hearing the TH50 has renewed my interest in this project. I'm still in the planning stage at this point but I will get to this. I may do something a bit more "ambitious" than originally planned. Don't wait for me, cut up some wood and see what happens.

Soon hopefully.. playing with Hornresp and reading howtos trying to get a grasp on how to design these beasts.
 

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hehe...i got the sense that the th50's piqued an interest, or perhaps an addiction, in you ricci.


anybody have info on the th50 design? it would be instructive to see the innards. i haven't been able to find anything, anywhere.


also, when placing something like lab horns or tapped horns such as the th50 in a home-sized room, does anybody know if there are any strange effects that make them undesirable?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci /forum/post/15564079


I've been playing around with the TH tool in the HornResponse program for awhile and I think I'm going to give a moderate sized TH a shot this spring and get my feet wet. I want to see what all the fuss is about and gauge the relative difficulty of getting one right. Plus it'll be fun to compare one to sealed and ported subs. I'll probably use a cheap, moderate power 10 or 12.


Has anybody built one, or thought about it? Anybody using HR, or Akabak to model them?

one of the reasons i got banned from DiyAudio is talkign sh1t about tapped horns ...


well since then i thought about it some more and - it does make some sort of sense that tapped horn thing. not that i would ever use one but you can go ahead and test it out.


it's basically a horn optimized for relatively narrowband performance in a relatively simple to construct enclosure ( compared to a real horn )


it will probably sound like CRAP but the bang for the buck should be decent. may be a good option for home theater. useless for audiophile purposes.


its probably suitable for more or less same applications as a bandpass box ...


of course this is all just theoretically ...


in fact maybe DSP will be able to overcome its inherent crappiness and you will be left with clean SPL. who knows. try it.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasyachkin /forum/post/16362357


one of the reasons i got banned from DiyAudio is talkign sh1t about tapped horns ...

shocker.

Quote:
it's basically a horn optimized for relatively narrowband performance in a relatively simple to construct enclosure ( compared to a real horn )

incorrect.

Quote:
it will probably sound like CRAP but the bang for the buck should be decent. may be a good option for home theater. useless for audiophile purposes.

incorrect.

Quote:
its probably suitable for more or less same applications as a bandpass box ...

incorrect.

Quote:
of course this is all just theoretically ...

incorrect.

Quote:
...its inherent crappiness...

incorrect.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Looks like I'll skip the small 10 or 12" version and go straight to something big and dumb involving a 15" or 18". Out of the drivers I currently have (XXX,SDX, LMS) the LMS looks like it might be most useable in a TH. I have further modeling to do and I'm going to look at other designs than the TH too, just to see. I do have one that doesn't look too bad. May still buy a better suited driver for this sort of thing. Don't know yet. I'd rather use a driver that I'm already very familiar with so I can tell exactly what the enclosure is doing better.
 

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I saw your posts over at Tapped Horn haven--don't wuss out on us. You are our only hope for a 24' long horn utilizing an 18" LMS. We rely on you to make our bass dreams come true.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatawan /forum/post/16416243


I saw your posts over at Tapped Horn haven--don't wuss out on us. You are our only hope for a 24' long horn utilizing an 18" LMS. We rely on you to make our bass dreams come true.

LOL! You wussed out on your 15" build! Yeah I saw your posts too. What...500L horn in the living room too big for yah?
 
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