[whovous]

Sorry I do not have many of the model numbers at hand here, but I am not sure they matter for this question.


Most of my system is about three years old, I think. I have a Denon 7.1 receiver (about 90 wpc, not many bells or whistles other than Audyssey), Polk speakers (VM30 fronts, VM20 center, VM10 rears and MicroPro 1000 and 3000 subs), a 42" 1080i Panasonic Vieira plasma, a Tivo HD, an LG Blu-Ray and Comcast cable with most of the premium bells and whistles through a big-arsed Motorola box.


The problem is that the volume just seems to be getting lower all the time. There have been occasions where I was watching something and the volume just stepped down. Other times it is more subtle, but all too often I find myself pushing the volume all the way to 0db and wishing I had a whole lot more. The problem is the same if I am watching a Tivo recording, watching TV 'live' thru a Tivo tuner, and watching TV live through the Motorola STB. I almost never watch DVDs on this system, so cannot comment on whether the problem persists there as well.


My speakers are reasonably efficient, and I am not the sort of person who wants everything turned up to 11 a la Spinal Tap.


I do not remember exactly when or where I bought the Denon, but I am fairly sure it was open box, and I do not think I have any warranty to work with here.


Is there anything else to test here, or is it time to buy another box? I am perfectly happy if I am forced to upgrade my system, but I'd like to exhaust all the other possibilities first. Are there any tests to run or settings to fiddle with?


Advice, please.

 

[jdsmoothie]

You likely have the Denon 1910 or 790 each of which only has a 2 year warranty, so yes, you're out of warranty. However, try resetting the microprocessor (p. 64) and see if that resolves the issue, noting that this will return all settings to factory defaults and require you to run AUTO SETUP again.

 

[whovous]

Many thainks for the reply. I would try the reset test without a moment's hesitation if I had the slightest clue where I hid the Audyssey setup microphone. I have seen it within the past six months or so....


Without it, I am reluctant to wipe all the Audyssey settings absent a high level of confidence it is going to work. Can you tell me what you think it will cure? The fact that the problem seems to get worse after it has been running for a while makes me suspicious of a microprocessor reset as a cure.


By the way, I tried a DVD a short while ago, and turning it all the way up to 0db is not as loud as I think it should be. I would expect turning something all the way up would lead to clipping, but this does not even sound close.

 

[jdsmoothie]

Well ... seems to me you have three options .... (1) do nothing and live with your issue, (2) do the reset with the hope it resolves the issue, or (3) buy a new AVR.

 

[htwaits]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death/0_50#post_22119159


Well ... seems to me you have three options .... (1) do nothing and live with your issue, (2) do the reset with the hope it resolves the issue, or (3) buy a new AVR.

All those options are valid. I'd like to add one more if whovous has the energy for it.


Strip your setup down to one source. I would use the LG Blu-ray player. You don't mention connections, but I'm suggesting that you connect the player to your AVR with HDMI. Double check your settings for audio in the receiver and in the BD player. Keep a record of the settings that you're using, and try a cd, a DVD, and a Blu-ray movie and record the volume setting that you need to hear each one at your normal level. Also record what the BD player thinks it's outputting, and what the Denon thinks it's receiving. Post all those results.

Go to BATPIG'S

"DENON-TO-ENGLISH DICTIONARY"

SETUP GUIDE AND FAQ to double check that your Denon settings are right.


If you do the above, and your settings prove to be correct, and you still are not getting desirable volume, follow jdsmoothie's advise.

 

[KidHorn]

Since the problem gets worse as the unit heats up, you probably have a circuit that loses some contact as the unit expands. Not enough to open, just enough to increase electrical resistance. If my theory is correct, you may be able to alleviate the problem by keeping the unit cooler. Maybe put it in a more open spot like on top of a cabinet instead of inside it. You can also try opening the unit up and see if see you anything that looks loose and tightening it. Make sure the unit is unplugged before opening it.

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22119159


Well ... seems to me you have three options .... (1) do nothing and live with your issue, (2) do the reset with the hope it resolves the issue, or (3) buy a new AVR.

Hey jdsmoothie, I have a Denon AVR 4806 which has intermittent distortion that comes from all of the speakers and then goes away as quick as it came...I unhooked everything and plugged it into a whole nother system with the same results....After putting it back in the original system it worked for a while (only happened a couple of times) and then the problem came back with more regularity. What's weird was it would be fine for a long period of time and then act up again.


I don't think it is an external wiring problem and if you think resetting the microprocessor would help? Of course it's worth a blind try, but I'm curious if you think this symptom is is something resetting the processor could alleviate? Thanks.

 

[jdsmoothie]

As resetting the microprocessor returns all settings to their factory defaults, it's generally the last option to consider but often does cure many ills.

 

[Zen Traveler]

Thanks...I've been hangin' out here a while and it seems like my last option and then I need to consider sending it in.

 

[whovous]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22119159


Well ... seems to me you have three options .... (1) do nothing and live with your issue, (2) do the reset with the hope it resolves the issue, or (3) buy a new AVR.

Option #2 is the obvious one to try first, but for the fact that I know it will create a new problem when it wipes out all of my Audyssey settings. As I think I mentioned before, I have no idea where I hid my setup microphone. I can copy down the distance and volume settings, but I cannot recreate any of the filters. I am pretty sure I am going to be unhappy with that.


So, if I try Option #2, there are two more possibilities. FIrst, the problem remains, and perhaps it is time to buy new toys. I can most certainly live with that! But second, the problem goes away. Then I need to figure out where to get a replacement microphone (from Denon, no doubt, or perhaps eBay) and run Auto Setup again.


Now, here is the rub. Since I have no real idea what causes the problem in the first place, how do I know that running Auto Setup won't just restore whatever it was that caused the problem in the first place?

 

[jdsmoothie]

^^

You seem to be making this harder than it really is. If you're considering buying a new AVR then you might as well reset the microprocessor first to see if that resolves the issue. If it doesn't, you're off to buy a new AVR, while if it does, you just saved yourself at least $500.

However, I would agree that it doesn't make any sense to do the reset until you can either find the mic or purchase a new mic. You can purchase a DM-A409 mic on eBay or from one of Denon's authorized parts distributors for roughly the same price.

 

[whovous]



Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22119209


All those options are valid. I'd like to add one more if whovous has the energy for it.

Strip your setup down to one source. I would use the LG Blu-ray player. You don't mention connections, but I'm suggesting that you connect the player to your AVR with HDMI. Double check your settings for audio in the receiver and in the BD player. Keep a record of the settings that you're using, and try a cd, a DVD, and a Blu-ray movie and record the volume setting that you need to hear each one at your normal level. Also record what the BD player thinks it's outputting, and what the Denon thinks it's receiving. Post all those results.

Go to BATPIG'S

"DENON-TO-ENGLISH DICTIONARY"

SETUP GUIDE AND FAQ to double check that your Denon settings are right.

If you do the above, and your settings prove to be correct, and you still are not getting desirable volume, follow jdsmoothie's advise.

That site is very helpful, thank you. Thanks also to JDsmoothie for the links in your sig.


Let me add a few more facts:

1. I can confirm that the model is indeed the AVR-1910.

2. All devices are connected via HDMI and only HDMI.

3. Everything is controlled with a Harmony Remote (a One, I think).

4. After checking batpig, I am fairly confident that all of my settings are correct. This system worked fine with this settings for quite a while without this intermittent volume problem. To me, that seems to rule out a settings problem.


Now, all that said, can you tell me what you are looking for with these tests? If I use different technologies (DD, DVD and BD) in the same device, I will presumably start with different reference levels and wind up with different volume settings for each one.


But just as important, the volume settings I wind up with will depend on whether or not my intermittent volume problem is happening or not. So, I am trying to figure out just what we can learn from this test. I really appreciate the help, but I also really want to understand what I am doing here, and what I can accomplish with a test.


Let me throw in something that happened last night that strikes me as relevant. Most of what I watch on this TV is via recording premium HD channels on the Tivo HD. Yesterday, the system was on for much of the day as others watched EuroCup matches. I watched The Borgias on Tivo, and the volume problem was present, although it was not as bad as it is sometimes. I did not find myself turning it to 0, at least, but it seemed like turning it all the way up would not have been deafening. After watching this Showtime recording, I watched a recording of the The HMO series, Girls. the volume was MUCH higher, and I was able to listen to it in formerly "normal" -15 to -12 range. I tried turning it all the way up, but by -3 it was distorting like I think it should when turned up too far.


This problem has come and gone at various times with various sources. Last night seems to suggest that maybe Showtime and HBO have different volume levels. Still, the basic fact that i can sometimes go to 0 without distortion or even sounding too loud makes me think it is something more than that.


Am I just making this more confusing?

 

[whovous]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22124145


^^

You seem to be making this harder than it really is. If you're considering buying a new AVR then you might as well reset the microprocessor first to see if that resolves the issue. If it doesn't, you're off to buy a new AVR, while if it does, you just saved yourself at least $500.

However, I would agree that it doesn't make any sense to do the reset until you can either find the mic or purchase a new mic. You can purchase a DM-A409 mic on eBay or from one of Denon's authorized parts distributors for roughly the same price.

Today is a day off, and will be spent in part searching for the freaking mic. My ability to lose these things (I also periodically misplace the mics for my Yamaha receiver - currently located- and my MicroPro subwoofer - currently missing) absolutely astounds me. I have done it many times. i am confident that upon receipt off a replacement it will be a matter of mere minutes before I literally trip over the one that is now missing. And within a week, they will both be missing!

 

[Wolowizard]



Quote:
Originally Posted by whovous  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22118137


The problem is that the volume just seems to be getting lower all the time. There have been occasions where I was watching something and the volume just stepped down. Other times it is more subtle, but all too often I find myself pushing the volume all the way to 0db and wishing I had a whole lot more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by whovous  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22119134


The fact that the problem seems to get worse after it has been running for a while makes me suspicious of a microprocessor reset as a cure.

Just out of curiousity, as everyone else might be clear on this:

• Did everything work the way you expected three'ish years ago when you got it?
• You indicate that it loses volume while you're listening to it. Has it also lost volume over time (weeks/months) or does it always start out as loud as it used to and only decline while you listen?
• How long ago did this behavior start?

 

[whovous]



Quote:
Originally Posted by KidHorn  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22120568


Since the problem gets worse as the unit heats up, you probably have a circuit that loses some contact as the unit expands. Not enough to open, just enough to increase electrical resistance. If my theory is correct, you may be able to alleviate the problem by keeping the unit cooler. Maybe put it in a more open spot like on top of a cabinet instead of inside it. You can also try opening the unit up and see if see you anything that looks loose and tightening it. Make sure the unit is unplugged before opening it.

The receiver is on an open shelf, so it is as cool as I can make it without a fan. The intermittent nature of the problem makes me suspect you are right about the problem. Removing the top to poke around inside is beyond my skill set, I fear. If this is not a settings issue (and my guess is that it is not) my choices are to have a professional check this out or to buy new toys. Diagnosing intermittent problems is something every professional loves, I am sure!

 

[JChin]

Hi whovous, here is a suggestion ... power off receiver, unplug everything from receiver including the power cord, wait about 30 minutes, remove receiver cover and use compressed air and clean the internal.

 

[whovous]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolowizard  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22124202


Just out of curiousity, as everyone else might be clear on this:

• Did everything work the way you expected three'ish years ago when you got it?
• You indicate that it loses volume while you're listening to it. Has it also lost volume over time (weeks/months) or does it always start out as loud as it used to and only decline while you listen?
• How long ago did this behavior start?

1. Yes.

2. I am not entirely sure, as I am often not the one to turn it on, and I am not always paying attention. Yesterday it was on for hours before I watched it, and the problem was there with one Tivo HD recording (from Showtime) but not there from another Tivo HD recording (from HBO) that I viewed immediately thereafter.

3. Several months ago. At first I thought it was just a problem with Glee, where the nature of the sound seems to change dramatically in some of the production numbers. But it seems more noticeable recently.

 

[whovous]



Quote:
Originally Posted by JChin  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22124213


Hi whovous, here is a suggestion ... power off receiver, unplug everything from receiver including the power cord, wait about 30 minutes, remove receiver cover and use compressed air and clean the internal.

Compressed air just may be within my skill set!

 

[Wolowizard]



Quote:
Originally Posted by whovous  /t/1414893/is-my-denon-avr-near-death#post_22124173


This system worked fine with this settings for quite a while without this intermittent volume problem. To me, that seems to rule out a settings problem.


But just as important, the volume settings I wind up with will depend on whether or not my intermittent volume problem is happening or not.


Most of what I watch on this TV is via recording premium HD channels on the Tivo HD. Yesterday, the system was on for much of the day as others watched EuroCup matches. I watched The Borgias on Tivo, and the volume problem was present, although it was not as bad as it is sometimes. I did not find myself turning it to 0, at least, but it seemed like turning it all the way up would not have been deafening. After watching this Showtime recording, I watched a recording of the The HMO series, Girls. the volume was MUCH higher, and I was able to listen to it in formerly "normal" -15 to -12 range. I tried turning it all the way up, but by -3 it was distorting like I think it should when turned up too far.


This problem has come and gone at various times with various sources. Last night seems to suggest that maybe Showtime and HBO have different volume levels. Still, the basic fact that i can sometimes go to 0 without distortion or even sounding too loud makes me think it is something more than that.

Am I just making this more confusing?

Ah. Well, this answered most of my questions. Yes, there can be significant volume differences based on the source. I've found that some of my movie channels I have to jack way up -10 or more. And then if I switch to ESPN or something I have to quickly turn it back down to -20 or less. So that much is fairly typical, for me at least. To really test stuff like this, it's best to use a consistent source (hence people recommending a cd, dvd, etc and preferably the same one that you're familiar with each time.)


As for it happening while you're listening, having it on all day seems like a potential issue. If you turn it off for a while does it go back to normal operation?

 

[aaronwt]



Try putting a small silent fan on top of it to help with airflow. I've been using one on top of my Denon receivers for years. First with a 3806 and currently with a 3808.

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