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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
In considering SB vs Tivo, the real question for me is wether to share my content between boxes. While I haven't got a ReplayTV so yet, I am interested in this possibility.


One thing which has finally dawned on me is that their new monthly subscription model would allow them to offer deep discounts for multi-box homes. This seems to make a lot of sense as it would highlight the true advantage I see in the ReplayTV boxes.


Has anyone heard rumblings that this is in the offing?


Is there an economic (yet legal) way of sharing the guides between multiple boxes now?
 

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NO.
 

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There is no 'monthly subscription model', right now it's a flat $250 lifetime service fee.


There are no discounts for multiple boxes. Maybe a retailer will cut you a deal if you buy more than say 5 units... but the $250 is the same per box.


If you mean share program guide data so one box can be unsubscribed, no.
 

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We do seem to be settling into the language of 'subscription' but RPTV are adamant that it's an *activation* fee to keep the unit functional beyond the ten day grace period, not a subscription. It's not a question of subscribing to an EPG service. When I emailed RPTV asking about this, the reply was:


'The service is not optional and the unit will not be able to be used after the 10 day grace period'


i.e. if you do not pay the $250 activation fee you will have a very expensive doorstop. When I asked them for more details 'surely you will at least be able to manually record, or watch shows streamed around the home, even without paying the $250 activation?' they referred all further questions to their legal department!


My understanding is that without a subscription, Tivo (pardon my language) becomes 'nagware' - you can still use it, all features except the EPG, but it nags you to subscribe every time. The RPTV 45XX, without a 'subscription' (actually an activation 'fee') will not function in any way. Can anyone confirm either of these statements?


Mike
 

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No one has had their 4500 for > 10 days yet, so no one (including RandyL712) knows for sure what will happen after the grace period. As JTL pointed out in another thread on this topic :
Quote:
disabling features: The current software can enable/disable five different things separately: ChannelGuide, ReplayGuide, Zones, View, Record. "View" is the ability to watch live TV; the others should be obvious. Now, which of these *will* be disabled (and what new sw changes there'll be), good question...
We don't know yet which of these 5 features will be disabled after the grace period.
 

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4.3.0 180 adds "Menu" to the list -- I'd assume that's the main menu, but haven't verified.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by abaduck
We do seem to be settling into the language of 'subscription' but RPTV are adamant that it's an *activation* fee to keep the unit functional beyond the ten day grace period, not a subscription. It's not a question of subscribing to an EPG service. When I emailed RPTV asking about this, the reply was:


'The service is not optional and the unit will not be able to be used after the 10 day grace period'

My understanding is that without a subscription, Tivo (pardon my language) becomes 'nagware' - you can still use it, all features except the EPG, but it nags you to subscribe every time. The RPTV 45XX, without a 'subscription' (actually an activation 'fee') will not function in any way. Can anyone confirm either of these statements?


Mike
I received my 4504 last Monday. There was a weird limbo time before the 10day grace period kicked in. During that time, the unit was essentially non functional. I could not view the menu, library, I could view cable through it but it would not let me even use the remote to change channels. Almost every action on the remote lead to the popup that grace has expired, you must activate box. Then an hour or two later, the grace period kicked in and I was able to begin using.

->Dave
 

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Stand alone Series I TiVo receivers can be used as DVRs without a subscription. DirecTiVo receivers can not be. I do not know about Series II boxes in this regard.


/carmi
 

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OK looks as though I was correct... 45XX becomes a doorstop if you don't 'subscribe', with most Tivos you can still use the thing in manual mode if you don't subscribe, you just loose the EPG - which is fair enough.


I submit that this is pretty ****** conduct by RPTV: having paid $$$ for the 45XX hardware, you should be able to use it manually without subscription/activation. Why in hell should I 'subscribe' to a service (the EPG) I don't want and can't use? (Scenario is using a 45XX in bedroom purely to watch material streamed over the network from the 'main' 4000 unit in living room - the bedroom doesn't even have a cable hookup!).


I submit that hacking this feature would be moral and ethical. Who's up for hacking the activation 'feature'? NOT to steal service, but to allow folks to use the hardware they already OWN?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by abaduck
OK looks as though I was correct... 45XX becomes a doorstop if you don't 'subscribe', with most Tivos you can still use the thing in manual mode if you don't subscribe, you just loose the EPG - which is fair enough.
Only works with the stand alone TiVo units (Series I and maybe series II).

Quote:
I submit that this is pretty ****** conduct by RPTV: having paid $$$ for the 45XX hardware, you should be able to use it manually without subscription/activation. Why in hell should I 'subscribe' to a service (the EPG) I don't want and can't use? (Scenario is using a 45XX in bedroom purely to watch material streamed over the network from the 'main' 4000 unit in living room - the bedroom doesn't even have a cable hookup!).
While if the product is around for a while, they may offer a receive only box, they do not currently offer such an animal. They have made decisions on how much to charge for the product based on estimates of sales and other things. Their business model expects $250 in cash for every unit (and maybe later subscription fees for those monthly boxes when that is offered as an option). They need to amortize their R&D and service costs over all receivers they expect to produce and sell.

Quote:
I submit that hacking this feature would be moral and ethical. Who's up for hacking the activation 'feature'? NOT to steal service, but to allow folks to use the hardware they already OWN?
Sonic Blue used to sell you a box for $699. Now they sell you an equivalent box for $449 to a retailer and $250 to them directly. They tell you up front that this is what these units cost. They do not say, that service is optional, just that you now have to split your payments. It is not as if they sold you a receiver and then said:


"Oh, by the way, if you want this to work, you better leave $250 in small bills outside the post office at midnight."


You were informed up front of the situation.


You are stealing if you hack their hardware to make it work without paying them what they told you in advance it would cost, just as you are stealing if you hack an Xbox to activate the DVD player function without paying for it.


More importantly, if you want Sonic Blue to continue in this business, you need to make sure that they can get the revenue they budget on for each box that sell. Other wise they will just decide it is not worth it and get out of the market.


/carmi
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by abaduck
I submit that this is pretty ****** conduct by RPTV: having paid $$$ for the 45XX hardware, you should be able to use it manually without subscription/activation.
You paid $$$ for the unit, which is not the full cost. They are upfront saying the "activation" fee is extra. A box without "activation" is a doorstop. They are being very upfront about it, so I don't see anything wrong with it.


If you don't want to activate your box, don't spend your money on an expensive doorstop.


Robert
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by majortom
While if the product is around for a while, they may offer a receive only box, they do not currently offer such an animal.
I haven't seen one on the SB Web site but this could be an enhancement for their RioReceiver product.


The RioReceiver is designed to be a remote unit for their RioCentral CD/MP3 device. Perhaps they could modify it to also attach to a ReplayTV unit. That way you could have remote access to both devices using only a single unit!


=Dave=
 

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If I understood the thread Arjay pointed me at correctly, Tivos that were shipped with sw = 2.0 can't be.


That is, series II and, for the past year or so, new series I tivos have required a subscription to do manual records.
 
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