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Discussion Starter #1
Hello!

Im new at this forum and my English is not perfect so i'm apologize for my mistakes. I can't find answers at forums with my language so I came for help to you guys.

So from the begging: my setup for now is made from speakers and AV which I have at my family home and I use it now in my new flat, so:
Front: Mission M73i
Center: Mission M5C
Surrounds: Canton GL260
Subwoofer: Magnat Sub 200A
A/V: Sony STR-DB830
TV: Philips 70PUS6704
Connection: Optical Cable
Source: MiBox 4K and PS4

My 5.1 setup is looking like in this picture:
rozstaw.png

By diagonal line to front speaker I have about 3,5m, to surround speaker I have about 1.5m. Front speakers are floorstand, and the tweeters are below the head level becouse Missions had tweeter below a midbass speaker, the surround hang on the wall about 60cm above the head, directed down to the head.

Is this configuration a proper for surround experience? Will front height speakers make a difference with surround sound?

Next question: my AV have only a manual dB and balance settings - how can I configure it for best experience? I used a Apple Watch and iPhone as dB Meter but it isnt accurate enought I think. (it gives my to add +2dB to center and rear channel). Next configuration is a distance to every channel so I've just simply measure it by measure tape, but maybe for this config is meter to for example add distance to rear channel?

And the last question: I wanna update a receiver to some that accept HDCP 2.2 to have a LPCM 5.1 sound from PS4 and DD+ sound from MiBox (Netflix, MPV's). I wanna used one becouse its cheaper - what models I have to looking for?

thanks for any replays :)
 

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Hi

Where is the subwoofer located in your diagram?
Your layout is otherwise very good for 5.1. It could improve if all tweeters are at ear level, but not urgent.

Your experience will improve with a new AV receiver. The features you should look for are:
HDMI inputs with HDCP 2.2 + HDMI 2.0b for 4K HDR video. You want HDR10, HLG and Dolby Vision support.
Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD, DTS Master Audio
You may need to research firmware upgrades, since some features may have been added, but not updated on the product page.

If it has 7 channels or more, you may want Atmos and DTS:X for immersive sound if you'll consider overhead speakers.
If you won't use Atmos, height speakers will not add much.
Good room correction capabilities, which will automatically set speaker levels and distances. You won't have to do it manually.
For room correction, for the same cost, in my opinion Denon/Marantz > Yamaha = Pioneer > Onkyo > Sony

So from the begging: my setup for now is made from speakers and AV which I have at my family home and I use it now in my new flat, so:
Subwoofer: Magnat Sub 200A
A/V: Sony STR-DB830

Next question: my AV have only a manual dB and balance settings - how can I configure it for best experience?
And the last question: I wanna update a receiver to some that accept HDCP 2.2 to have a LPCM 5.1 sound from PS4 and DD+ sound from MiBox (Netflix, MPV's). I wanna used one becouse its cheaper - what models I have to looking for?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Subwoofer is located between RTV cabinet and right front speaker.

In my front Mission I will have to rise it by 40cm to have tweeters on ear level, so I tilt them that they are looking up. 40cm is a lot and I dont know what can I use.

I've raised surrounded speakers from ear level, becouse when I watched not alone, then head of another person blocked one of rear channels and it sounds weard. When those speakers are higher - surrounds effect of for example airplanes sounds nice, but for example when bullet scale bounces of the ground sounds a little bit too high but with 5.1 only its hard to make it better :D

Today I borrowed Denon AVR-2113 from my friends and connected it to my setup and im surprised with results. It doesnt support DD+, 4K - I have to connect it by optical cable so I have only DD. I configured it by Audyssey MultEQ microphone and surround effects are much better than from my Sony :O Sound is much clearer, balanced and bass seems to be controled nice - with Sony bass was everywhere.

So I need to look for 4K AVR. What about used Pioneer SC-LX501 for 320EURO?
 

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For the subwoofer, is the drawing to scale? Is the sub the thick black box, or the white box, or the combination?
I ask because it would probably be more effective placed in the top right corner or bottom right corner behind the curved section of the seating area. Boundary reinforcement from the corner could raise performance.

I think tilting the speakers towards the listener should be effective. It has to be less expensive and look better than getting a platform!

For the surround channels, you may want to try aiming them behind the main listening position instead of straight at it. Wide dispersion from the speaker will bounce off the walls and other people will hear it.
It's not meant to be very localized for surround sound. Experiment with different angles and see what works best. You could even turn them a little past 90 degrees and intentionally fire them into the wall to bounce the sound.
It's easy to experiment, so why not?

Where are you located, and what's a good source for prices? I'm not sure how to price that Pioneer SC-LX501 AVR against others.
The room correction is "basic" MCACC, and according to the support page, it supports Dolby Vision, but not HLG. You at least want those 2.
I think you should focus on the best room correction you can get. As you've already seen, Audyssey MultiEQ is good, and better than most of what others offer.

Subwoofer is located between RTV cabinet and right front speaker.
In my front Mission I will have to rise it by 40cm to have tweeters on ear level, so I tilt them that they are looking up. 40cm is a lot and I dont know what can I use.
I've raised surrounded speakers from ear level, becouse when I watched not alone, then head of another person blocked one of rear channels and it sounds weard.

Today I borrowed Denon AVR-2113 from my friends and connected it to my setup and im surprised with results. It doesnt support DD+, 4K - I have to connect it by optical cable so I have only DD. I configured it by Audyssey MultEQ microphone and surround effects are much better than from my Sony :O Sound is much clearer, balanced and bass seems to be controled nice - with Sony bass was everywhere.

So I need to look for 4K AVR. What about used Pioneer SC-LX501 for 320EURO?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I've attached a photos of speakers - subwoofer needs to be at front - I dont have a cables for it behind a sofa. Now, as you can see I have tilted fronts and a center a little bit. I will try with tilting surround speakears but I've done it with Sony Amplifier at ear level and there was only a very little difference, hardly to hear for me.

Im from Poland, the best site with used stuff allegro.pl (320EUR is about 1300PLN), but you can also show me offers from amazon.de/fr/es etc.
IMG_1428.jpg
IMG_1427.jpg
 

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The Denon AVR-X1500H shows pretty low prices in amazon.fr in Amazon Warehouse. It costs more on Spain and Poland's Amazon site (actually it redirected amazon.pl to amazon.de and set language to Polish).
It has better room correction than the SC-LX501, and better support for 4K HDR formats, and seems to get regular firmware updates from Denon.

I see the tilt for the towers and that should work well. The surrounds are already mounted, so probably not worth changing since you tested already.
The subwoofer might play a bit more powerful in the front corner, trading places with the speaker. It can also go behind the couch with a wireless kit.
If it works fine now, no reason to change it.

I've attached a photos of speakers - subwoofer needs to be at front - I dont have a cables for it behind a sofa. Now, as you can see I have tilted fronts and a center a little bit. I will try with tilting surround speakears but I've done it with Sony Amplifier at ear level and there was only a very little difference, hardly to hear for me.

Im from Poland, the best site with used stuff allegro.pl (320EUR is about 1300PLN), but you can also show me offers from amazon.de/fr/es etc.
View attachment 2753964
View attachment 2753966
 

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Discussion Starter #7
And how about Yamaha RX-V383 for about 150EUR? I want to spend very max 300EUR - lower is better of course.
 

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The RX-V383 supports all the current 4K HDR standards (HDR10, HLG, Dolby Vision) but has the most basic YPAO room correction. However that is much better than what the Sony Sony STR-DB830 offered.
Denons with Audyssey MultEQ are better than YPAO and MultEQ XT is even better than that, but you probably can't find it at that price.
The RX-V383 seems like a good deal at that price.

And how about Yamaha RX-V383 for about 150EUR? I want to spend very max 300EUR - lower is better of course.
 

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I think that the 2EQ or whatever is in the X550BT is worse than basic YPAO for room correction. The Yamaha might be better.
Audyssey MultEQ on the other Denon S-Series is an improvement and the best "basic" room correction. MultEQ XT on X-Series 1000/2000 is a step up and you might find one.
MultEQ XT32 won't be available in this price range but is much better.

Ive found Denon X550bt for 180Eur but also have only a standard calibration.
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Thank you a lot - so I will try to find something with MultEQ XT as those Denon AVR-2113 have. I found now a used Denon X1200W for 200Euro - it looks like it is just a upgraded AVR-2113 with full 4K support (with 2018 update it have HLG and Dolby Vision support) and found also a X1500H with 24m warranty from shop display for 290EUR. What do you think what is a better deal?
 

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2015 X1200W vs 2018 X1500H:
2 years of warranty (why won't it be sold as new w/3 yrs)?
Dual-band wifi, Heos, Airplay2, Bluetooth v3
HDMI 2.0b
Better DAC (brought down from X4000 series in prior years)
Better 4K signal passthrough (gain ability for "Enhanced" vs Standard 4K, ability to display volume and GUI on 4K)
Ability to change pass-through while in standby isntead of fixed

Worth 90EUR?

Thank you a lot - so I will try to find something with MultEQ XT as those Denon AVR-2113 have. I found now a used Denon X1200W for 200Euro - it looks like it is just a upgraded AVR-2113 with full 4K support (with 2018 update it have HLG and Dolby Vision support) and found also a X1500H with 24m warranty from shop display for 290EUR. What do you think what is a better deal?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
X1500H was sold out :( Now I have to choose between used Denon X1200W vs used Pioneer VSX-1131. Which will be better for same price?
 

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https://www.zkelectronics.com/compare/denon-avr-x1200w/uk/pioneer-vsx-1131/north-america/
Tough call. Pioneer is 2 years newer with a couple of extra features, while Denon has Audyssey XT (vs "basic" MCACC on the Pioneer).
When using this comparison site, try to pick the region that you think applies to you. There are some differences between the US and UK models of the Denon, for example.
Also, make sure to check firmware updates for both.
Denon has gained Dolby Vision and HLG, for example, but is listed as lacking it in the comparison.
Pioneer has picked up support for the Deezer streaming service.

If the features are close, I lean towards Denon.
The information available on this site is better for Denon. Also, IMHO, Denon has done a very good job of providing firmware updates for older receivers.

X1500H was sold out :( Now I have to choose between used Denon X1200W vs used Pioneer VSX-1131. Which will be better for same price?
 

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Discussion Starter #15
So I bought used Denon X1200W - 4y old with full accesoriess, looking nearly like new for 200EUR. I just connected it and have no time to test precisely but Ive made Audyssey calibration and it Sounds very simillar to AVR-2113. When comin DD+ for example the best option is ,,Pure auto”, ,,Natural X DTS” or ,,Dolby Surround”?

Also at AVR-2113 after Audyssey i can see a EQ GRAPH for every speaker - with X1200W there is No option like that.
 

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I'm not familiar enough with the AVR-2113 to know what the graphic EQ options are. You may want to consider the Audyssey MultEQ editor app:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/2806249-multeq-editor-new-app-denon-marantz-av-receivers-pre-pros.html

And there's at least one (I think there's more) app made by Forum members to further modify what Audyssey does. Here's the one I can remember:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/3006886-announcing-ratbuddyssey-tool-tweaking-audyssey-multeq-app-files.html

I haven't used any of them, so I can't comment.

So I bought used Denon X1200W - 4y old with full accesoriess, looking nearly like new for 200EUR. I just connected it and have no time to test precisely but Ive made Audyssey calibration and it Sounds very simillar to AVR-2113. When comin DD+ for example the best option is ,,Pure auto”, ,,Natural X DTS” or ,,Dolby Surround”?

Also at AVR-2113 after Audyssey i can see a EQ GRAPH for every speaker - with X1200W there is No option like that.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
X1200W unfortunently doesnt support MultEQ App, but I saw at manual I can copy Audyssey EQ to Manual EQ - I need to check that, but I belive Audyssey that it does good job - for sure its better than my ear - I just wanna saw it for curiosity.

Im think about adding 2 speakers becouse now I have 5.1, and that AVR is 7.1 so it's a shame not to use it. I have a pair of small speakers Acron 210C so I will try to use it like and Atmos Enabled Front (point for ceiling) or maybe as front height - will see what will give me best results.
 
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